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You deserve to die if you eat meat watch

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    (Original post by Andy98)
    No. It just seems stupid how everyone seems to use the argument "it hurts the animals" to support vegetarianism and whatnot - as if they don't know that plants also have feelings in a sense.

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    Plants don't seem to have feelings in any sense. They have no central nervous system, and feelings are an emergent property of a central nervous system.
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    (Original post by Tillybop)

    Let me put it this way:

    How many vegan/vegetarians drive cars? - Those driving vegans are contributing to global warming. I don't drive, and I could very easily be forceful about the use of public transport.

    How many vegan/vegetarians go on holiday? - Those giant planes are contributing to global warming. I've never been on a commercial plane - but I wouldn't stop them having a good holiday.

    How many vegan/vegetarians eat vegetables? - Those vegetables destroy our landscapes, which will turn our beautiful green World into row upon row of dusty unusable land. I don't try to stop them eating vegetables.

    And there are plenty more examples like this...

    Do you see what I'm getting at?

    There are plenty of things in the world that are considered wrong, or destructive, by certain people. But it doesn't mean anyone has a right to get them to change.
    :yy:
    As a vegetarian, no, I don't drive, I avoid travelling by airplane whenever possible, and while I admit that I eat vegetables, it's that or starve. What's more, with proper agricultural management, vegetable farming doesn't irrevocably destroy the fertility of the land. Land can be left fallow for a year or two or planted with legumes or other soil-enriching plants to prevent that happening. In fact, eating meat uses much more land, since the animals you're eating were fed vegetables themselves.

    If a practice is wrong or destructive, it should be stopped. What ISIS is doing at the moment is considered wrong by millions of people; should they be allowed to continue for the sake of moral relativism? Of course not.

    (Before you act all shocked, I am not "comparing" the actions of ISIS and of meat-eaters, beyond stating that both are immoral.)
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    (Original post by Tillybop)
    How many vegan/vegetarians eat vegetables? - Those vegetables destroy our landscapes, which will turn our beautiful green World into row upon row of dusty unusable land. I don't try to stop them eating vegetables.
    Just regarding this specific point, I'm sure you remember from A level bio that energy is lost from each trophic level. More plants are used to feed the animals we eat compared to what would be used if we ate plants directly.

    But you're right. I'm sure there are things vegetarians do that another would find morally distasteful. Though I will say that most vegetarians/vegans I know are more concerned about the environment than your average meat-eater and so use public transport/bikes or eco-friendly vehicles.
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    (Original post by Snooppuppy420)
    Just because you like doing something doesn't make it okay. Hitler liked killing jews was it okay for him to do so because he liked it? Like I said the meat industry is the largest contributor to global warming, it contributes more than all of the things mentioned combined. The other things don't lead to the murder of millions of animals. The thing you said about destroying our landscape is irrelevant as less land would be required as we wouldn't need to grow crops to feed the animals we butcher.
    Look... animal welfare matters to me, I have a minor role in researching it (specifically expression of stress proteins in broilers) and some of the welfare standards in chicken labelled free range really shock me.

    However bringing Hitler into it or saying those who eat meat deserve to die will not change anything. It just makes you come across as shrill and hysterical. No one is going to listen to such arguments. It gives other vegetarians and vegans a bad name. If you want to make good arguments about not eating meat (and there are plenty), stay away from the emotive stuff.
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    (Original post by anosmianAcrimony)
    Plants don't seem to have feelings in any sense. They have no central nervous system, and feelings are an emergent property of a central nervous system.
    Explain the chemicals they emit to warn other plants of danger - they can't move so what's the point in an advance warning unless the plant has a defense mechanism. Most plants don't have a significant defense mechanism - but there must be a reason they send the warning.
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    (Original post by Multitalented me)
    As far as I'm aware they are not sentient beings, as they don't have a nervous system & stuff, they can respond to stimuli although that's not the same thing as feeling pain. Anyway I don't actually like talking about this sort of thing like religion for instance, usually people stick to their point of view & I don't exactly want to have massive heated discussions as I'm not the sort of person to enjoy that sort of thing or atmosphere. Each to their own I guess...
    Never said they were sentient, just that they are aware of their surroundings and do communicate with each other in a way.

    But yeah these arguments are stupid and pointless.
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    (Original post by Andy98)
    Never said they were sentient, just that they are aware of their surroundings and do communicate with each other in a way.

