Russell Group vs Non-Russell

Original post by Layla1712

So I firmed a non-Russell partly because it ranks within the top 10 for my subject and top 10 in the U.K. just overall, but I have started to be told that I should have picked a Russell group uni instead (which my insurance is). Why is that??

The person who told you that is ignorant - ignore them. RG is just a self-selecting club which tells you nothing.

Stick with your choice.

Original post by Layla1712

So I firmed a non-Russell partly because it ranks within the top 10 for my subject and top 10 in the U.K. just overall, but I have started to be told that I should have picked a Russell group uni instead (which my insurance is). Why is that??

Russel Groups are a group of unis who are seen as being more research forward which may be useful in your future career. However this ignores the fact that the uni puts signs themself up to the group so doesn't tell you that much.

https://russellgroup.ac.uk/about/our-universities/

Really this has no bearing on your future, focus on the course, the uni and location as well as any other factors important to you. It makes no difference if it is RG/non-RG, what suits you is the most important thing :smile:

Reply 3

You have made your choice for all the right reasons - enjoy your degree.

Reply 4

swanseajack1

19

Original post by Layla1712

So I firmed a non-Russell partly because it ranks within the top 10 for my subject and top 10 in the U.K. just overall, but I have started to be told that I should have picked a Russell group uni instead (which my insurance is). Why is that??

Because the people who tell you this base it on snobbery and not on what happens in practice.

The Russell Group is a self publicist marketing group which claims it represents the best universities in the UK. However that is only partially true. Some of the Russell Group universities such as Oxford and Cambridge are amongst the best but there are others who are not as good as some outside eg Bath and St Andrews.

The RG is very good at marketing itself and many people just believe their hype.

The truth is that there is a number of universities outside the RG every bit as good as those in it and it really means nothing whether you attend a RG university or not

The RG was set up wen the government opened up university funding so no traditional universities such as polytechnics could become universities and a number of traditional universities feared losing their research funding to these new universities. To counter this they set up the RG to protect themselves and their funding. It has nothing to do with standards of education. It was purely self preservation but people have taken them to be the best universities but that isnt necessarily the case.

Ignore rankings or the RG because it means nothing. There is very little difference in the top 20 or so universities and rankings change yearly. Go where you feel is right for you and not for other reasons,

Reply 5

I have so many examples of students who went to non-RG Unis and who are now top of their field - including Medicine, Law, Economics, CS/AI etc. Its all nonsense - life is what you make it, the brand name of your Uni isnt going to determine your career.

Reply 6

ajj2000

Original post by Layla1712

So I firmed a non-Russell partly because it ranks within the top 10 for my subject and top 10 in the U.K. just overall, but I have started to be told that I should have picked a Russell group uni instead (which my insurance is). Why is that??

I don't trust rankings much and don't trust RG status as indicating either a better education or that it will necessarily have a better employer perception. Unfortunately there are parents who seek status in the wrong places, teachers who have no real excuse and underinformed teenagers looking for clout. Its better to ask for advice specific to the course you are looking at and the universities you are considering.

For example:

- international relations at St Andrews
- engineering courses at Loughborough
- nursing/ physio etc at lots of universities
- medicine anywhere in the UK

Most of the above would be non RG - and no-one well informed would think they were any less than great choices.

Reply 7

Auto-Engineering at Coventry or Oxford Brookes.
Design at NTU
Teaching at Roehampton.
Bangor and Plymouth for Marine Science, Ecology etc.
Any courses at Bath.

The list goes on.

As above, schools are stupid about this and list 'Uni destinations' on the school website like this is some sort of credibility award. Its bonkers.

Reply 8

swanseajack1

19

Original post by McGinger

Auto-Engineering at Coventry or Oxford Brookes.
Design at NTU
Teaching at Roehampton.
Bangor and Plymouth for Marine Science, Ecology etc.
Any courses at Bath.

The list goes on.

As above, schools are stupid about this and list 'Uni destinations' on the school website like this is some sort of credibility award. Its bonkers.

Years ago Bath, Exeter, York and Lancaster were all part of the 1994 group. Exeter and York paid to become part of RG. Bath and Lancaster didnt Exeter isnt better than Bath because it is RG and York not better than Lancaster for the same reason. As already said people use this nonsense like Teachers and schools who should be better informed

Reply 9

And not being RG doesnt seem to have done Lancaster or Bath - or their graduates - any harm.
Please point this out to teachers or anyone else obsessed with 'RG'.

Reply 10

Layla1712

OP

13

Original post by McGinger

And not being RG doesnt seem to have done Lancaster or Bath - or their graduates - any harm.
Please point this out to teachers or anyone else obsessed with 'RG'.

