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    (Original post by Serpentine111)
    With a massive amount of studies showing red/processed meat increased risk of bowl cancer? Dietary cholesterol from animal products linked to heart disease and stroke?

    It is indeed "wrong" information so either these are extremely outdated textbooks (they thought smoking didn't affect your health for years) or you aren't telling the truth.
    Most people, including myself, don't eat a huge great pile of meat or animal products every single day. Everything in moderation is fine. I eat McDonalds and pizza etc occasionally, and I'm a perfectly healthy weight. Excess eating leads to obesity, even overeating on a vegan diet. Every day it seems a different thing causes cancer. If we followed every single piece of information of this type we wouldn't be able to enjoy anything in life. On the other hand I imagine people who do try to follow these restrictions sometimes have strokes/ get cancer etc.A lot of it is genetic and down to other environmental factors. I, for one, don't want to live like that.
    And my textbooks are neither outdated nor wrong.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    You can read my above post^


    Oh I have tons of examples of idiotic vegans, in fact why don't i just direct you to the vegan side of youtube.
    I also have tonnes of examples of idiotic meat eaters, how does that prove anything. You cannot brand all vegans under the same brush by a few idiotic teenagers on YouTube.
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    No, racism, sexism and homophobia are all human constructs. Killing and eating meat however is not, it has been seen as "the cycle of life" or the "food chain". Animals eat other animals, that is seen as "natural". I've never seen a homophobic lion, or a sexist bird. They are human constructs, you cannot compare the two.
    Lions will protect the in-group at the expense of the out-group, though, just as humans will. Does that make it any less wrong?

    Cannibalism is very prevalent in the wild. Does that mean that humans killing other humans for food is any less wrong than humans killing other humans because of their race?

    You're continuing to commit a fallacious appeal to nature, assigning special significance to an act because "it is natural". That has no bearing on whether it is morally right or not, and has no bearing even on how morally wrong it is.
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    (Original post by MotorboatMyGoat)
    I also have tonnes of examples of idiotic meat eaters, how does that prove anything. You cannot brand all vegans under the same brush by a few idiotic teenagers on YouTube.
    I said "SOME"

    How do you not understand that?

    This is my point, SOME VEGANS are idiots, and go to extreme lengths to promote their message and it does more harm than good.
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    TheALevelStudent remember the vegan ice cream?
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    I said "SOME"

    How do you not understand that?

    This is my point, SOME VEGANS are idiots, and go to extreme lengths to promote their message and it does more harm than good.
    No you didn't you said "Their ridiculous way of going about it makes them seem idiotic." "A lot of vegans are idiots"

    Even if you mean some, what point are you making, so what some are idiots. How does that discredit veganism, when the facts are all true?
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    (Original post by viddy9)
    Nothing in there says that humans are "supposed" to eat meat today though. Nothing at all.


    Science can be misrepresented, but misrepresentations of science remain wrong. I'm not misrepresenting the science, because I'm quoting from a review conducted by experts looking at the totality of the scientific evidence; that is, I'm not cherry-picking studies.

    I've met my burden of evidence, as a result: if you want to challenge the view that you can be just as healthy on a vegan diet, then please explain which nutrients one cannot get on a vegan diet, like the person who wrote the nonsense before (but at least he/she tried).


    No, my point was that psychopaths won't care about ethics or the environment. There are plenty of other reasons why people would hold ethical views but choose not to act on them, as you may be doing.


    Okay, so you have no ethical objection to killing humans to eat them. I am glad we have established that. In which case, there's really nothing more I can say, aside from the fact that we should recognise that our interests matter no less than the interests of any other sentient being. If we wouldn't like unnecessary suffering to be inflicted on us, we shouldn't be inflicting it on others.
    This really isn't going anywhere, is it? I could talk about the effort that would have to go into a fully balanced vegan diet, but to be honest, I have better things to do with my time. And at which point did humans change from needing to eat meat to not needing to eat meat? Was it a specific year? A specific day? In what country? Who decided this? It's your job as the group proposing the change to defeat every single study saying that it's perfectly fine to have an omnivorous diet. I'm not sure about the concept of 'we should recognise'-what makes you smarter than me or gives you the ability to tell me what to think? I'm not sure there's much of a point of me even bothering to reply here anymore since I'm apparently so 'ignorant' (although how that conclusion is reached is beyond me).
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    (Original post by MotorboatMyGoat)
    No you didn't you said "Their ridiculous way of going about it makes them seem idiotic." "A lot of vegans are idiots"

    Even if you mean some, what point are you making, so what some are idiots. How does that discredit veganism, when the facts are all true?
    My bad, "A lot of vegans".

    Did I say all?

    I said some, yes some are idiots. They go to extreme lengths to promote a message. I am not repeating myself for the 1000th time, if yu can't catch on to my point then it's your loss.
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    (Original post by BasingstokeBoy)
    And at which point did humans change from needing to eat meat to not needing to eat meat? Was it a specific year? A specific day? In what country? Who decided this?
    At the point in history where humans could attain all of the nutrients they needed without eating animal products (quite a long time ago). Humans aren't carnivores; they're omnivores. That means that they can choose to eat meat, or choose not to.

    (Original post by BasingstokeBoy)
    It's your job as the group proposing the change to defeat every single study saying that it's perfectly fine to have an omnivorous diet.
    I'm not arguing that we should abandon an omnivorous diet on health grounds, I'm arguing that we should do so to reduce the amount of suffering inflicted on animals, to reduce food prices in the developing world and to reduce our impact on the climate.

