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Muslim group urges members to break fast and donate blood after Orlando shootings Watch

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    (Original post by QE2)
    And there we have it again.
    The pretence at condemnation, but using weasel words to allow condoning the killing of those who you think deserve it.

    Why can't you just say "We absolutely, unequivocally and unreservedly condemn the killing of anybody on the basis of religious belief, whatever the apparent justification".

    It really isn't that hard. Just C&P the sentence above, if you like.
    As I have stated in other posts: I am not your circus animal where I have to jump through hoops to entertain your audience, or where refusing to jump through hoops forms the pretence that your circus show is going well because I am avoiding your hoops. Accept what I have said and move on.
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    (Original post by 34908seikj)
    http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/in...prayer_se.html

    A Metro Detroit Muslim group plans to hold a prayer service Tuesday night for the victims in the Sunday mass shooting in Orlando that left 50 people dead and over 50 people injured.

    The Ahmadiyya Muslim Community Center in Rochester Hills will host the service, and is encouraging its members to break fast in order to donate blood for those in need.
    Many Muslims abstain from eating or drinking during daylight hours through the Islamic month of Ramadan, which began Sunday.
    good idea but why not just donate blood when your not fasting.
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    (Original post by Another)
    I was genuinely taken aback by this. Now I wish that there was a God in heaven, who could bless these people abundantly! Such selfless charity is very rare in this day and age

    Also, if you're one of those people who say "They aren't true Muslims" to try and discredit their actions, you are a fool. Neither is it the point of the main article, nor does anyone care.
    We don't disredit their actions; we just don't accept them as Muslims - there is a difference. Muslims care because we don't like non-Muslims telling us what a Muslim is - we define that for ourselves.
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    (Original post by lolpool)
    good idea but why not just donate blood when your not fasting.
    Because the people who need blood can't wait until their fast is over?
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    As I have stated in other posts: I am not your circus animal where I have to jump through hoops to entertain your audience, or where refusing to jump through hoops forms the pretence that your circus show is going well because I am avoiding your hoops. Accept what I have said and move on.
    I am well aware that you will not unequivocally condemn any and all ideologically justified killing on the basis of belief. Because you can't.

    In fact, I am yet to encouter a Muslim who will.

    I am not suggesting that you support the killing of unrepentant Ahmediyya (under the appropriate Islamic conditions). But you steadfastly refuse to condemn it. So...
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    we don't like non-Muslims telling us what a Muslim is - we define that for ourselves.
    Just as they do.
    Just warming up the valves on my ACME Irony-o-Meter™. I'll tell you what the reading was later.
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    (Original post by 34908seikj)
    Because the people who need blood can't wait until their fast is over?
    How inconsiderate. Don't they know how important it is to not eat while it is light, then stuff yourself when it is dark?
    Priorities, dear boy.
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    We don't disredit their actions; we just don't accept them as Muslims - there is a difference. Muslims care because we don't like non-Muslims telling us what a Muslim is - we define that for ourselves.
    I'm sure that Ahmaddiya also get very annoyed, when different sects love to define their own religion for them! They can also define what they are by themselves.

    (Original post by QE2)
    I am well aware that you will not unequivocally condemn any and all ideologically justified killing on the basis of belief. Because you can't.

    In fact, I am yet to encouter a Muslim who will.
    I have. Unfortunately, she is Ahmadiyya, so that probably doesn't count.
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    Many of the Ahamdiyyah aren't stupid enough to claim he is a prophet but say he was the messiah and all this other guff too, which is what I already pointed out in my post. But Mirza Ghulam Ahmad still claimed to receive divine revelation, which would thus make him a prophet or messenger... anywho, their beliefs are kufr by Ijmah of both Sunni and Shia scholars.

    If someone claims they are Ahmadi, their beliefs are beyond the normal band of differences that say occur between a Sunni and a Shi'i, and therefore I cannot give them benefit of the doubt unless he is able to tell me he is Muslim otherwise; for the sake of peace I don't make takfir to people's faces for the hell of it because there is no point, but like if I know a person is Ahmadi I would never pray behind him or anything...

    Saying 'focus on yourselves and stop judging others' is a cop out and ironically a reason why the Ummah is fragmented in the first place - giving deviance room to breathe is why people people's aqeedah differs so much from one person to the next, which is why you will have a Sufi, a Salafi, an Ithna Ashari, a Zaydi, an Ibadi, a Barelwi, an Ishmaeli etc etc. I cannot unite with someone upon Kufr and I do not frankly want to unite on Kufr - people go on about unity this and unity that but this means very little when unity on the deen can't even be achieved.

    This is a religion of daleel indeed; I have never seen any to prove that the Ahmadiyyah are Muslim, only daleel which testifies against them. The danger is the blind following of those who call to unity with those upon falsehood.
    Can you be more specific than just saying "divine revelation". Do you mean for the Quran, or communication by God. The latter can be to anyone frankly.

