Hard Border on the island of Ireland Watch

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Eilis_R
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#1
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Due to the growing disaster Brexit appears to be as reported by the British media a, "hard Brexit," appears very likely. This would result in a physical border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. The Tory government is propped up by the DUP, and their main objective presently is ensuring a hard border occurs. Residing in Northern Ireland as an Irish citizen it causes concern due to the monumental and negative impact this development would cause to everyday life.
What are your views on the matter, the impact it would have and how likely it appears to be?
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bob072
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(Original post by Eilis_R)
Due to the growing disaster Brexit appears to be as reported by the British media a, "hard Brexit," appears very likely. This would result in a physical border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. The Tory government is propped up by the DUP, and their main objective presently is ensuring a hard border occurs. Residing in Northern Ireland as an Irish citizen it causes concern due to the monumental and negative impact this development would cause to everyday life.
What are your views on the matter, the impact it would have and how likely it appears to be?
There will and can be no physical border, people can carry their lives on as usual. What may happen is random checks on goods vehicles (as already occasionally happens not on the actual border line) and technology and cameras. The head of HMRC said this can be done.
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anarchism101
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Hard border is basically impossible - there are actually buildings that are part in Northern Ireland and part in the Republic - are we going to introduce checkpoints inside them?
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Doones
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(Original post by anarchism101)
Hard border is basically impossible - there are actually buildings that are part in Northern Ireland and part in the Republic - are we going to introduce checkpoints inside them?
There was a "hard" border during the Troubles.
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Eilis_R)
Due to the growing disaster Brexit appears to be as reported by the British media a, "hard Brexit," appears very likely. This would result in a physical border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland. The Tory government is propped up by the DUP, and their main objective presently is ensuring a hard border occurs. Residing in Northern Ireland as an Irish citizen it causes concern due to the monumental and negative impact this development would cause to everyday life.
What are your views on the matter, the impact it would have and how likely it appears to be?
Not sure if you are saying that the DUP support a hard border? If so, that's completely incorrect - the DUP are opposed to both a hard border and to a virtual border between Ireland and the UK, eg, customs checks at UK ports. Therefore the government are in a total bind, because, as you say, they rely on the DUP for survival but their hard Brexit plan/fallback position is unacceptable and would invalidate that survival. Worse still (from the crazed Tory perspective), the EU negotiators are totally aware of this and can therefore confidently reject all of the sillier proposals of the government, confident in the knowledge that at minimum, they will have to accept at least the Customs Union.

We are inevitably being pushed to a Norway/EFTA solution, which would be acceptable to both sides in Ireland, but not to the Rees-Mogg barmy army of nutters, weirdos, Russian money launderers and hedge fund spivs. C'est la vie.
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InnerTemple
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(Original post by Doonesbury)
There was a "hard" border during the Troubles.
Yeah, I think we’re trying to avoid going back to that time.
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Doones
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(Original post by InnerTemple)
Yeah, I think we’re trying to avoid going back to that time.
I know that, I'm just pointing out it's very much doable (at vast expense)
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bob072
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(Original post by Doonesbury)
I know that, I'm just pointing out it's very much doable (at vast expense)
It's not doable in any version of reality unless you once again seize people's land and create a buffer zone with military checkpoints.
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Janso
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And of course risk a return to the time of the men with the guns coming out to play not so nicely.
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Doones
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(Original post by bob072)
It's not doable in any version of reality unless you once again seize people's land and create a buffer zone with military checkpoints.
Well to be fair it just needs to restrict HGVs not IRAs.

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gjd800
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(Original post by Doonesbury)
Well to be fair it just needs to restrict HGVs not IRAs.

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That really made me laugh :laugh:
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mojojojo101
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(Original post by anarchism101)
Hard border is basically impossible - there are actually buildings that are part in Northern Ireland and part in the Republic - are we going to introduce checkpoints inside them?
Thats true of practically every land border in the world, mainly because they are drawn by people with little or no knowledge of the land they are carving up.

(Original post by Doonesbury)
Well to be fair it just needs to restrict HGVs not IRAs.

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Think you might have got that backwards...
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Doones
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#13
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(Original post by mojojojo101)



Think you might have got that backwards...
How so? The PIRA is no longer a thing. HGVs smuggling stuff could well be.

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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by Janso)
And of course risk a return to the time of the men with the guns coming out to play not so nicely.
Although I hate to agree with anything Rees-Mogg says, he's right that this interpretation of likely events is nonsense. Apart from anything else, the border would be being imposed by the Republic and not by the UK, a fundamental difference. There wouldn't be barbed wire, conning towers and helicopter patrols with machine gun-armed paratroops on standby.

Indeed, it's quite hard to imagine what form a 'hard' border would take run by Ireland. The picture must be something really quite casual, with poor enforcement on all the dozens of little lane crossings and some tediously run and loosely managed major crossing barriers. I think it's almost inevitable that even a hard border would be some variation of a soft border, albeit with more irritation for all concerned. Apart from any other consideration, Ireland simply lacks the money and personnel to run an iron curtain.
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the bear
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the Taoiseach has proposed a 4 lane barrier system:

i)
Spoiler:
Show
Something to declare


ii)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare


iii)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare at all


iv)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare at all at all
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Fullofsurprises
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(Original post by the bear)
the Taoiseach has proposed a 4 lane barrier system:

i)
Spoiler:
Show
Something to declare


ii)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare


iii)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare at all


iv)
Spoiler:
Show
Nothing to declare at all at all
Irish-ist!

Funny though for all that.
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Doones
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#17
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(Original post by the bear)
the Taoiseach has proposed a 4 lane barrier system:

i)
Spoiler:
Show

Something to declare


ii)
Spoiler:
Show

Nothing to declare


iii)
Spoiler:
Show

Nothing to declare at all


iv)
Spoiler:
Show

Nothing to declare at all at all
v)
Spoiler:
Show

Ah, go on!
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the bear
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#18
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(Original post by Doonesbury)
v)
Spoiler:
Show


Ah, go on!

http://www.lovethispic.com/uploaded_...-Delicious.jpg
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Trinculo
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#19
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There's already a hard border - it's called the sea.
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username3883544
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#20
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It would be a bad day for the island. So keeping in the customs union (or an equivalent) would avoid this.
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