Don't vote Conservative ... We've came to far as human beings. Watch

username878267
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#181
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#181
(Original post by The_Mighty_Bush)
What strike are you talking about?

In any case, I have no problem with strikes (unless those unions are state-funded which many public sector unions are) but neither do I have a problem with businesses moving country in theory.


It's just unrealistic to expect that to happen and not to see people getting sacked. Plus some people on ZHCs don't want regular hours or a regular contract.
I believe it's very realistic. Every single person deserves a secure contract, with guaranteed hours and guaranteed pay.
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CurlyBen
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#182
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#182
(Original post by Bornblue)
They were totally wrong then and should be held to account and imo sanctioned.
I don't care if it's a left wing businessman or a right wing business, zhc are exploitation and need to be stopped.
It's politicians at it too. Including a large number of Labour politicians.

Still, who's going to be surprised at a hypocritical politician these days?
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username878267
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#183
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#183
(Original post by CurlyBen)
It's politicians at it too. Including a large number of Labour politicians.

Still, who's going to be surprised at a hypocritical politician these days?
If Labour politicians do it then sanction them too. It's unacceptable whether right or left wing people/organizations do it.

I'm not making a partisan point. I really believe they should be outlawed so the fact Labour or left wing organizations have done it is irrelevant, they should equally be condemned.
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billydisco
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#184
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#184
(Original post by Bornblue)
I believe it's very realistic. Every single person deserves a secure contract, with guaranteed hours and guaranteed pay.
No they do not. If a business cannot guarantee when it will receive work, why should employees have a guarantee?

Btw your idea would cause LOTS of people to lose jobs. An employer being forced to guarantee hours would cut many zero hour jobs to reduce risk.
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e aí rapaz
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#185
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#185
(Original post by meenu89)
Please do not use PoC to describe me either.
Yeah I cringe every time I see this, when did people start thinking this was an acceptable term?
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billydisco
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#186
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#186
(Original post by Bornblue)
So why not say G7? We've gone down from 'fastest in the world' to 'fastest in the G7'. To say we're the fastest in the world is simply lying. To say we're the fastest in the developed world, is also lying.
Stop manipulating statistics.
Are you ****ing stupid? This is why:

Two countries, some backward country in Africa and the UK:

2013 GDP:
Backward country in Africa: £10
UK: £1 trillion

2014 GDP:
Backward country in Africa £12.50
UK: £1.05 trillion

Is it really worthwhile including some **** country who only saw 25% growth because their economy was pathetic in the first place?

The UK had the fastest growth amongst all G7 countries, the Tory policies worked, deal with it mate.

Wanna know why it worked even more so, because they didn't have to rely on a credit or housing bubble, like Labour did. They didnt rely on a global economic boom, like Labour did. This was real hard-grafted growth when other countries are not growing.
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billydisco
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#187
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#187
(Original post by illegaltobepoor)
I like to think as a species we have done amazing things. At this current moment in time we are uniting across the internet and sharing huge amounts of knowledge. We are going forward.

But there is 1 thing holding us back and that is individual greed. A select few can hold a whole nation back. I don't want Britain to go back into Victorian feudalism. This is what the Conservatives represent. A corporate dystopia isn't a nation.

We need a nation. We need some form of collectivism.
Translated: You work hard so that I can have your money

(Original post by illegaltobepoor)
I don't care if its nationalism, social justice or a greener economy. We need a change because if we keep heading along this Tory road our country will be a nation for the top 10% and sod everyone else.

Most of you here are young and fragile. Your willing to accept ideas which appeal to you but a lot of you don't know the full meaning of them. Only time and results reveal the true meaning.

Most of you will earn average salaries of £25,000 to £35,000 instead of the promised thousands the Career guides tell you. There will be times when you find yourself unemployed or injured in life. No one is immortal.

And when you find yourselves in harms way the Tories will not have mercy for you. They will blame the economic problems on you!

