Applying for RN AND RAF for Pilot
I just wanted to see if there was anybody currently applying for both the Royal Navy and the RAF for pilot/observer or WSO. I have passed my FATs with high range scores for both through the Royal Navy, and wasn't sure whether it would look bad or show a lack of commitment if I was to open another application for the RAF to run alongside my application for the Navy? If anyone is currently applying for both and has any advice or experience to offer that would be great. Thanks
serry1988
I just wanted to see if there was anybody currently applying for both the Royal Navy and the RAF for pilot/observer or WSO. I have passed my FATs with high range scores for both through the Royal Navy, and wasn't sure whether it would look bad or show a lack of commitment if I was to open another application for the RAF to run alongside my application for the Navy? If anyone is currently applying for both and has any advice or experience to offer that would be great. Thanks
have you checked on rumration or armed forces forums, serry?
good luck either way, i'm thinking of going for officer entry mesen if the uni stuff doesn't work out!
Plenty of people do it. It's possible that each service might not even ask about your application to the other, but even if they do, as long as you can justify it adequately you'll be fine and it won't weaken your application to either in any way.
It won't weaken your application per se, but you're laying your cards on the table immediately as someone who's only interested in the flying, and has no interest in the service which allows you to do that.
So, look at it from an interviewer's point of view. I'm about to offer you a place to go through 9 months of officer training before embarking on a 5-odd year long programme of flying training, where you will be rigorously assessed at all times and monitored and checked all the time. There's a well known saying in the FT world that "you're only ever 3 trips away from a chop ride," meaning that a slip below standard in one sortie can start a snowballing process that ends up with you chopped within a week.
There are no guarantees, and plenty of people with decent aptitude run into capacity walls at various times and end up removed from training.
Now, let's say I have 2 candidates. You're one of them, have high aptitude test scores, an application in to the Navy as well as a pilot, pilot's your only RAF choice, and you've indicated in your interview that if unsuccessful you would continue with your Navy application. Then I have another guy, similar sort of scores to you, but he's got pilot as his first choice, then WSO, then ATC officer, then logs as a non-aptitude branch, and indicated in his interview that if unsuccessful he'd also consider WSOp.
Who do you think I'm going to take the risk on? I have to worry about what you'll do if you're removed from training after 2 years. Will you stay in the RAF to give us some return for the investment? Or will you be straight on the phone to see about moving across to the Navy to give their system a try instead? Even if they won't have you, the "pilot or bust" attitude would make me seriously consider your value if you don't end up in a flying job. Perhaps you'd be straight off to OATS waiting for an upturn in the commercial world?
Now, in a world with lots of slots, we'd take you both on and accept that there may be a risk that you wouldn't consider another branch if you failed flying training. If I were the President of the Air Board, and I only had one slot to give out, I'd give it to the guy more likely to stay in my service and provide me with a capable officer, rather than the guy who's only interested in being airborne.
So, look at it from an interviewer's point of view. I'm about to offer you a place to go through 9 months of officer training before embarking on a 5-odd year long programme of flying training, where you will be rigorously assessed at all times and monitored and checked all the time. There's a well known saying in the FT world that "you're only ever 3 trips away from a chop ride," meaning that a slip below standard in one sortie can start a snowballing process that ends up with you chopped within a week.
There are no guarantees, and plenty of people with decent aptitude run into capacity walls at various times and end up removed from training.
Now, let's say I have 2 candidates. You're one of them, have high aptitude test scores, an application in to the Navy as well as a pilot, pilot's your only RAF choice, and you've indicated in your interview that if unsuccessful you would continue with your Navy application. Then I have another guy, similar sort of scores to you, but he's got pilot as his first choice, then WSO, then ATC officer, then logs as a non-aptitude branch, and indicated in his interview that if unsuccessful he'd also consider WSOp.
Who do you think I'm going to take the risk on? I have to worry about what you'll do if you're removed from training after 2 years. Will you stay in the RAF to give us some return for the investment? Or will you be straight on the phone to see about moving across to the Navy to give their system a try instead? Even if they won't have you, the "pilot or bust" attitude would make me seriously consider your value if you don't end up in a flying job. Perhaps you'd be straight off to OATS waiting for an upturn in the commercial world?
Now, in a world with lots of slots, we'd take you both on and accept that there may be a risk that you wouldn't consider another branch if you failed flying training. If I were the President of the Air Board, and I only had one slot to give out, I'd give it to the guy more likely to stay in my service and provide me with a capable officer, rather than the guy who's only interested in being airborne.
serry1988
I just wanted to see if there was anybody currently applying for both the Royal Navy and the RAF for pilot/observer or WSO. I have passed my FATs with high range scores for both through the Royal Navy, and wasn't sure whether it would look bad or show a lack of commitment if I was to open another application for the RAF to run alongside my application for the Navy? If anyone is currently applying for both and has any advice or experience to offer that would be great. Thanks
I applied for both, concurrently when I went through. I had a reason: I was fast approaching the age limit for RAF pilot so I applied FAA too as at the time the age limit was higher.
Be aware that they will both be able to see that you've applied to the other service even if you don't tell them.
Wzz
Now, let's say I have 2 candidates. You're one of them, have high aptitude test scores, an application in to the Navy as well as a pilot, pilot's your only RAF choice, and you've indicated in your interview that if unsuccessful you would continue with your Navy application. Then I have another guy, similar sort of scores to you, but he's got pilot as his first choice, then WSO, then ATC officer, then logs as a non-aptitude branch, and indicated in his interview that if unsuccessful he'd also consider WSOp.
