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How to be attractive (all of TSR should read this) watch

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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    Women have more suitors then men.

    Go into any TSR profile here of an active female member, I bet you any money they have multiple men writing on their wall. But if you go into a guys profile, they have a fraction of that.

    Another example:

    Say you have 10 job offers, you are likely to be extremely picky as you are in the position to be in. Whereas if you have 0 job offers, you will take anything that comes along.

    Or if you are a corporate, have a grad scheme, 6000 apply, you can do the same with the selection process.

    In the dating game, this is the reality for most women.

    Simple economics.

    We are all products. Every man when they approach a woman is selling themselves, it is up to her if she wants to buy that product. Crudely put.

    As for the lonely desperate men paying 1000 quid on a bootcamp, They are doing it because they want to improve their sex life and have no where to turn. Chances are for many of these men if they dropped 1000 on a trip to europe, they would probably not have sex with any girl during that time. Different country, same problem.
    Yeah, because in our culture men do the approaching, you must know that? As long as you are confident in approachimg women, it isn't a disadvantage. We actually choose the girls we approach, whereas girls have to take what they're offered. They might get ten offers, but all bad jobs for them- we can apply to as many dream jobs as we want.

    You just sound like you're making excuses, like a lot of people on here.

    That isn't supply and demand. Say there's a hundred single young men and a hundred single young women. Maybe 90 of the girls want boyfriends, but only 70 of the guys want girlfriends, the rest would rather stay single. There is a greater supply of women, so we have the advantage.

    I know not everyone shares my love of travelling, but my point was that's nuts, they must be so desperate to spend that on trying to get laid.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    Yeah, because in our culture men do the approaching, you must know that? As long as you are confident in approachimg women, it isn't a disadvantage. We actually choose the girls we approach, whereas girls have to take what they're offered. They might get ten offers, but all bad jobs for them- we can apply to as many dream jobs as we want.

    You just sound like you're making excuses, like a lot of people on here.

    That isn't supply and demand. Say there's a hundred single young men and a hundred single young women. Maybe 90 of the girls want boyfriends, but only 70 of the guys want girlfriends, the rest would rather stay single. There is a greater supply of women, so we have the advantage.

    I know not everyone shares my love of travelling, but my point was that's nuts, they must be so desperate to spend that on trying to get laid.
    There is a reason why many guys don't approach and it has nothing to do with their egos.

    Leicester square in London is really famous for its pick up scene. But from knowing guys who just approach approach approach, and being a guy who has done it. It can be pretty soul destroying. The rejections after a while eat at your sub-concious.

    Not to mention, if you are an unlucky sod, you can get kicked out of bars/clubs for harassing girls. This is what the GAME DOESNT tell you!

    The best way IMO to get a girl is through friends, the night I made a move on my ex, I got rejected by 1 girl when attempting to kiss her, 3 others fobbed me off, then 1 guy tried to kiss me. Then came my ex, who rejected me when I asked for her number. Later we added each other on facebook, and the rest was history.

    It was pretty ****ed up. I don't blame guys not wanting to go through this ****.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    I know not everyone shares my love of travelling, but my point was that's nuts, they must be so desperate to spend that on trying to get laid.
    As for this point; these guys see it as an investment like hiring a personal trainer to get into shape. I don't think you can hold it against them, at least they are actively trying to improve their dating life.
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    I think it's down to luck. One of my mates is pretty good looking, clever and fun and I don't remotely fancy him. Probably because he reminds me of my brother. But see, there's nothing wrong with him, and yet I don't fancy him. The guy I do fancy, on the other hand, is generally met with responses of "Seriously, him?" by my friends, because they don't see why I find him attractive. There are plenty of nice, attractive, fun people in the world, and I will never be able to fancy them all, so why does it stand to reason that I'd fancy any of them? And it's basically chance whether someone you like actually likes you back, at the end of the day. I could spend all day trying to make people fall in love with me, if I don't fancy any of them there's no point whatsoever, and I can't make myself attracted to someone. You just can't.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    There is a reason why many guys don't approach and it has nothing to do with their egos.

    Leicester square in London is really famous for its pick up scene. But from knowing guys who just approach approach approach, and being a guy who has done it. It can be pretty soul destroying. The rejections after a while eat at your sub-concious.

    Not to mention, if you are an unlucky sod, you can get kicked out of bars/clubs for harassing girls. This is what the GAME DOESNT tell you!