    I'm not saying that I can think better than you: I simply put forward an argument as to why we shouldn't inflict unnecessary suffering on other beings. You haven't attempted to refute it, but you're perfectly free to do so. If you persist with your viewpoint, then all I can say is that I hope I don't come across you in person, in case you try to kill me and eat me!
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    I feel dairly sorry for anyone vegan. (I'm not taking that pun back no matter what you do to me)
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    (Original post by BasingstokeBoy)
    This really isn't going anywhere, is it? I could talk about the effort that would have to go into a fully balanced vegan diet, but to be honest, I have better things to do with my time. And at which point did humans change from needing to eat meat to not needing to eat meat? Was it a specific year? A specific day? In what country? Who decided this? It's your job as the group proposing the change to defeat every single study saying that it's perfectly fine to have an omnivorous diet. I'm not sure about the concept of 'we should recognise'-what makes you smarter than me or gives you the ability to tell me what to think? I'm not sure there's much of a point of me even bothering to reply here anymore since I'm apparently so 'ignorant' (although how that conclusion is reached is beyond me).
    Our planet has never had over 6 billion people eating meat. It cannot sustain that amount of meat consumption. That is a fact. That is why something has to be done.

    I'd like to ask, could you look into the eyes of a cow, and shoot it point blank between them, and feel no guilt? Then fine, our argument is over with, carry on eating meat.
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    (Original post by AppleB)
    TheALevelStudent remember the vegan ice cream?
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    Yeah i dooo lmao
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    okay sorry





    its your fault for like sending me 30 private messages though! ahaha
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    (Original post by TheonlyMrsHolmes)
    My bad, "A lot of vegans".

    Did I say all?

    I said some, yes some are idiots. They go to extreme lengths to promote a message. I am not repeating myself for the 1000th time, if yu can't catch on to my point then it's your loss.
    I hear you, some are idiots. Point over with. But saying "a lot" is suggesting most are, when you have never met them.
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    (Original post by viddy9)
    If you persist with your viewpoint, then all I can say is that I hope I don't come across you in person, in case you try to kill me and eat me!
    I've said it before and I've said it again... vegans still wonder why people think they are pushy/patronising/arrogant/narcissistic/annoying? I thought we could end this maturely but no.
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    (Original post by Kittyboy)
    Vegan.. were you joking?

    I can understand vegetarians, but vegans are just weirdos tbh.
    Vegans are weird? Yet animal-eaters like to eat cow pus filled milk that is biologically designed for cattle (believe it or not) with mammal growing hormones, eat the decomposing corpse flesh of tortured bird and other livestock pumped full of harmful antibiotics with microscopic fecal matter, pesticides to prevent it from rotting in a plastic bag, and chicken periods (eggs) by paying people to slaughter and rape animals to eat, but vegans who eat fruits, veggies, nuts, seeds and drink milk made from almonds and other vegan produce are weird? We are herbivorous beings, but it's strange to think what you consider as 'weird'.
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    (Original post by MotorboatMyGoat)
    Our planet has never had over 6 billion people eating meat. It cannot sustain that amount of meat consumption. That is a fact. That is why something has to be done.

    I'd like to ask, could you look into the eyes of a cow, and shoot it point blank between them, and feel no guilt? Then fine, our argument is over with, carry on eating meat.
    Well I guess this is over then. Good day and goodbye.
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    (Original post by BasingstokeBoy)
    I've said it before and I've said it again... vegans still wonder why people think they are pushy/patronising/arrogant/narcissistic/annoying? I thought we could end this maturely but no.
    Jesus it's a joke..
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    (Original post by BasingstokeBoy)
    I've said it before and I've said it again... vegans still wonder why people think they are pushy/patronising/arrogant/narcissistic/annoying? I thought we could end this maturely but no.
    You said:

    What if I do think killing another being to eat it is fine? The species is irrelevant.
    Unless I am not another being, this means that you could potentially kill me to eat me!
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    (Original post by MotorboatMyGoat)
    Jesus it's a joke..
    ... That's your definition of a joke...?
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    (Original post by viddy9)
    Thanks for the reply, but I find this argument very unconvincing. The fact that something is natural has no bearing on whether it is right, so the fact that killing for meat is natural doesn't make it somehow different from human oppression.

    And, while racism may not be strictly natural (as genetic differences between races are very small), protecting the in-group and competing against (and discriminating against) the out-group is, because it's "natural" to try to propagate your genes. That doesn't make discriminating against people who are genetically distant any more right. Discriminating against people who look different to you was the natural thing to do centuries ago, and for some people it is even today.

    I agree that these tactics may turn some people off, but that's a separate matter to whether the comparisons are valid or not.

    Racism, sexism, homophobia and so on have, in the past and even today, been defended because they are "natural". Those who have fought and who continue to fight against these forms of discrimination have always made the point that, whether they are natural or not, that has no bearing on whether they are right. Speciesism is just as discriminatory as racism, sexism and homophobia, and, without trivialising the plight of humans, the fact of the matter is that we've never had a situation in which tens of billions of humans were confined, transported and slaughtered in horrific conditions every single year.
    It is not the same thing. As another said, I actually study A2 psychology and part of my course is learning dieting/food preferences through evolutionary.

    Humans actually started eating meat because 1) It contains nutrients that helped developed the brain back then and 2) Because there was a decline in forests which meant that humans had no other choice to hunt for different ways to get food so that meant hunting animals, if they didn't hunt for animals, the Human species would have died out.

    Slavery however, started because a racial group of people thought they were superior to another group of race and enslaved them for many years. There is no evolutionary process for man slaughtering an entire race for years and years.

    Comparing slavery to humans eating meat is disgusting and offensive. I can understand why you would want to promote eating plant based foods over meat but comparing it is slavery is just one way too far and it's disturbing.
 
 
 
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