Now, let's say I have 2 candidates. You're one of them, have high aptitude test scores, an application in to the Navy as well as a pilot, pilot's your only RAF choice, and you've indicated in your interview that if unsuccessful you would continue with your Navy application. Then I have another guy, similar sort of scores to you, but he's got pilot as his first choice, then WSO, then ATC officer, then logs as a non-aptitude branch, and indicated in his interview that if unsuccessful he'd also consider WSOp.
I'd probably agree with that: RAF was my first choice and I had pilot, WSO, Int and WSOp(L) down as alternatives which I would have seriously considered, and I had a fair justification for why I had applied to the Navy, as flying was what I really wanted to do, and if the only reason I couldn't go pilot was age then I was giving myself another opportunity.
I didn't get as far as AIB before I got into the RAF, but I was certainly having my own doubts about the strength of my justification to join the Navy! It was basically: I want to fly (with the RAF) but I'm almost too old, so, er, you'll do
And, er, flying off carriers is pretty cool (but I'd rather do it with the RAF).So in sum, you probably need to come up a good justification for why you're applying to both. If you're good at BS you may be able to pretend to both that they're your first choice and the other is just to keep your options open as far as flying is concerned?
Correct me if I'm wrong but if you've got as far as FATs you are probably a good way through the Navy application process (although having said that, I started both applications at the same time and had started IOT by the time I got as far as the Navy initial fitness test (about the 4th? hurdle) and the RAF application process doesn't exactly move at the speed of light so you might still have a long way to go!). So I think you would be better off getting through the Navy application and seeing what they say. Given that you say you got competetive FAT scores, if you don't get into the branch you want in the Navy this would also give you time to reflect as to why not, take on board the advice given at AIB and strengthen a second application to FAA or an application to the RAF. Why are you considering opening another application at such a late stage in the Navy recruitment process by the way?
Stick to your Navy application for now. You'll have lots of revision to do between now and AIB, so there's no point in trying to memorise all the ships & stats for AIB, while also trying to learn the aircraft and bases for the RAF.
If you fail AIB, then you can go the AFCO the next day and start applying for the RAF. A guy I know recently failed AIB, so has started his RAF Application, and is what I'll do if I fail AIB next week...
If you fail AIB, then you can go the AFCO the next day and start applying for the RAF. A guy I know recently failed AIB, so has started his RAF Application, and is what I'll do if I fail AIB next week...
If you haven't got the capacity to learn about the RN and RAF at the same time, seriously, give up now!
It is perfectly acceptable to run two applications at the same time. I've got 10 civvie job applications on the go at the moment and in that isn't generally considered very many, even at my level. There are only 3 'companies' that offer the type of work you want to do - military aviation, so simultaneously applying to any that you want to work in is only common sense.
No-one considers jobs should only be applied for consecutively. If an OASC Boarding Officer comes up with Wzz's question about your commitment, ask if they think one at a time applications is reasonable and widespread practice, and if not (and it absolutely is not), then surely the only other type of application that shows commitment to your chosen career route is another military application.
One might question your commitment if you had applications in with 20 investment banks or 15 graduate schemes, but even then, if you are a well prepared candidate, the RAF knows you have a lot of potential and they are always in competition with other employers.
It is perfectly acceptable to run two applications at the same time. I've got 10 civvie job applications on the go at the moment and in that isn't generally considered very many, even at my level. There are only 3 'companies' that offer the type of work you want to do - military aviation, so simultaneously applying to any that you want to work in is only common sense.
No-one considers jobs should only be applied for consecutively. If an OASC Boarding Officer comes up with Wzz's question about your commitment, ask if they think one at a time applications is reasonable and widespread practice, and if not (and it absolutely is not), then surely the only other type of application that shows commitment to your chosen career route is another military application.
One might question your commitment if you had applications in with 20 investment banks or 15 graduate schemes, but even then, if you are a well prepared candidate, the RAF knows you have a lot of potential and they are always in competition with other employers.
pwdrin
Ye she was telling me yesterday. I know Log officers is 8-12 months
I dont see how this can be the case with the system as it is. My understanding has always been that after passing AIB your score is ranked. If the RN requires 3 Logs officers in September the 3 top scoring wonnabe logisticians get selected, so potentially one could have passed AIB 2 weeks ago, the other 7 months and the third 11 months. You could pass AIB with a reasonable score, but if before every intake there are more people passing with higher scores you will never get selected, regardless of how long you've been waiting.
The time from walking into a careers office to starting may on average be 8-12 months but it certainly would not be a hard and fast rule.
Recruitment for ratings is however done on a waiting list system.
This is how i have always understood the system to have worked, it was how it was explained to me a few years ago when i was going through it.
pwdrin
Btw there is a 3 year back log in the RN right now (Best friend is in her training, and did a week at the Career office 3 weeks ago.) So if you havent got in yet watch out.
Not entirely true, it's for certain trades and branches.
Hiya wondered which you picked cause I'm in same situation, thanks.
Original post by sophboddyy
Hiya wondered which you picked cause I'm in same situation, thanks.
The thread is 9 years old, don't think you'll get an update from the OP as they haven't visited the site since October 2010.
The choice is yours. What works for some people won't work for you.
What's your sticking point?
I'm an air cadet so I kinda wanna carry a career on into the RAF but navy idk if I'll be flying more and travelling
Original post by sophboddyy
I'm an air cadet so I kinda wanna carry a career on into the RAF but navy idk if I'll be flying more and travelling
There is no harm in applying for both. We’re all on the same side and your application to the RAF will absolutely not be affected by having a RN (or an Army) application running in parallel.
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