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Do top universities bend the entry requirements and on what basis?

I'm doing IB, but I'm guessing that this can be applied with A level results too. Every 'good' computer science course requires HL maths at IB, yet I'm not allowed to do it due to being a few marks from a level 8. So when do these universities decide whether or not to lower the requirements and create a specific condition for an applicant?

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Uni requires maths.
Applicant doesn't have maths.
Uni doesn't give applicant an offer.

Only exception would possibly be in exceptional circumstances or as a contextual offer.
Reply 2
Original post by DarthRoar
Uni requires maths.
Applicant doesn't have maths.
Uni doesn't give applicant an offer.

Only exception would possibly be in exceptional circumstances or as a contextual offer.


I'm doing standard maths(best maths I can take up). But I also wanted to know on what basis do these universities offer a contextual offer. Is there some sort of consensus for most universities?
Original post by noname900
I'm doing standard maths(best maths I can take up). But I also wanted to know on what basis do these universities offer a contextual offer. Is there some sort of consensus for most universities?


Generally you'd have to be at a school rated as 'inadequate', in a low income area and in a low income family. It's quite rare and hard to get a contextual offer.
Reply 4
Original post by DarthRoar
Generally you'd have to be at a school rated as 'inadequate', in a low income area and in a low income family. It's quite rare and hard to get a contextual offer.


Hahaha. That doesn't sound like my school. I'll just have to see whether I can get maths as my highers(as many people switch around at early stages). It's so much stress since any decent university requires higher level maths, while standard Mathematics in A-Levels is widely accepted for comp sci in any university. RIP.
Reply 5
I do IB, and kings college is the only one without HL level maths required. I really need to find a way to transfer to higher level Maths since without Higher level Maths, so many doors close out. And it's a subject I'm passionate about. Just a massive slap to my face.
I was granted an exemption as an undergraduate for not having a foreign language.

Contact the universities that you are interested in applying to and find out if they will consider your application without maths.
Often non- Russell group universities are willing to make exceptions or provide extra support for students that deviate a little from their stated entrance criteria.
Sometimes even Russell group institutions do.
Reply 7
Thank you for bringing this to my attention. Really made me feel better. I'm just so stressed that I can't do higher as it would easily open doors. I'm willing to exert myself hard now, so I can easily do the things I want. Maybe I over estimate how the value of a good university. I want to do banking for experience at a decent company and then pursue my own business. I literally know that university will only come handy for your first job, then it's all experience, but for the sake of wanting to make life easy: I wanted to go imperial.
Original post by noname900
I'm doing IB, but I'm guessing that this can be applied with A level results too. Every 'good' computer science course requires HL maths at IB, yet I'm not allowed to do it due to being a few marks from a level 8. So when do these universities decide whether or not to lower the requirements and create a specific condition for an applicant?


Only when they think despite changing the condition, the applicant would still be up to the course. If a course requires HL Maths then not having HL maths is not something they can vary because that's the point the syllabus starts from and knowledge that is presumed. Unless there is some alternative qualification, there's no basis to safely waiver the standard conditions.
Reply 9
I want to do stuff related with algorithms in the bank. I'm not too knowledgeable in that area and have no idea if I'd get more out of working for a private, local bank, but all I know is that there are lots of aspects in the finance industry and I'm open. Economics has been a mandatory subject with Comp sci for me, so I can easily pick up finances and advanced economics while I do computer science.
Reply 10
Original post by threeportdrift
Only when they think despite changing the condition, the applicant would still be up to the course. If a course requires HL Maths then not having HL maths is not something they can vary because that's the point the syllabus starts from and knowledge that is presumed. Unless there is some alternative qualification, there's no basis to safely waiver the standard conditions.


I've had this preconceived idea that these universities would filter you out based on your stats? I'm still guessing that they don't listen to every applicant, so what would make me stand out? Is stuff like DofE important? Especially in the top universities where intellectual ability is normally prioritised. I've always felt that it's crap that teachers say to motivate you. In my eyes sport at a competitive level is the only thing that would really make universities shift. I'm guessing I'm pretty wrong, so I would need you to correct me.
Reply 11
Yea, banking seems like it's shifting to being full of computer scientists.
Original post by noname900
..............


Standing out isn't the issue. Universities work to a syllabus for each course, that syllabus is predicated on the students entering with a specific set of pre-existing knowledge. For some courses this is very specific, like HL maths for CS courses. No amount of DofE, sports talent etc will make up for that fact.

That's entirely separate from the subsequent analysis, from all the applicants that make the initial basic academic cut, which to select for the course. But for 'good' universities that is still usually an academic consideration. DofE isn't really a university entry criteria.
Reply 13
Original post by threeportdrift
Standing out isn't the issue. Universities work to a syllabus for each course, that syllabus is predicated on the students entering with a specific set of pre-existing knowledge. For some courses this is very specific, like HL maths for CS courses. No amount of DofE, sports talent etc will make up for that fact.

That's entirely separate from the subsequent analysis, from all the applicants that make the initial basic academic cut, which to select for the course. But for 'good' universities that is still usually an academic consideration. DofE isn't really a university entry criteria.


