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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    They seriously struggle, I struggle with the basic tasks of everyday work. Im lucky I have people below me that check the mistakes.
    But you are able to do it?

    If you were passionate about your work to be honest, you would find it easier. I suspect that is half of the problem here.

    Finally for your job, what exactly do you need that is academically vigorous , you do high end sales for BA. You would probably need people skills more than anything.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    outside of oxbridge, it is not that much different.

    Sloane went to KCL and did geography, he found it really easy - the essay writing, and that is not because he is a genius either.

    But you know what, employers do not discriminate, the whole system is a bit of a mess tbh.
    Totally untrue, though. I know people doing law degrees at quite a few unis, and the standard expected varies greatly.

    And some employers do discriminate. Not all, but some, in particularly competitive areas. And they do so with good reason. If your degree was harder, you have proven more by doing it. Also, where this is relevant, you know the material to a higher standard.

    I've not read all of your posts or the argument over the last few pages, but it seems to me that the truth is to a lot of people, who want to do particular things, university education, and which university they went to, is very relevant; for others, just having a degree is relevant; and for others, in terms of their careers at least, it isn't relevant at all.

    It's not a problem, as you say above. It's just a fact. I don't think anyone's suggesting that any small difference between the courses at, say, Manchester and Newcastle are going to interest any employers, but in general terms university choice can matter greatly, even outside Oxbridge.

    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    I remember when I was at uni, you had people who did harder modules in their degree because they thought it would impress employers.

    They ended up getting a 2.2 as a result.
    This is true, though. (Although I didn't get a 2.2. I was aiming for a first and got a 2.1 partly because of this.)
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    But you are able to do it?

    If you were passionate about your work to be honest, you would find it easier. I suspect that is half of the problem here.

    Finally for your job, what exactly do you need that is academically vigorous , you do high end sales for BA. You would probably need people skills more than anything.
    I use to not bother with certain lectures, got the DVD out the library of the lecture. Only go in for tutorials and the face to face part important people. It was funny when you had those around me that thought I was going to fail then in tutorials they would see me get better marks. I was never short of a partner in group exercises,lol. Cramming before exams was my answer to everything and 0 retakes.
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    (Original post by TimmonaPortella)
    Totally untrue, though. I know people doing law degrees at quite a few unis, and the standard expected varies greatly.

    And some employers do discriminate. Not all, but some, in particularly competitive areas. And they do so with good reason. If your degree was harder, you have proven more by doing it. Also, where this is relevant, you know the material to a higher standard.

    I've not read all of your posts or the argument over the last few pages, but it seems to me that the truth is to a lot of people, who want to do particular things, university education, and which university they went to, is very relevant; for others, just having a degree is relevant; and for others, in terms of their careers at least, it isn't relevant at all.

    It's not a problem, as you say above. It's just a fact. I don't think anyone's suggesting that any small difference between the courses at, say, Manchester and Newcastle are going to interest any employers, but in general terms university choice can matter greatly, even outside Oxbridge.



    This is true, though. (Although I didn't get a 2.2. I was aiming for a first and got a 2.1 partly because of this.)
    Aside from very specialist fields, Accounting, Engineering, Medicine , Computing, the level of academia involved is not high. Even than, I have found that the best way to become good at it, is through working with people that are better than you and getting your hands dirty in commercial projects.

    Many people like Sloane do high end Sales, what relevance does that have to his degree in geography? None at all.

    A lot of these courses, I will talk for CS, as I am a CS grad, are actually extremely theoretical the higher you go up the league table with the knowledge being useful if you plan to go onto become a hardcore academic.

    Finally, and this the biggest point you have missed, there are plenty of people who go onto do Masters at top units after graduating from a lesser one. Despite that they will get filtered out.
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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    I use to not bother with certain lectures, got the DVD out the library of the lecture. Only go in for tutorials and the face to face part important people. It was funny when you had those around me that thought I was going to fail then in tutorials they would see me get better marks. I was never short of a partner in group exercises,lol. Cramming before exams was my answer to everything and 0 retakes.
    So what changed from ALs to uni, where you have retaken modules to achieve AAA grades?

    If anything you have proven that exam technique and better study habits is key. Which I agree. I did the same at uni.

    Some people learn this earlier on because they have better schooling/parental involvement. Maybe that is the problem?
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    Aside from very specialist fields, Accounting, Engineering, Medicine , Computing, the level of academia involved is not high. Even than, I have found that the best way to become good at it, is through working with people that are better than you and getting your hands dirty in commercial projects.

    Many people like Sloane do high end Sales, what relevance does that have to his degree in geography? None at all.

    A lot of these courses, I will talk for CS, as I am a CS grad, are actually extremely theoretical the higher you go up the league table with the knowledge being useful if you plan to go onto become a hardcore academic.

    Finally, and this the biggest point you have missed, there are plenty of people who go onto do Masters at top units after graduating from a lesser one. Despite that they will get filtered out.
    Actually people talk about places, I have to pitch them the idea of that place. Knowing where somewhere is clearly helps and making proposals for each company. I would need to use powerpoint and excel, theres a whole range of things a degree help. SPSS what we used at KCL, helped big time because Im constantly sending out quotes and working on margin, so I need to be able to work out prices within seconds.How to present in front of an audience is another skill you gain from university.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    So what changed from ALs to uni, where you have retaken modules to achieve AAA grades?

    If anything you have proven that exam technique and better study habits is key. Which I agree. I did the same at uni.

