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Anatheme
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#181
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#181
(Original post by Sapientia)
Are you still thinking of doing Linguistics at Cambridge after your Russian/Arabic degree? I remember you mentioning it to me a while back. Do you regret your choice?
Yep, if I manage to find a pot of gold somewhere, I'm probably gonna give it a go :holmes:. I don't really regret my choice, I can't think of anything else I'd rather do as my first degree, but I really like Linguistics, and if I can study it at some point in my life, that'd be awesome. In the meanwhile, I can read all the books in the world about Linguistics (or at least the two hundreds or so that I came across while looking for Pimsleur Swedish :erm:) and stalk you, so I can prepare and learn :sexface:. Although, right now, I should probably try to find a house that isn't too dodgy.
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Supergrunch
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#182
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#182
There are some fun linguistics puzzles here, if anyone's interested. (I've only done the Amharic one, which was cool)
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Sapientia
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#183
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#183
(Original post by Supergrunch)
There are some fun linguistics puzzles here, if anyone's interested. (I've only done the Amharic one, which was cool)
Oh, they are interesting. Thanks, these will keep me occupied when I have a spare moment.
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Anatheme
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#184
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#184
I did the Tadjik one. I failed because I wrote 'neighbour' instead of 'neighbor'...
The Turkish one is a bit tricky 'cause there's no feminine or masculine and you can't really tell from the examples if a word ending in -a will have an a-related plural or not (masa does, but so does 'adam'...) Carrots and houses are getting on my nerves, I'll try to give them more than 5min next time. I can't do all of them because the computer I use is gay, so I can't check if my French is dire or not .
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Ranimbac
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#185
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#185
(Original post by Anatheme)
The Turkish one is a bit tricky 'cause there's no feminine or masculine and you can't really tell from the examples if a word ending in -a will have an a-related plural or not (masa does, but so does 'adam'...)
It's vowel harmony: if the last vowel of the root is -a, then the suffixes will have -a. More specifically, the vowels of the suffixes have to agree with the last vowel of the root in backness.
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Anatheme
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#186
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#186
(Original post by Ranimbac)
It's vowel harmony: if the last vowel of the root is -a, then the suffixes will have -a. More specifically, the vowels of the suffixes have to agree with the last vowel of the root in backness.
Yeah, that's what I eventually worked out, but it was strange at the beginning, given that I'm used to languages with genders :holmes:
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EWS
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#187
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#187
New people! Hi!

I'm working as a substitute teacher at the local school at the moment, so the only thing remotely related to linguistics I have time for is going through basic Norwegian grammar with my eleven-year-olds.

Look forward to meeting you all!
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Sapientia
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#188
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#188
(Original post by EWS)
New people! Hi!

I'm working as a substitute teacher at the local school at the moment, so the only thing remotely related to linguistics I have time for is going through basic Norwegian grammar with my eleven-year-olds.

Look forward to meeting you all!
I checked your profile and thought "this guy totally headbangs to metal music at night", owing to the Norway thing and the hair.

Turns out Kate Nash proved me wrong. :p:

Looking forward to meeting y'all too. Apprehensive about drowning in the 'bridge but excited nonetheless.
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CeiriosII
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#189
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#189
(Original post by EWS)
New people! Hi!

I'm working as a substitute teacher at the local school at the moment, so the only thing remotely related to linguistics I have time for is going through basic Norwegian grammar with my eleven-year-olds.

Look forward to meeting you all!
Hiya

At risk of sounding like a freak before you even meet me, I'm soooo jealous you're from Norway :P My insurance choice was Scandinavian studies & linguistics at Edinburgh... my language was going to be Norwegian and I'd have spent my third year in Bergen *sighs* never mind... I'm sure there will be other opportunities to go to Norway, and the Nordic countries in general.. I'll have to do a tour =D

Anyways, looking forward to meeting you too
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EWS
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#190
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#190
(Original post by CeiriosII)
Hiya

At risk of sounding like a freak before you even meet me, I'm soooo jealous you're from Norway :P My insurance choice was Scandinavian studies & linguistics at Edinburgh... my language was going to be Norwegian and I'd have spent my third year in Bergen *sighs*
Not to worry, the constant rainfall and windiness get old quite soon. On the other hand, if the Welsh dragon indicates Welshness, you might have encountered a fair bit of that already.