    The best way IMO to get a girl is through friends, the night I made a move on my ex, I got rejected by 1 girl when attempting to kiss her, 3 others fobbed me off, then 1 guy tried to kiss me. Then came my ex, who rejected me when I asked for her number. Later we added each other on facebook, and the rest was history.

    It was pretty ****ed up. I don't blame guys not wanting to go through this ****.
    I didn't say anything about egos, just confidence (unless you consider them synonyms, but I'd say "ego" has pretty negative connetations).

    Why would you go somewhere "famous for its pick up scene"? Just go to a normal bar/club. That sounds like adding pressure.

    You shouldn't be "harassing" girls. If the lady says no, the lady says no. Nowhere is going to kick you out for a normal approach.

    I'd agree through friends is good, but obviously you've got to wait for those opportunities, there's no reason not to approach other girls in the mean time.

    I don't really see what's so terrible about that, that's normal, you've got to realise that happens to every guy, so there's no reason to take it personally. I always saw pulling as a bonus- I'd go out and have fun with my mates, then at some point try it on with a few girls. If that goes well, great, if not, fine, I'll just hang some more with my mates. Often I'd have a good chat with a girl, she wouldn't want to get with me, but at least we'd have some fun. You've got enjoy the chase. But I do understand the rejection can be pretty brutal if your self esteem is low (which mine was at the start).

    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    As for this point; these guys see it as an investment like hiring a personal trainer to get into shape. I don't think you can hold it against them, at least they are actively trying to improve their dating life.
    I'm not having a go at them, just supporting your statement that they're vulnerable and being exploited by the PUA "pros" who charge crazy sums of money.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    I didn't say anything about egos, just confidence (unless you consider them synonyms, but I'd say "ego" has pretty negative connetations).

    Why would you go somewhere "famous for its pick up scene"? Just go to a normal bar/club. That sounds like adding pressure.

    You shouldn't be "harassing" girls. If the lady says no, the lady says no. Nowhere is going to kick you out for a normal approach.

    I'd agree through friends is good, but obviously you've got to wait for those opportunities, there's no reason not to approach other girls in the mean time.

    I don't really see what's so terrible about that, that's normal, you've got to realise that happens to every guy, so there's no reason to take it personally. I always saw pulling as a bonus- I'd go out and have fun with my mates, then at some point try it on with a few girls. If that goes well, great, if not, fine, I'll just hang some more with my mates. Often I'd have a good chat with a girl, she wouldn't want to get with me, but at least we'd have some fun. You've got enjoy the chase. But I do understand the rejection can be pretty brutal if your self esteem is low (which mine was at the start).
    For the record I haven't personally been kicked out of clubs etc Going around approaching 100 girls in a night club, until 1 says yes, is not my idea of a good time.

    I just know this ****, because I know the scene. I know what they do.

    The point I was trying to make, rejection can be brutal.

    Fortunately many girls will never have to experience it.

    As much as I have criticised the PUAs, I do have a lot of respect for pick up artists, the one's who are very persistent, because it requires a lot of balls to do what they do.

    Rather then *****ing, they are out there right now, getting shot down. But again, if you really look at it for what it is, they are not "pick up artists", they are the same as a guy writing 100 job applications until someone gives them a break (i.e. playing the number game)

    That is what "the game" was all about. Which many girls do not understand.


    I'm not having a go at them, just supporting your statement that they're vulnerable and being exploited by the PUA "pros" who charge crazy sums of money.
    Yes, this is a massive problem in the community.

    The trouble is, it is not exclusive to the PUA world.

    Therapists are guilty of this.

    Life coaches are guilty of this.

    and so on.
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    (Original post by Maid Marian)
    Wish I was...
    We should form a club..

    I think the OP is so right lol.. I now know what my problems are... The biggest one being I'm a *****.. I used to say I can't help it but the truth is I can.. Thank you for your words of wisdom
    Say hi to Yoda for me
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    For the record I haven't personally been kicked out of clubs etc Going around approaching 100 girls in a night club, until 1 says yes, is not my idea of a good time.

    I just know this ****, because I know the scene. I know what they do.

    The point I was trying to make, rejection can be brutal.

    Fortunately many girls will never have to experience it.

    As much as I have criticised the PUAs, I do have a lot of respect for pick up artists, the one's who are very persistent, because it requires a lot of balls to do what they do.

    Rather then *****ing, they are out there right now, getting shot down. But again, if you really look at it for what it is, they are not "pick up artists", they are the same as a guy writing 100 job applications until someone gives them a break (i.e. playing the number game)

    That is what "the game" was all about. Which many girls do not understand.