Thank you!!

I firmed Bath and have found out that it’s the 6th most employable uni, heavily because of their placements schemes Im pretty sure.

Yeah I just got a bit freaked out seeming as all my mates who firmed RG told me I should have firmed a RG too

Reply 11

Original post by Layla1712

all my mates who firmed RG

Some 17/18 year olds use this as a sort of self-affirmation - that somehow 'got into a Uni with a special badge' makes them instantly better people. Its hopelessly childish.

The Bath placements program is one of the best in the UK - this is what employers want, relevant experience, not just a degree. When the thousands of freshly-minted grads all hit the jobs market every June, it will be this that makes the difference, not if the Uni had paid to part of a self-selecting 'group'.

Reply 12

booklover1313

Original post by Layla1712

Thank you!!

I firmed Bath and have found out that it’s the 6th most employable uni, heavily because of their placements schemes Im pretty sure.

Yeah I just got a bit freaked out seeming as all my mates who firmed RG told me I should have firmed a RG too

Bath is an amazing university and you will have a brilliant time there. The fact that it isn't RG makes absolutely no difference. A degree from Bath is going to be well respected!

Reply 13

Ghostlady

21

https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/news/new-evidence-highlights-world-leading-quality-of-lancaster-research
Lancaster is ranked 21 overall out of 157 institutions in Times Higher Education (THE). This also places Lancaster above eight Russell Group universities for research quality.

Reply 14

Elijah2004

7

Original post by Ghostlady

https://www.lancaster.ac.uk/news/new-evidence-highlights-world-leading-quality-of-lancaster-research
Lancaster is ranked 21 overall out of 157 institutions in Times Higher Education (THE). This also places Lancaster above eight Russell Group universities for research quality.

Rankings are mainly based off student satisfaction which doesn’t actually represent how good the uni is e.g. Lancaster ranks ahead of Exeter but its quite clearly not the more prestigious/better uni

Reply 15

Ghostlady

21

Original post by Elijah2004

Rankings are mainly based off student satisfaction which doesn’t actually represent how good the uni is e.g. Lancaster ranks ahead of Exeter but its quite clearly not the more prestigious/better uni

Lancaster might not be the more 'prestigious' than Exeter when it comes to forums like this, but when it comes to getting a job, Exeter is not thought of compared with the likes of Oxbridge, Edinburgh, Manchester, UCL, Imperial etc. Its really down to whether you can get work experience. If your pulling a first at Exeter with no work experience compared with someone with work experience and a 2:1 at Lancaster, I know as an employer which student I'd be choosing.
Even if they are both off on an equal footing, they would be treated as equals. I think TSR has that snobbery around it in forums, when the reality is an employer couldnt care less which of the two unis you are from, as long as you can do the job.

(edited 1 year ago)

Reply 16

Elijah2004

7

Original post by Ghostlady

Lancaster might not be the more 'prestigious' than Exeter when it comes to forums like this, but when it comes to getting a job, Exeter is not thought of compared with the likes of Oxbridge, Edinburgh, Manchester, UCL, Imperial etc. Its really down to whether you can get work experience. If your pulling a first at Exeter with no work experience compared with someone with work experience and a 2:1 at Lancaster, I know as an employer which student I'd be choosing.
Even if they are both off on an equal footing, they would be treated as equals. I think TSR has that snobbery around it in forums, when the reality is an employer couldnt care less which of the two unis you are from, as long as you can do the job.

Yeah true but the point is no one should use the ranking table as a measure of what uni is more prestigious/better.And some firms especially within law, the difference between Exeter and Lancaster is large meaning a student from Exeter will be more likely to break into a top law firm in comparison to a Lancaster student.

As a whole Russell group unis are better then non Russell groups with the exception of bath and St. Andrews .

Reply 17

ageshallnot

21

Original post by Elijah2004

Rankings are mainly based off student satisfaction which doesn’t actually represent how good the uni is e.g. Lancaster ranks ahead of Exeter but its quite clearly not the more prestigious/better uni

What proportion of any of the ranking tables is allocated to "student satisfaction"? Is it above 50%?

Reply 18

username5789946

14

I do wish schools bought less into the Russell Group hype. My school proudly had it on their website how many got into a Russell Group uni, which didn't include me even though my uni, St Andrews, isn't exactly a bad uni. It's as if they didn't really care about any of their students who didn't go to a RG uni. If schools bought into it less, I'm sure at least some of the grip that the RG seems to have would be reduced which can't be a bad thing in my eyes.

Reply 19

ajj2000