So don't vote Conservative.
By the way, in your whole post you havent actually mentioned what the Tories have done wrong? :rolleyes:
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username878267
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#188
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#188
(Original post by billydisco)
Are you ****ing stupid? This is why:

Two countries, some backward country in Africa and the UK:

2013 GDP:
Backward country in Africa: £10
UK: £1 trillion

2014 GDP:
Backward country in Africa £12.50
UK: £1.05 trillion

Is it really worthwhile including some **** country who only saw 25% growth because their economy was pathetic in the first place?

The UK had the fastest growth amongst all G7 countries, the Tory policies worked, deal with it mate.

Wanna know why it worked even more so, because they didn't have to rely on a credit or housing bubble, like Labour did. They didnt rely on a global economic boom, like Labour did. This was real hard-grafted growth when other countries are not growing.
I'm not saying the UK didn't have the fastest growth in the G7, they did.
They did not however have the fastest growth in the world or even the 'developed' world which is the claim. To say they did is lying.

By all means say 'fastest in the G7'. By all means be proud of it, but it's f*****g annoying to lie and say it's the fastest in the developed world- it isn't.
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CurlyBen
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#189
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#189
(Original post by Bornblue)
If Labour politicians do it then sanction them too. It's unacceptable whether right or left wing people/organizations do it.

I'm not making a partisan point. I really believe they should be outlawed so the fact Labour or left wing organizations have done it is irrelevant, they should equally be condemned.
I wasn't suggesting that because Labour have used them justifies their use - just that their claim to any kind of moral high ground is somewhat dubious. Having said that, I suspect that limits or an outright ban on them will have unintended consequences, such as the jobs not being offered in the first place or people being let go before they would have to move to a fixed contract.

I'm also curious as to why the fixation is on zero hours contracts - I've worked as an agency worker on contracts not much more secure, and whilst my hours were stated if the company I was working for wanted to reduce my hours they could simply fire me on the spot (with no notice) and rehire me. In fact the zero-notice firing policy stung me once - I knew I was leaving so gave my employer a little over a week's notice, despite not being required to, and ("because it makes the payroll easier") I was told they wanted me to finish a week earlier than I had intended to. A £400 mistake on my part, that then meant none of the other agency staff gave any notice when they wanted to leave...
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MatureStudent36
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#190
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#190
(Original post by Bornblue)
I believe it's very realistic. Every single person deserves a secure contract, with guaranteed hours and guaranteed pay.
And what happens when a company can't guarantee those hours?

ZHC aren't an issue. Labour has created a non issue in order to away the non too bright.
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username878267
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#191
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#191
(Original post by CurlyBen)
I wasn't suggesting that because Labour have used them justifies their use - just that their claim to any kind of moral high ground is somewhat dubious. Having said that, I suspect that limits or an outright ban on them will have unintended consequences, such as the jobs not being offered in the first place or people being let go before they would have to move to a fixed contract.

I'm also curious as to why the fixation is on zero hours contracts - I've worked as an agency worker on contracts not much more secure, and whilst my hours were stated if the company I was working for wanted to reduce my hours they could simply fire me on the spot (with no notice) and rehire me. In fact the zero-notice firing policy stung me once - I knew I was leaving so gave my employer a little over a week's notice, despite not being required to, and ("because it makes the payroll easier") I was told they wanted me to finish a week earlier than I had intended to. A £400 mistake on my part, that then meant none of the other agency staff gave any notice when they wanted to leave...
You've experienced a similar situation and seen the consequences.
They should be outlawed.
The right wing argue that for a reduction of the public sector, that's okay but you then have to regulate the private sector to make sure people are not being exploited.
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MatureStudent36
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#192
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#192
(Original post by Bornblue)
I'm not saying the UK didn't have the fastest growth in the G7, they did.
They did not however have the fastest growth in the world or even the 'developed' world which is the claim. To say they did is lying.