    Yes, this is a massive problem in the community.

    The trouble is, it is not exclusive to the PUA world.

    Therapists are guilty of this.

    Life coaches are guilty of this.

    and so on.
    Oh good. Approaching every girl is stupid, they're going to see you doing it and you'll just look pathetic. At least have some sort of filter.

    Well me too, I club a lot, and when I was single I tried to pull a lot too, so I know what it's like. I feel you can either get bitter about it, or improve yourself. But yeah, before my current girlfriend I was infactuated with three girls at different times and they all rejected me in one way or another, plus the masses of random club girls. But once I got to uni and started doing better, suddenly the rejections weren't as bad, I could think "whatever, I got with that fit girl two days ago so I'm clearly alright".

    I've never really known anyone who does that strategy to be honest. More often people say they'll approach loads of girls, then don't when we're actually out.

    I agree, there's lots of people looking for a sucker with money, "a fool and his money are soon parted" and all that.
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    (Original post by aspirinpharmacist)
    I think it's down to luck. One of my mates is pretty good looking, clever and fun and I don't remotely fancy him. Probably because he reminds me of my brother. But see, there's nothing wrong with him, and yet I don't fancy him. The guy I do fancy, on the other hand, is generally met with responses of "Seriously, him?" by my friends, because they don't see why I find him attractive. There are plenty of nice, attractive, fun people in the world, and I will never be able to fancy them all, so why does it stand to reason that I'd fancy any of them? And it's basically chance whether someone you like actually likes you back, at the end of the day. I could spend all day trying to make people fall in love with me, if I don't fancy any of them there's no point whatsoever, and I can't make myself attracted to someone. You just can't.
    Luck plays a part only insofar as your personalities have to be compatible. If it were just down to luck then there wouldn't be a clear trend of people pairing off with someone who is of similar physical attractiveness as themselves.
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    (Original post by maskofsanity)
    Luck plays a part only insofar as your personalities have to be compatible. If it were just down to luck then there wouldn't be a clear trend of people pairing off with someone who is of similar physical attractiveness as themselves.
    No, in terms of whether or not you'll fall for someone at the same time they fall for you/when they're still interested. Just because someone's attractive doesn't mean you're going to fancy them. My friends don't think the guy I fancy is good-looking at all. I really like him though. You might be interested in someone who doesn't like you, and then they'll realise they like you but then you've moved on to someone else. Ultimately it's all down to whether or not you're lucky and fancy someone who fancies you at the same time.
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    (Original post by aspirinpharmacist)
    No, in terms of whether or not you'll fall for someone at the same time they fall for you/when they're still interested. Just because someone's attractive doesn't mean you're going to fancy them. My friends don't think the guy I fancy is good-looking at all. I really like him though. You might be interested in someone who doesn't like you, and then they'll realise they like you but then you've moved on to someone else. Ultimately it's all down to whether or not you're lucky and fancy someone who fancies you at the same time.
    Yes, and the people who you will generally be interested in will be of similar physical attractiveness as you, which has nothing to do with luck.
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    (Original post by maskofsanity)
    Yes, and the people who you will generally be interested in will be of similar physical attractiveness as you, which has nothing to do with luck.
    Yes, but it's a matter of chance whether you meet said people and they have a personality you like as well. But as I said, regardless of the attractiveness, that doesn't mean you'll fall for them.
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    (Original post by Collette94)
    I'll even give you a list (applies to both sexes):

    -If you are overweight/puny/too skinny/haven't exercised since God knows when and hate the thought of healthy eating, sort yourself out and get in shape. Physical attractiveness counts for both sexes. Take up a sport or two (join your local gym or run and train at home if you can't afford it), and eat healthily. A quick Google search will tell you how to do both. Even the NHS site has all the advice you need, there are no excuses. If you have a problem with binge drinking/smoking try to quit, that stuff will ruin your looks.

    -Learn some decent social skills and get yourself a decent bunch of platonic friends. Once you have these, you won't need to learn any stupid Jedi mind tricks to get you THAT PERSON OF YOUR DREAMS 1111. Tip: ditch the "How To Get A Man And Keep Him" or "How To Pull 10000000 Hotty" books, and stop taking advice from magazines like Mens' Health or Cosmo, too (They contain some good advice, but the undiscerning eye probably won't be able to pick them out.) In fact, stop taking ANY advice (even from your friends) as to how to find a partner/pull, and focus solely on improving your general social skills. So how do you develop these?