never mind... I'm sure there will be other opportunities to go to Norway, and the Nordic countries in general.. I'll have to do a tour =D

Anyways, looking forward to meeting you too
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Anatheme
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#191
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#191
I thought I'd share my fact with you lots, because you probably care more than others about that kind of stuff and because I've already started hijacking the thread anyway…

Currently being in Syria and having private lessons for colloquial Arabic (surprisingly different from Modern Standard Arabic, it's fascinating to see what diglossia really is), my teacher (and Arabs in general), pronounces all his "P" as "B"s, like in "Japan" or "people", they regularly become "Jaban" and "beoble".

I thought it might be because they couldn't hear the difference, given that there's no P sound in Arabic, and loan words such as "computer" become "combuter", but after asking, it turns out they can, and that they just don't. Whereas it's because they're lazy, or need to get used to the sound, I know not, although I find it strange, because surely when you learn a language, you make an effort to learn the new sounds? :holmes:

And you should have a look at the root and pattern system of the language, you might find it interesting (I know I do :gah:). That's all for today, hope you won't my the hijacking
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EWS
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#192
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#192
8.9 fact right there.
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Anatheme
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#193
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#193
I meant "mind", not "my". I speak too many languages at the same time, it does me no good. Apart, maybe, from the fact that I will definitely become the Queen of the Pictionnary by the end of the year (we have to pay a fine for every time we talk English in the classroom :ninja:, so we mime and draw, when we can't explain. It's fun.)
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Supergrunch
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#194
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#194
Anatheme, there's a big difference between being able to make a phonetic distinction in a specific context (i.e. when you give a speaker a minimal pair), and being able to apply it phonemically across the board. For instance, if you gave them specific examples, monolingual native English speakers would be able to tell the difference between, say, ejective and non-ejective p, but as this distinction isn't present in the language phonemically (or even allophonically), they'd probably have a much harder time trying to cope with a language with both ejective and non-ejective p as phonemes. I'd guess that's why your teachers pronouce English as they do.

And EWS, in my experience Norwegians are all amazing at linguistics, so enjoy. :p:
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CeiriosII
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#195
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#195
(Original post by Anatheme)
I thought I'd share my fact with you lots, because you probably care more than others about that kind of stuff and because I've already started hijacking the thread anyway…

Currently being in Syria and having private lessons for colloquial Arabic (surprisingly different from Modern Standard Arabic, it's fascinating to see what diglossia really is), my teacher (and Arabs in general), pronounces all his "P" as "B"s, like in "Japan" or "people", they regularly become "Jaban" and "beoble".

I thought it might be because they couldn't hear the difference, given that there's no P sound in Arabic, and loan words such as "computer" become "combuter", but after asking, it turns out they can, and that they just don't. Whereas it's because they're lazy, or need to get used to the sound, I know not, although I find it strange, because surely when you learn a language, you make an effort to learn the new sounds? :holmes:

And you should have a look at the root and pattern system of the language, you might find it interesting (I know I do :gah:). That's all for today, hope you won't my the hijacking
Heh, that's really odd... mind you, if I could get away with not saying french r's I would =D I guess that's as annoying for them as people not pronouncing the welsh Ll is for me though.
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Anatheme
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#196
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#196
(Original post by Supergrunch)
Anatheme, there's a big difference between being able to make a phonetic distinction in a specific context (i.e. when you give a speaker a minimal pair), and being able to apply it phonemically across the board. For instance, if you gave them specific examples, monolingual native English speakers would be able to tell the difference between, say, ejective and non-ejective p, but as this distinction isn't present in the language phonemically (or even allophonically), they'd probably have a much harder time trying to cope with a language with both ejective and non-ejective p as phonemes. I'd guess that's why your teachers pronouce English as they do.
So that'd be like my using the wrong "H" or "S" or "D" sounds in Arabic, basically? His English isn't perfect he "sends massages" and have "launch" :p:, and my university teacher doesn't have this problem whatsoever, from what I heard, that said, her level is better than that of my colloquial teacher's. Another thing, they are perfectly fine with French Ps, but then again, probably because the people I've talked to have practiced it longer.

