How the UK labour party can win

Immigration is going to be their greatest stumbling block, the ultra left of the party will have a massive tantrum if they do not get their unfettered immigration and this will in turn lead to the standard infighting that consistently prevents Labour garnering more popular support.

Immigration is going to be their greatest stumbling block, the ultra left of the party will have a massive tantrum if they do not get their unfettered immigration and this will in turn lead to the standard infighting that consistently prevents Labour garnering more popular support.

There has already been a de facto electoral alliance between the parties, the Tories did sufficiently well that even official it would have been neutered since the DUP are likely onside.

2019 I think was an exceptional election.

De facto or not, by making it official it would enable all of the left wing parties to concentrate their resources on winning seats against Tories.

There are a number of seats where for instance if labour or the Liberals had stepped aside for the other they would have been able to win. Of course they basically did that with the amersham candidate but that is outside of the norm where usually they will fight

In general though i agree with some of the ethos.

Focus on core issues rather than nonsense issues, embrace patriotism and national pride, the economic offer in 2015 was fine.

I would say that for the Labour Party the progressive alliance and PR are an admission of defeat though and i doubt MP's would actually vote for it. The Liberals in 2012 got burned when Labour walked into the Aye lobby for the second reading of the Lords Reform Bill but then (purposely) sat on their behinds during the vote on the timing amendement required to ensure the bills passage. The Labour Party may be a bit stupid as an entity but it's politicians are somewhat smarter and greedier than we on the right give them credit for, they are not the kind of Turkey's which will vote for christmas if it means sacrificing their chance to govern alone.

I think the thing is though that chance has sailed. Sure they want to rule again but possibly not at the price of never holding office again.

I can't see any possibility of a labour government without third party support.

It's unlikely that Labour can win in 2024 on their own given that they may lose as many as another 20 seats to the Tories where the Brx Party vote is in play from 2019 however in the long run the Labour Party can't be compared to some of the losing entities on the continent. Unlike on the continent where several parties on the left have been in freefall, the Labour Party even exempting 2017 has seen slow vote gains, they have simply been beaten by a Tory Party which has massacred its sorrounding parties (and as alluded to, post 2024 there is nothing left for them short of conquering Wales, Scotland and NI). Indeed, had the locals have been fought in the correct years, Labour would have been celebrating small gains from the 2017 map (we beat them on the 2016 map but the swing was actually against us on the 2017 map).

Now the chances of a 100 seat majority may be minimal for them but the point is that there is currently little evidence that the Labour Party is facing a severe threat from the Lib Dem's or Greens (though the Lib Dem's are likely to gain seats as well, largely at the expense of the Tories) which means that they will probably head into the 2029/2034 elections (or sooner) with a 35-40% vote share which is enough to challenge for a majority once the Tories start losing votes (which is not that unlikely given that as said, there are no real vote sources left post 24).

Whether it's a 5 year stint or another 13 year stint again is the question but even so, people are perhaps a little too excited about the Labour Party's long term loss prospects albeit the caveat is of course that this is so long as things stay broadly as they are.

Thought I'd do a little exercise. Note that this is just purely about winning power - they don't have to actually believe or follow through with the below (other than point 1). Partly the rationale for part 1 is that smaller parties can take up the mantle and responsibilities of niche causes. Eg 'well, we'd have liked to have reduced immigration but unfortunately our coalition partners disagreed'


1: acknowledge progressive alliance and an electoral pact with other leftwing parties including Snp, plaid, green, lib dem. Support PR.

2: less woke stuff. Doesnt mean chsbge your views just try and avoid it as it is off putting and irrelevant to most people. Most of these people have nowhere to go to esp if you have done point 1. Be vague, slippery and evasise on the issue.

3- Commit to reducing immigration and try and do this is in the most PC way possible. Try and outflank the right on immigration without descending into "bigotry".

4- outflank the Tories on defence spending, continue Starmers push for more patriotism but with more meat. Market yourself as a left wing uk nationalist party (like SNP not BNP)

5- Always be economically to the left on Economics to the Tories but never too far.

6- purge a few far left MPs like John McDonnel.

I really want to support Labour but just can't bring myself to do it. Every time I hear a Labourite use the word "comrade" I inwardly throw up. And yet I can't stand the Tories. I think you are possibly over thinking it.

Definitely number 6 for me, but I think number 7 would sort it pretty easily

7. Simply point out everything the Tories have promised yet no delivered e.g. levelling up.

Thought I'd do a little exercise. Note that this is just purely about winning power - they don't have to actually believe or follow through with the below (other than point 1). Partly the rationale for part 1 is that smaller parties can take up the mantle and responsibilities of niche causes. Eg 'well, we'd have liked to have reduced immigration but unfortunately our coalition partners disagreed'


1: acknowledge progressive alliance and an electoral pact with other leftwing parties including Snp, plaid, green, lib dem. Support PR.

2: less woke stuff. Doesnt mean chsbge your views just try and avoid it as it is off putting and irrelevant to most people. Most of these people have nowhere to go to esp if you have done point 1. Be vague, slippery and evasise on the issue.

3- Commit to reducing immigration and try and do this is in the most PC way possible. Try and outflank the right on immigration without descending into "bigotry".

4- outflank the Tories on defence spending, continue Starmers push for more patriotism but with more meat. Market yourself as a left wing uk nationalist party (like SNP not BNP)

5- Always be economically to the left on Economics to the Tories but never too far.

6- purge a few far left MPs like John McDonnel.

So Labour should support Scottish and Welsh independence?

What do you think Welsh Labour will make of that?

No. But they support devoloution and the right to hold a referendum.

Same as what they do as when they work with plaid. Necessary evil.

This will always be Labour's downfall, as only a small proportion of the electorate support their open borders approach to immigration. The Tories have screwed up their opportunity to capitalise on immigration (most notably with the poor response to the Channel crisis) but if they get things in order ahead of the next election they're likely to do well again.