    Some people learn this earlier on because they have better schooling/parental involvement. Maybe that is the problem?
    I found A-Levels way harder then degree and I just did a set recently. Degree stuff is a walk in the park, Ive got the UCL pharmacy stuff infront of me. Doesn't seem hard at all, because you grasp the concepts in A-level, makes learning downhill!

    The system isn't to be blamed as you said its the parents, personally you need to make them more accountable.
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    (Original post by james22)
    The difference in difficult is huge even between Cambridge and other very high up universities. Cambridge maths vs Manchester maths for example are not compareable degrees at all, the former is far far harder.
    yeah but that's mainly to do with the fact that it is one of the subjects Cambridge excels in worldwide and have a lot of decent research in that subject, so of course it's going to be very very theoretical compared to other universities that don't excel in that subject.
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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    Actually people talk about places, I have to pitch them the idea of that place. Knowing where somewhere is clearly helps and making proposals for each company. I would need to use powerpoint and excel, theres a whole range of things a degree help. SPSS what we used at KCL, helped big time because Im constantly sending out quotes and working on margin, so I need to be able to work out prices within seconds.How to present in front of an audience is another skill you gain from university.
    Let's be fair here. Any idiot can find out where a place is, use powerpoint and excel, and do simple sums on a calculator. You don't need a degree for that at all.
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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    Actually people talk about places, I have to pitch them the idea of that place. Knowing where somewhere is clearly helps and making proposals for each company. I would need to use powerpoint and excel, theres a whole range of things a degree help. SPSS what we used at KCL, helped big time because Im constantly sending out quotes and working on margin, so I need to be able to work out prices within seconds.How to present in front of an audience is another skill you gain from university.
    Yes, but that is like one minuscule part of your degree.

    SPSS is also standard for many syllabuses, I know at my uni, psychologists used it for treating statistical data. If you can't use it properly, then you know what, you won't get a 2.1.

    SPSS also does a lot of the calculations for you.
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    (Original post by a10)
    yeah but that's mainly to do with the fact that it is one of the subjects Cambridge excels in worldwide and have a lot of decent research in that subject, so of course it's going to be very very theoretical compared to other universities that don't excel in that subject.
    The same applies if you replace Cambridge with Oxford, Wawrick or Imperial (at Oxford at least, maths isn't special compared to other subjects there). It also applies to other STEM subjects from what I have heard.
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    (Original post by TimmonaPortella)
    Let's be fair here. Any idiot can find out where a place is, use powerpoint and excel, and do simple sums on a calculator. You don't need a degree for that at all.
    A lot of these white collared 'office' jobs are like this. Overqualified graduates doing a not very academic job, yet behave as though its rocket science out of ego.
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    (Original post by james22)
    The same applies if you replace Cambridge with Oxford, Wawrick or Imperial (at Oxford at least, maths isn't special compared to other subjects there). It also applies to other STEM subjects from what I have heard.
    It also applies to non-STEM subjects.

    Law student here.
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    (Original post by TimmonaPortella)
    Let's be fair here. Any idiot can find out where a place is, use powerpoint and excel, and do simple sums on a calculator. You don't need a degree for that at all.
    Not just standard sums, prices connected to a spreadsheet are indicative to the fluctuations in price to the airline industry,lol. We run a system like SPSS, but there is a fair amount you have to calculate and know the ins and outs of and I don't mean VAT.
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    (Original post by TimmonaPortella)
    It also applies to non-STEM subjects.

    Law student here.
    I only lef tout non-STEM because I have no idea how to judge the difficulty. I expect it allpies to almost all subjects.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    A lot of these white collared 'office' jobs are like this. Overqualified graduates doing a not very academic job, yet behave as though its rocket science out of ego.
    What trying to get hundreds of thousands of pounds out of a billionaire isn't challenging enough. Who wants it for free because they think they are gods gift, try it. Considering they could take their business elsewhere. I spend about 10 hours a week in an office, rest is travelling or other businesses. So not a typical office job, your brother works in a bookie, that is a typical retail shop.
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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    What trying to get hundreds of thousands of pounds out of a billionaire isn't challenging enough. Who wants it for free because they think they are gods gift, try it. Considering they could take their business elsewhere.
    SPSS is a standard package that psychologists as lesser unis use.

    And no offence if you can use it, and you have admitted that you are not a genius but street smart, it is not unlearnable.
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    (Original post by james22)
    The same applies if you replace Cambridge with Oxford, Wawrick or Imperial (at Oxford at least, maths isn't special compared to other subjects there). It also applies to other STEM subjects from what I have heard.
    I'm not sure about maths but i don't think you have professional institutions accrediting the courses. With engineering for example, we have professional institutions which accredit the courses under the UK engineering council this ensures that several universities are teaching core modules which MUST be done at every university in order for that course to be accredited as a mark of quality (also one of the reasons why in things like engineering reputation of the university doesn't really mean anything, accreditation has a greater bearing).

    Also it was the individuals choice to study at any of those universities knowing that the course is very theoretical, so if they end up getting a 2.2 that shouldn't be used an excuse and shouldn't make you entitled to anything like OP put it in his original post. Sure the course may have been harder in some aspects but again it doesn't mean people at the so called "lower" universities aren't competent enough in the subject.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    SPSS is a standard package that psychologists as lesser unis use.

    And no offence if you can use it, and you have admitted that you are not a genius but street smart, it is not unlearnable.
    Im an opportunist, that learns of smart people,lol.
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    (Original post by SloaneRanger)
    Im an opportunist, that learns of smart people,lol.
    Yeah, but you are not an academic that is my point. A Stephen Hawking, Einstein with an IQ of 30000
 
 
 
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