I decided I'd just learn roots and patterns from now own. It's easier than remember vocab. "K-T-B" can make "kitaab" (book), "maktaba" (desk, library), "katib" (to write), etc, and for verbs, if you apply different forms (there's 10), it gives them different meanings, sometimes the relation is obvious, sometimes, it really isn't (it can be like "to leave one's home" and "to cut something off" or you get stuff like "go in a straight line" and "make tabouleh", lol).
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EWS
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#197
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#197
(Original post by Supergrunch)
And EWS, in my experience Norwegians are all amazing at linguistics, so enjoy. :p:
Thanks, that's encouraging. Were there any Norwegians on your course? From what I've heard there are hardly anyone around, but maybe I am terribly mistaken.
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Canned Door
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#198
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#198
Hey guys. I'm taking a paper in Comparative Romance this year in MML. The reading for it is very nice when it's talking about all the different languages, great. Liking this. Can understand it. Then it starts talking about Generativism, Grammatical Relations, Parameters & tother P, etc. and I have no idea about these. I'm sure we'll get some advice on this once the course starts, but do any of you have any advice on this? Like, could you recommend a book/online resource which explains what all these different approaches to linguistics are in a nice broad easy concise way? I don't know how important this will turn out to be in the context of my paper, but I don't think I'll be able to/want to escape it completely!

Cheers guys
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EWS
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#199
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#199
Not sure it deals with all the topics you mentioned, but for the Chomsky stuff (P&P, etc.) I've enjoyed 'Chomsky's Universal Grammar' by V J Cook and M Newson. There are probably exhaustive book lists for each of your topics in their Wikipedia entries.
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Supergrunch
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#200
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#200
(Original post by Anatheme)
So that'd be like my using the wrong "H" or "S" or "D" sounds in Arabic, basically?
Yeah, precisely like that. Of course, as you say, more experienced speakers would probably get over these difficulties, at least to an extent.
(Original post by EWS)
Thanks, that's encouraging. Were there any Norwegians on your course? From what I've heard there are hardly anyone around, but maybe I am terribly mistaken.
No, not doing my course - all the Norwegian linguists I've met have been studying in Norway, but there do seem to be a lot of them.
(Original post by Canned Door)
Hey guys. I'm taking a paper in Comparative Romance this year in MML. The reading for it is very nice when it's talking about all the different languages, great. Liking this. Can understand it. Then it starts talking about Generativism, Grammatical Relations, Parameters & tother P, etc. and I have no idea about these. I'm sure we'll get some advice on this once the course starts, but do any of you have any advice on this? Like, could you recommend a book/online resource which explains what all these different approaches to linguistics are in a nice broad easy concise way? I don't know how important this will turn out to be in the context of my paper, but I don't think I'll be able to/want to escape it completely!

Cheers guys
Is your lecturer Adam Ledgeway? If so the grammatical aspects may be relatively advanced, but probably still less so than, say the first year linguistics structures and meanings module. Your best bet is probably an introduction to Chomskyan ideas, maybe The Language Organ: Linguistics as Cognitive Psychology by Stephen R. Anderson and David Lightfoot. Something like Stephen Pinker's The Language Instinct would also introduce you to some of these concepts in a very readable way, but might be a bit too pop-sciencey.
(Original post by EWS)
Not sure it deals with all the topics you mentioned, but for the Chomsky stuff (P&P, etc.) I've enjoyed 'Chomsky's Universal Grammar' by V J Cook and M Newson. There are probably exhaustive book lists for each of your topics in their Wikipedia entries.
Cook and Newson is probably a bit too much the other way - while definitely introductory, it gets quite technical, and if generative grammar is only a part of your course, then you'll probably find it goes into more detail than you need. And I wouldn't trust Wikipedia for linguistics, it's notoriously dodgy at that. You might find the reading lists on the Cambridge linguistics website more helpful - look at general linguistics, structures and meanings, and syntax if you're feeling brave.
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