    Simple: go out and socialise. (Yes, this requires work.) You should actually WANT to be friends with people rather than just shag/date them. Don't know where to find friends? You must have hobbies (if not read below). Join local societies/clubs or those at your college/uni or Meetup or Work. Don't like interacting with people and would rather hide away at home fantasizing about the opposite sex? You don't deserve a partner till you man/woman the hell up. Be interested in other people, fun (i.e. up for trying anything new that's reasonable) and polite and well-mannered and you can't go far wrong.

    -Become properly educated. Spend the time you would spend "learning" about the opposite sex from books (which is probably all bull**** anyway) learning about the real world. Not an essential in that obviously you don't need an A level in everything, but it's good to be able to talk about stuff. Live life to the full, don't be boring - this goes beyond making sure you know basic history and what's going on in the news. Travel, take up hobbies (because you want to and find them interesting - if you don't don't waste your time on them. If you are so unmotivated you don't find jack **** interesting, choose the least uninteresting one you can). Just generally don't hang around at home and have zero to talk about with other people.

    -Learn how to style yourself. Now there is often a world of difference between styling yourself as to be attractive and doing it to follow fashion, ofc there's nothing wrong with the latter but it probably won't be so attractive. You can't go wrong with a decent haircut from a good hairdresser (no need to dye it - natural colour is fine), taking good care of your skin (moisturiser + sunscreen + drinking water and eating healthily), and dressing in a classic/generic way (even just hoodie, T-shirt, jeans and trainers are fine if you aren't scruffy looking and they fit well. Fit is key). Add a nice perfume and bingo.

    -Develop a decent personality. Push yourself, figure out where you're going in life (uni, a job, wherever), set yourself goals, don't be a total slob. That's unattractive to most people. Learn morals. I'm not preaching be Mother Teresa here, but you should have a strong sense of self or you'll never be able to get into a decent relationship.
    It's easy to tell you are not someone who struggles with social skills or attractiveness.

    I can tell because you use statements like 'Learn how to style yourself', 'Develop a decent personality' and 'Go out and socialise'. The problem with these statements is they are so difficult to simply 'do'.

    I'll start with 'Learn how to style yourself'. Sure, it's good advice but how does someone learn how to style themselves? Ok I can go to the hairdressers for a new hair cut, but if I go shopping i'm not going to spend £25 on a top that someone thinks looks good. If I don't feel comfortable in it, then i'm not going to feel confident. Fashion is a personal taste. There is no right or wrong. There are guidelines but it all comes down to the individual. I'm not going to force someone to wear a tank top because it looks good on them, as they aren't going to like it.

    'Develop a decent personality'. What is a decent personality? It's incredibly difficult to change your personality because when you're in conversation you don't have time to think 'What could I say that helps put across a good personality?'. You can socialise a lot and pick up tips from other people, but it's gonner take a hell of a long time to change it.

    'Go out and socialise'. With who? If you walk into a pub on your own, and join a group and chat, then you're going to feel out of place. The guys you are talking to all know each other. How would you feel if a stranger came up to your group and just started joining in the conversation? You'd be like 'wtf?'.

    What's ironic is your pretty much telling people to not follow advice, then you give them advice.

    If anyone wants my advice, work on accepting yourself and don't follow self help advice. Everything you don't like about yourself, work on improving it so you can accept who you are.
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    (Original post by Runninground)
    Everything you don't like about yourself, work on improving it so you can accept who you are.
    The irony is strong in this one.
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    (Original post by Runninground)
    If anyone wants my advice, work on accepting yourself and don't follow self help advice.
    The irony is stronger in this one.
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    (Original post by maskofsanity)
    You're going round in circles and missing the point. The OP is concerned about not being attractive enough to win over girls who are of a higher attractiveness than him. Of course it involves luck as to which of these girls he meets (as with everyone), but ultimately it comes down to the attractiveness, not the luck in meeting and matching personality-wise which comes after. Hence why there is substantial evidence showing that people pair off with similar physical attractiveness.
    I'm going in circles because you keep missing my point so I have to come back round to it.

    OP is a girl.

