Is this racism?

I am sure that there are many Islamic schools out there but the ones that make the news are the unlicensed, poor quality teaching, very limited curriculum, health and safety nightmare, often denigrating to female students type so that would be the only reference point that many people in the UK have. Not saying that it is right.

Reply 2

Anonymous #1

OP

Original post by ReadingMum

I am sure that there are many Islamic schools out there but the ones that make the news are the unlicensed, poor quality teaching, very limited curriculum, health and safety nightmare, often denigrating to female students type so that would be the only reference point that many people in the UK have. Not saying that it is right.

Thanks for replying. But the point is that they're at the same university on the same course - similar grades.

Would you suggest that such people are islamaphobic? I mean after all, they can tell werew muslim but were otherwise very polite. Also as in example 2, do you think people prefer to be around Muslims who are not very conservative.

Reply 3

ReadingMum

I wouldn't say that they were Islamaphobic - more that Islamic schools in the UK can have a bad rep.

I don't know the answer to point 2 - generally people find it easy to get on with people in the middle ground whether that be on religion, racial beliefs, politics, whatever, unless they have much stronger views in one direction themselves.There are all sorts of people in this world - when I spent time in Oman I was happy to respect the local custom of modest dressing but I saw plenty who didn't bother and I just wondered why they had chosen the destination. 'Some' very conservative muslim regimes are not a great place to be female - again this makes the news in soundbites.

Reply 4

londonmyst

No.
Racism is about racial hatred on grounds of race.
Not personal opinions about religion, snobbery, inverse snobbery, tribalism or local accent.

My father is a deafeningly loud militant atheist from manchester into class war, intersectional feminism, anarchism and eugenics.
Many people dislike his opinions, manc accent, noise nuisance, tactics and often him personally.
His race is as irrelevant as his shoesize, it is his choices that put people off.

Sadly there will always be a few bad apples in very country and group.
Racists, muggers, scam artists, thugs, sexual offenders, vicious fanatics and all manner of criminals motivated by financial gain.
Racism does exist in Britain.
As does sexual violence, hate crime and identity theft.

Many people all over the world are very cliquey.
Often in combination with adopting a very narrow comfort zone and insular mindset that prefers not to experience anything outside their preferred little social bubble & echo chamber.
In terms of the workplace, uni, college, social groups and activist movements.

However, there are many people who have very diverse friendship and other social groups.
Particularly in areas like London, Manchester, Surrey, Edinburgh and Swansea.
My best friend & I met at nursery, we have been besties for over two decades.
She was born in India and is a follower of the islamic sect led by the aga khan.
I was born in London and am lazy catholic.
Both of us have dated guys from a variety of backgrounds in terms of nationality, religious beliefs, educational and professional backgrounds.

Reply 5

x_lalalisa_x

Original post by ReadingMum

I am sure that there are many Islamic schools out there but the ones that make the news are the unlicensed, poor quality teaching, very limited curriculum, health and safety nightmare, often denigrating to female students type so that would be the only reference point that many people in the UK have. Not saying that it is right.

That's really true,which is why I didn't go to an Islamic school + I wanna go to a school and learn abt ppls cultures ,my closest friends are sikh,white,gay,black,Chinese and my best friend is black and I learn so much of her culture which is why it's important to integrate and is also th e res on I put the Catholic school near me as a last option 4 years ago when I was choosing which high school to go to

Of course there is racism ,my Chinese friend got told yesterday that she gave everyone corona even tho she's never been to chni,my best friend got called the n word and I 've been called a terrorist and a dirty Arab
There will always be ignorant people don't t th and change there racist opinions just call them out on it because of u don't he basically okay ing it

Reply 6

BlueIndigoViolet

Honestly faith schools should just be abolished

Reply 7

x_lalalisa_x

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

Honestly faith schools should just be abolished

I gotta agree with u,idk but school is abt education not religion

Reply 8

$Avatar for \^_^/$

\^_^/

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

Honestly faith schools should just be abolished

why do u think so

Reply 9

BlueIndigoViolet

Original post by x_lalalisa_x

I gotta agree with u,idk but school is abt education not religion

thats the point imo, why bring religion/belief systems as an integral part of a person's basic education be it Catholic or the few extreme Islamic schools who haven't accepted evolution lol etc... just not important in my personal opinion

Reply 10

Original post by BlueIndigoViolet

Honestly faith schools should just be abolished

one gendered schools, private schools and religious schools should all be abolished

Reply 11

RogerOxon

Original post by Anonymous

We are debating whether racism exists in the UK.

Yes, it unfortunately still does. I suspect, and hope, that it's less prevalent in the UK, due to its history, than in some other European countries.

Original post by Anonymous

1. When I went to university I was speaking to some people who I would consider as very socially liberal and I mentioned that I went to an Islamic school. A few from that group looked around in shock/disgust as though I made a faux pas for mentioning it. Is this racism - these guys went to BLM protests voted remain etc. Was it inappropriate to mention Islamic school - I here people mention Catholic school all the time?