    Interesting. Would you pray behind any Muslim outside of your denomination/sect? Or is this specifically Ahmadis.

    How on earth is respecting others peoples beliefs, and saying "All judgement is for Allah, not us who commit sins continuously" fragmenting the Muslim ummah? Never have I heard such drivel. If they claim to be Muslim, then respect their opinion and treat them as brothers/sisters. Yes of course, naming them "non muslims" and thus inevitably leading to their harm is clearly uniting everyone.

    There are many stances where we have a common denominator (the belief in God, justice, prophethood, general Islamic laws and teachings). The only point people are making is about the Holy Prophet not being seen as the final Prophet, but on the contrary, there are Ahmadiy scholars that have argued against this.

    Anyway, my humble opinion is that we don't have the right to decide who are Muslims. The irony being, we have no guarantee for ourselves, so how can we judge others. For even Prophet Yusuf prayed " Tawafini Musliman".
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    (Original post by Another)
    I have. Unfortunately, she is Ahmadiyya, so that probably doesn't count.
    It counts with me. I stand corrected!
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    Thank you for the link.
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    (Original post by champ_mc99)
    I'm pretty sure there's a quote by him saying he's part of the prophet. I'll find it later.

    It is slightly ironic how mirza seemed to want to ostracise his sect from the rest of us. He didn't do a funeral prayer for his son because of this.
    That's actually very intriguing.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    Just as they do.
    Just warming up the valves on my ACME Irony-o-Meter™. I'll tell you what the reading was later.
    The consensus of scholars says that they are not Muslims which therefore acts as a collective self-determination within the Muslim community.

    Aside from this discussion, you are like 26 or 28 or something, so you don't need to use childish gimmicks like your Irony metre or say "No true muslim TM" or other such things - it just makes you sound immature lmao
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    Zamestaneh how many quotesyou on? :rofl:
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    (Original post by cupcakes87)
    Zamestaneh how many quotesyou on? :rofl:
    There's probably like 4 from this thread that I need to respond to but it's getting laborious now :lol:
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    There's probably like 4 from this thread that I need to respond to but it's getting laborious now :lol:
    go look after puppy then, stop wasting your time here :lol:
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    The consensus of scholars says that they are not Muslims which therefore acts as a collective self-determination within the Muslim community.
    Clearly not the entire Muslim community.

    Aside from this discussion, you are like 26 or 28 or something, so you don't need to use childish gimmicks like your Irony metre or say "No true muslim TM" or other such things - it just makes you sound immature lmao
    Thanks. I'll bear that in mind.

    Hold on, my ACME Irony-o-Meter™, has flagged up your statement as "somewhat ironic". Apparently, still believing in fairy tales is a sign of immaturity.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    Clearly not the entire Muslim community.

    Thanks. I'll bear that in mind.

    Hold on, my ACME Irony-o-Meter™, has flagged up your statement as "somewhat ironic". Apparently, still believing in fairy tales is a sign of immaturity.
    My Derp-o-Meter flagged up that it would be considered hypocrisy, not irony. Expected more from you, but perhaps your memory is slipping in your old age. It's funny when you trip over your own ego. Do continue.
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    My Derp-o-Meter flagged up that it would be considered hypocrisy, not irony. Expected more from you, but perhaps your memory is slipping in your old age. It's funny when you trip over your own ego. Do continue.
    No. It would only be hypocrisy if you had called me immature for believing in fairy tales, when you do the same thing. It is ironic because you accused me of being immature when the subject of discussion is, in itself, something that is universally agreed to be a sign of immaturity.
    And remember, it only flagged it as "somewhat ironic", so it doesn't have to tick every definitional box.

    Don't bring an abc book to a dictionary fight.
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    (Original post by QE2)
    No. It would only be hypocrisy if you had called me immature for believing in fairy tales, when you do the same thing. It is ironic because you accused me of being immature when the subject of discussion is, in itself, something that is universally agreed to be a sign of immaturity.
    And remember, it only flagged it as "somewhat ironic", so it doesn't have to tick every definitional box.

    Don't bring an abc book to a dictionary fight.
    It would be classified as perceived hypocrisy because I was labelling you as immature, and you are equally accusing me of being immature; it doesn't matter that the specific reason differs because the general reason (perceived childishness) is still present and is common between you and I.
    Which subject of discussion? The Ahmadiyyah discussion? The discussion regarding your childish Irony-o-metre and use of 'TM' because it ammuses you? I would agree the latter is immature which is why I brought it up; if it's immature to bring it up how immature you are, then how will you ever rectify yourself and act like the near-30 year old you are supposed to act like if no one can legitimately call you out for acting like a child in a playground? :rofl:
 
 
 
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