    The attractiveness doesn't matter if you don't meet anyone you find attractive! So say I was of equal attractiveness to...David Tennant, and I met him, and I fancied him, but he fancied someone else of equal attractiveness to him that wasn't me? And then I spent the rest of my life pining for him and never loved another man? Regardless of whether or not we were the same level of attractiveness is irrelevant, because chance made it that he liked someone else, and I never moved on. You can't make yourself feel something or stop feeling something for someone, that's not how it works. That's what I mean by the whole thing being down to luck. I could be surrounded by ten guys of equal attractiveness to me, and nine other girls, that doesn't mean the one I fell for would be the one who fell for me. There are heaps of people in the world who are theoretically perfect for you. You are not going to be in love with all of them, even if you met several of them.

    Incidentally, I've never met David Tennant.
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    (Original post by aspirinpharmacist)
    I'm going in circles because you keep missing my point so I have to come back round to it.

    OP is a girl.

    The attractiveness doesn't matter if you don't meet anyone you find attractive! So say I was of equal attractiveness to...David Tennant, and I met him, and I fancied him, but he fancied someone else of equal attractiveness to him that wasn't me? And then I spent the rest of my life pining for him and never loved another man? Regardless of whether or not we were the same level of attractiveness is irrelevant, because chance made it that he liked someone else, and I never moved on. You can't make yourself feel something or stop feeling something for someone, that's not how it works. That's what I mean by the whole thing being down to luck. I could be surrounded by ten guys of equal attractiveness to me, and nine other girls, that doesn't mean the one I fell for would be the one who fell for me. There are heaps of people in the world who are theoretically perfect for you. You are not going to be in love with all of them, even if you met several of them.

    Incidentally, I've never met David Tennant.
    Haha, I thought I was posting in this thread.

    I mostly agree with what you are saying but I just don't think it overrides the importance of attractiveness. You are always going to meet people you find attractive - that is inevitable - and, more to the point, even if it is luck that makes your paths cross it is attractiveness that determines whether that luck is put to good use. In your example of David Tennant, it wasn't chance that made it unsuccessful it was the level of attractiveness (or lack thereof), which also does come down to luck as well as your own actions, so I guess it's really just a chicken and egg debate, hence why we both thought the other was going in circles.
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    (Original post by maskofsanity)
    Haha, I thought I was posting in this thread.

    I mostly agree with what you are saying but I just don't think it overrides the importance of attractiveness. You are always going to meet people you find attractive - that is inevitable - and, more to the point, even if it is luck that makes your paths cross it is attractiveness that determines whether that luck is put to good use. In your example of David Tennant, it wasn't chance that made it unsuccessful it was the level of attractiveness (or lack thereof), which also does come down to luck as well as your own actions, so I guess it's really just a chicken and egg debate, hence why we both thought the other was going in circles.
    It's a very circular topic. :lol:
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    PUA is bull****, for many they end up being left in a worse place then where they started. PUA hate are where all the failed PUAs linger.

    I was quite active in the PUA community and I found that with a lot of guys they ended up becoming paranoid to the point they would meticulously nit pick on everything (did I demonstrate low value myself by saying x thing?) and as a result become hard on themselves. Many men have poor self esteem and wrongly join that community looking for the magic pill.

    I am by no means amazing with women, but I think the biggest thing that helps a lot with girls is learning to love yourself.

    That way when you get knocked back you can take it easier.

    With all this said, there is some merit in PUA material. Women are highly emotional creatures, that's why often you find many contradict themselves. One minute saying x thing, the other minute saying y thing. Many are affected by the mood they are in, which is why if you go in cold and try and flirt with a girl, you may get a different response depending on mood she is.

    But this is simple psychology. Sales people use the same tactics.
    I'm actually in agreement with what you said although I wouldn't say it's bull****. Learning to love yourself is important and plenty of the books around do tell you that one of the most important things is being at one with your subconscious/ inner self unless you won't experience true love.

    I do agree with the nit-picking (which makes the whole process a chore at times) but at the same time when you do want to improve on something, nit-picking can be important as it can highlight where you need to improve and when you break things down, only then can you analyse where you truly went wrong. It's a long and hard process, but at the same time if you're willing to put hours into a craft, then you can master it and that's what it comes down to- whether or not you want to get to a decent level or a top level.

    Interesting point you make about simple psychology. What you'll notice is that sales people are very natural outgoing people. People who this doesn't come natural to may not see it as common sense/ simple psychology for whatever reasons, although typically this is attributed to poor upbringing socially. So because their development is so retarded, they have to seek external sources for understanding of these psychological principles. Saying that, many people who deem this as "common sense" are more than happy that socially retarded people remain that way to make themselves look better.
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    (Original post by Architecture-er)
    I'm pretty :flutter:
    Daaayuum.

    :sexface:
 
 
 
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