2. One of my friends was at another university where some people were very welcoming. But once they saw him in Islamic dress code and would no longer talk to him. In example 1 and 2 these people are clearly liberals. And perhaps their reaction is because they they associate many things in Islam to be against their liberal and tolerant values. So they weren't trying to cause any offence but but inadvertently did so

3. One of my friends is from a minority ethnic background and he's from Oxford. When he moved to a northern city many people would be nice to him until he started speaking. He Suspects that people were not nice to him because he was well spoken and and an ethnic minority. But my question is is this racism or or would people from the North or places like Essex be like that towards anyone who sounded like they were privileged? Or is it that people don't feel comfortable with certain people being more privileged than them. (I have experienced baristas sometimes are rude once they hear me speak, but they probably loathe anyone whom they assume is privileged and they're job is horrible - I never get this from Europeans/Asians.)

Islam isn't a race, and any change in behaviour was after their race was seen, so it's not racism. It appears to be their opinion of Islam, or those that are taken-in by it, for 1 & 2.

Original post by Anonymous

4. At university all of us acknowledge that most White English people would not mix with anyone who is not white. You generally only see Europeans mixing with minority ethnic people. My friends who are female experience this more so. Again is this because people tend to hang around people who they have more in common with or is this down to race. (In my own experience I had some white friends who would talk to me when they were in European groups but would ignore me when they were with their white friends. But sometimes I felt this was a social class thing rather than a race thing because I consider myself working class and I think at uni people are always thinking about keeping up impressions)

Which university? There is a tendency for some people to socialise with similar people, although I would expect this ot be less prevalent at university.

Original post by Anonymous

5. Last year some of my friends during Extinction Rebellion protests. They felt at though they were not welcome. It is true that most people at these protests were white but in my observation they are generally a 'type' - they only really mix well with their own cliques. I know it's a massive of generalisation but generally you can identify someone by appearance as a typical climate change protester.

Outside of my experience. I suspect that you didn't look like enough of an activist.

Original post by Anonymous

Let me know if you've experienced the above and whether you think it's racism or you think it's poor character/classism/inferiority complex

Several are clearly not racism, but some could be subtle, although I don't think you have evidence of it.

(edited 3 years ago)

Reply 12

RogerOxon

Original post by Lilymae69

one gendered schools, private schools and religious schools should all be abolished

State schools should be areligious and inclusive.

I'm not sure what abolishing private schools would achieve - you'd also have to ban private tutors, if you want to reduce privilege, although schools in rich areas will always get "help" from parents. You can't stop children from being schooled in other countries either.

Reply 13

Original post by RogerOxon

State schools should be areligious and inclusive.

I'm not sure what abolishing private schools would achieve - you'd also have to ban private tutors, if you want to reduce privilege, although schools in rich areas will always get "help" from parents. You can't stop children from being schooled in other countries either.

fair enough

Reply 14

Original post by RogerOxon

State schools should be areligious and inclusive.

I'm not sure what abolishing private schools would achieve - you'd also have to ban private tutors, if you want to reduce privilege, although schools in rich areas will always get "help" from parents. You can't stop children from being schooled in other countries either.

but its not fair that richer ppl get to have better eductaion

Reply 15

Seretonin

13

Original post by RogerOxon

State schools should be areligious and inclusive.

I'm not sure what abolishing private schools would achieve - you'd also have to ban private tutors, if you want to reduce privilege, although schools in rich areas will always get "help" from parents. You can't stop children from being schooled in other countries either.

That's the same with religious schools then parents could send their children to religious tutors or send them abroad. From what I've heard Islamic schools still do all the normal GCSE teaching but just have a few extra Islamic lessons if that. It's nothing different to a private school. So if you want to take one preference away then you should remove private schools, same sex schools etc.

Reply 16

Original post by Seretonin

That's the same with religious schools then parents could send their children to religious tutors or send them abroad. From what I've heard Islamic schools still do all the normal GCSE teaching but just have a few extra Islamic lessons if that. It's nothing different to a private school. So if you want to take one preference away then you should remove private schools, same sex schools etc.

same gender schools are pointless i go to one rn

Reply 17

LEETmotif

3

Original post by Lilymae69

but its not fair that richer ppl get to have better eductaion

Banning private schools only serves to reduce standards by forcing a load more people into the already oversubscribed state school system, rather than improve the standards of existing state schools. It's nothing more than a jealousy policy. In fact, private schools help the poor because the rich are not using government (taxpayer) money for their children.

Private schools are not necessarily better than state schools. I know that to be the case, having been to both kinds of school. I did better at the state school. Also grammar schools can be as good as if not better than many good private schools.

Sorry OP for not being relevant.

Reply 18

RogerOxon

Original post by Seretonin

That's the same with religious schools then parents could send their children to religious tutors or send them abroad. From what I've heard Islamic schools still do all the normal GCSE teaching but just have a few extra Islamic lessons if that. It's nothing different to a private school. So if you want to take one preference away then you should remove private schools, same sex schools etc.

The State should not fund (any part of) schools that indoctrinate - that's not education.

(edited 3 years ago)

Reply 19

StarLinyx