By all means say 'fastest in the G7'. By all means be proud of it, but it's f*****g annoying to lie and say it's the fastest in the developed world- it isn't.
Are you still upset that the evonomy is growing.

I bet you're fuming that unemployement is coming down.

What is it in your private life that makes you unhappy that people are able to better thenselves.
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username878267
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#193
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#193
(Original post by MatureStudent36)
Are you still upset that the evonomy is growing.

I bet you're fuming that unemployement is coming down.

What is it in your private life that makes you unhappy that people are able to better thenselves.
Yawn.
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CurlyBen
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#194
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#194
(Original post by Bornblue)
You've experienced a similar situation and seen the consequences.
They should be outlawed.
The right wing argue that for a reduction of the public sector, that's okay but you then have to regulate the private sector to make sure people are not being exploited.
You think agency contracts should be banned as well?
Yes, I've seen the consequences - and at the time that contract suited me down to the ground, as I knew I was going to be leaving for another job as soon as it became available. I also know that if I'd stayed there for a whole year I would probably have lost the job at that point, as that was when they had to either get rid of agency staff or make them employees. Not many people became employees...
I appreciate that a relatively insecure contract isn't for everyone, but that doesn't mean they're wrong for everyone.
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username878267
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#195
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#195
(Original post by CurlyBen)
You think agency contracts should be banned as well?
Yes, I've seen the consequences - and at the time that contract suited me down to the ground, as I knew I was going to be leaving for another job as soon as it became available. I also know that if I'd stayed there for a whole year I would probably have lost the job at that point, as that was when they had to either get rid of agency staff or make them employees. Not many people became employees...
I appreciate that a relatively insecure contract isn't for everyone, but that doesn't mean they're wrong for everyone.
Turned into regular contracts, secure hours, secure pay, secure protections.
If you're going to argue for a reduction in the public sector you need to place more regulation and restrictions on the private sector.
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CurlyBen
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#196
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#196
(Original post by Bornblue)
Turned into regular contracts, secure hours, secure pay, secure protections.
If you're going to argue for a reduction in the public sector you need to place more regulation and restrictions on the private sector.
I'm guessing you've never worked in temporary employment?
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InArduisFouette
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#197
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#197
(Original post by MatureStudent36)
And what happens when a company can't guarantee those hours?

ZHC aren't an issue. Labour has created a non issue in order to away the non too bright.
PRSOM
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Jammy Duel
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#198
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#198
(Original post by Bornblue)
I've explained this 1000 times. Now you're purposely misinterpreting what I said. I want all those zhc to be turned into real conracts, guaranteeing them hours.
I want them in work on a secure contract, secure hours and secure pay.
In many cases either being ZHC in all but name, i.e. low number of hours part time with overtime, or simple unemployment, Say you have 10 people on ZHCs, you can translate that into 5 full time jobs, so you make it 5 full time jobs and get rid of the other 5.
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Jammy Duel
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#199
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#199
(Original post by Bornblue)
If you're going to argue for a reduction in the public sector you need to place more regulation and restrictions on the private sector.
Why?
You could even argue that if you regulate and restrict it it becomes the public sector again in all but name.
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illegaltobepoor
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#200
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#200
Zero Hour Contracts are just another form of Corporate Welfare for Cry Baby Capitalists. I use the term Cry Baby because you have businesses that don't want to take any risk and they want to put all the risks to the workers rather than themselves.

Oddly enough people are now having their tax credits sanctioned if they refuse to do additional hours. This is one thing which has changed under the introduction of Universal Credit.

But Zero Hour Contracts generally operate to the benefit of the employer and the financial instability of the worker. So now under these Job contracts workers are being forced to do as many hours as possible and then some weeks they are left with no work at all.

Employers think to themselves I don't need you this week so get lost.

It is my belief that workers need some bargaining power so they can play the same game to their employer.

Tories generally can only make business thrive under exploitative working conditions. They have a great record of it.
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