Thanks for the information! So most of these extracurricular activities help them pick from the people that are up to the course?
Original post by noname900
Thanks for the information! So most of these extracurricular activities help them pick from the people that are up to the course?


The first hurdle is the basic entry requirements, then all those that pass that will have higher than minimum grades looked at, then if further differentiation is required it will be extra activities directly related to the course that are taken into consideration, Olympiads, relevant work experience etc. DofE is never a consideration at a 'good' university.
Original post by noname900
I'm doing IB, but I'm guessing that this can be applied with A level results too. Every 'good' computer science course requires HL maths at IB, yet I'm not allowed to do it due to being a few marks from a level 8. So when do these universities decide whether or not to lower the requirements and create a specific condition for an applicant?


On a general level, most universities have some flexibility on the grades they ask for with your IB/A-levels. This may be applied at the offer stage, in the form of a contextual offer- where the applicant has special circumstances that may stop them from achieving the highest grades. It may also be applied on results day if the uni finds not enough students have met their offers to fill the course.

However, when universities ask for specific subjects, there is usually less flexibility. They need you to have studied that subject past GCSE to be able to pick up from the same starting point as everyone else.

Maths is a major part of CompSci, which is why so many unis insist on it- they have found those who haven't studied it at the level they require don't cope with the course. I'd suggest a few options to you:

-Get a remark to see if you can push your grade up to an 8 and take HL maths.
-Consider a foundation year aimed at people who don't have quite the right subjects for CompSci.
-Consider switching to a sixth form that offers A-levels and may allow you to do A-level maths.
-Consider looking at other university course options.

Original post by noname900
Thanks for the information! So most of these extracurricular activities help them pick from the people that are up to the course?


In general, universities aren't that interested in things that are totally irrelevant to the course. Unis are more interested in "super-curriculars"- which means showing an interested in and an aptitude for your subject beyond what is taught in school e.g for CompSci this might be things like coding competitions and writing your own programs. This is usually discussed in the PS. It's unlikely a uni will care about something like DofE as a) so many people do it, it doesn't really make you stand out and b) it's not usually relevant to your course.

However, the PS usually only really comes into the equation when unis are trying to decide between similar "borderline" applicants to see who to give an offer to, or maybe on results day if you've just missed your offer. If you don't have the right subjects, your application is very unlikely to get this far.

I hope this helps you understand how the application process works.
Reply 16
Original post by SarcAndSpark
On a general level, most universities have some flexibility on the grades they ask for with your IB/A-levels. This may be applied at the offer stage, in the form of a contextual offer- where the applicant has special circumstances that may stop them from achieving the highest grades. It may also be applied on results day if the uni finds not enough students have met their offers to fill the course.

However, when universities ask for specific subjects, there is usually less flexibility. They need you to have studied that subject past GCSE to be able to pick up from the same starting point as everyone else.

Maths is a major part of CompSci, which is why so many unis insist on it- they have found those who haven't studied it at the level they require don't cope with the course. I'd suggest a few options to you:

-Get a remark to see if you can push your grade up to an 8 and take HL maths.
-Consider a foundation year aimed at people who don't have quite the right subjects for CompSci.
-Consider switching to a sixth form that offers A-levels and may allow you to do A-level maths.
-Consider looking at other university course options.



In general, universities aren't that interested in things that are totally irrelevant to the course. Unis are more interested in "super-curriculars"- which means showing an interested in and an aptitude for your subject beyond what is taught in school e.g for CompSci this might be things like coding competitions and writing your own programs. This is usually discussed in the PS. It's unlikely a uni will care about something like DofE as a) so many people do it, it doesn't really make you stand out and b) it's not usually relevant to your course.

However, the PS usually only really comes into the equation when unis are trying to decide between similar "borderline" applicants to see who to give an offer to, or maybe on results day if you've just missed your offer. If you don't have the right subjects, your application is very unlikely to get this far.

I hope this helps you understand how the application process works.


Do you think that it's possible that the school would let me do HL maths after the first month or two of school, if I really excel at it? Might as well clear it up and see what I can manage in this circumstance. I know HL subject changes aren't out of the norm as many people finally get to experience the subjects and it transcends the requirements to something more realistic and informative. But in something like maths, would it be possible?
Original post by noname900
Do you think that it's possible that the school would let me do HL maths after the first month or two of school, if I really excel at it? Might as well clear it up and see what I can manage in this circumstance. I know HL subject changes aren't out of the norm as many people finally get to experience the subjects and it transcends the requirements to something more realistic and informative. But in something like maths, would it be possible?


This is something you really need to talk to your school about- maybe get a parent onside to help you put a bit of pressure on your teachers.
Reply 18
Original post by SarcAndSpark
This is something you really need to talk to your school about- maybe get a parent onside to help you put a bit of pressure on your teachers.


Hmmm, yes. It's something smooth. I would drop physics to standard from higher and puts standard maths to higher level. I don't see the same problem that students who completely start a new subject would have and that is one of the huge problems schools are quick to bring up. I'll see what I can manage.
(edited 5 years ago)

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