    But yeah these arguments are stupid and pointless.
    Yeah I know, that's something I just wanted to add haha Have a nice day
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    (Original post by anosmianAcrimony)
    As a vegetarian, no, I don't drive, I avoid travelling by airplane whenever possible, and while I admit that I eat vegetables, it's that or starve. What's more, with proper agricultural management, vegetable farming doesn't irrevocably destroy the fertility of the land. Land can be left fallow for a year or two or planted with legumes or other soil-enriching plants to prevent that happening. In fact, eating meat uses much more land, since the animals you're eating were fed vegetables themselves.If a practice is wrong or destructive, it should be stopped. What ISIS is doing at the moment is considered wrong by millions of people; should they be allowed to continue for the sake of moral relativism? Of course not.
    You can only really speak for yourself here though, and not for the actions of all of the vegetarians on Earth.
    (Original post by anosmianAcrimony)
    (Before you act all shocked, I am not "comparing" the actions of ISIS and of meat-eaters, beyond stating that both are immoral.)
    This just kind of supports my point that people who are vegetarian try to make out like meat eaters are 'immoral' and monstrous. If people choose to eat meat just accept it, and stop labelling their behaviour as immoral or wrong in some way. If meat eating was truly that wrong, then it would be made illegal.

    (Original post by Snooppuppy420)
    Just because you like doing something doesn't make it okay. Hitler liked killing jews was it okay for him to do so because he liked it? Like I said the meat industry is the largest contributor to global warming, it contributes more than all of the things mentioned combined. The other things don't lead to the murder of millions of animals. The thing you said about destroying our landscape is irrelevant as less land would be required as we wouldn't need to grow crops to feed the animals we butcher.
    There is a difference between what Hitler did and what meat eaters do. And comparing the two is just way out of line and ridiculous. Eating meat is a natural thing to do - it's what humans have done since humans began; it's nutritious and contributes to a healthy diet.

    I would like some actual solid proof (and not from some clearly bias source that wants you to stop eating meat) that a) it is the largest contributor, and b) that it contributes more than the above mentioned. I'm not really going to take your word for it.

    As for the rest, I'm done with being compared to monstrous groups and people. It's a completely ridiculous situation where people are saying "hurr durr you're Hitler cause you ate that cow." No. This is not the case. Unless you have anything to say more than "you're a murderer" please don't even bother replying here. You cannot force your way of life on others, just because you deem your way of life more acceptable than theirs. That's not how it works. I'm pretty sure your coal fuelled computer is causing more damage to the environment right now, with your phone probably nearby, a light maybe on in the room (though it's sunny so maybe not). Anyone could tell someone else their way of life is wrong, and that they should change it. But the bigger person would just accept that someone else has a different way of life and a different view to them.

    (Original post by Wilfred Little)
    Great post, you can add medication that's been tested on animals to that as well.
    Cheers :yy:

    And make up, which not only tests but also uses parts of animals. Whales - ones of the most beautiful and also an endangered creature used in lipsticks. Horses and glue, cows and leather.
    (Original post by big_dreamer)
    Are you saying that plants are now superior to animals. Animals feel pain too when they are enslaved in cages and I am sure they feel pain when they die. Yet no one is standing up for them, but for the plants now all of a sudden
    I never said that plants were superior - where did you even come to that conclusion from the content of my post?So both feel pain. So maybe we should eat neither. That is what I am getting at. Vegans and Veggies still eat plants - yet they may feel the same distress that an animal feels.
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    So you basically saying plants doesn't have life but it grows, produces fruits and vegetables and also u don't deserve to die eating plants? Ok I get it.

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    We, as humans, were built to eat the foods that vegans do not eat. We need all the vitamins and nutrients in the foods, why would they deprive themselves of something they NEED. It doesn't make no sense. This just proves that there really isn't anything wrong with eating those things because we were built to eat them. Yeah there's tablets that you can eat but that's beside the point.
    Another point, I think these vegan crazy people need to invest their time more in the humans first. There are humans all over the world being treated brutally and killed. But before all that is fixed you want to make sure animals aren't dying? Why not spend that time raising awareness of all the human abuse? Or do you think we, the humans, matter less?
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    (Original post by Tillybop)
    You can only really speak for yourself here though, and not for the actions of all of the vegetarians on Earth. This just kind of supports my point that people who are vegetarian try to make out like meat eaters are 'immoral' and monstrous. If people choose to eat meat just accept it, and stop labelling their behaviour as immoral or wrong in some way. If meat eating was truly that wrong, then it would be made illegal.



    There is a difference between what Hitler did and what meat eaters do. And comparing the two is just way out of line and ridiculous. Eating meat is a natural thing to do - it's what humans have done since humans began; it's nutritious and contributes to a healthy diet.

    I would like some actual solid proof (and not from some clearly bias source that wants you to stop eating meat) that a) it is the largest contributor, and b) that it contributes more than the above mentioned. I'm not really going to take your word for it.

    As for the rest, I'm done with being compared to monstrous groups and people. It's a completely ridiculous situation where people are saying "hurr durr you're Hitler cause you ate that cow." No. This is not the case. Unless you have anything to say more than "you're a murderer" please don't even bother replying here. You cannot force your way of life on others, just because you deem your way of life more acceptable than theirs. That's not how it works. I'm pretty sure your coal fuelled computer is causing more damage to the environment right now, with your phone probably nearby, a light maybe on in the room (though it's sunny so maybe not). Anyone could tell someone else their way of life is wrong, and that they should change it. But the bigger person would just accept that someone else has a different way of life and a different view to them.



    Cheers :yy:

    And make up, which not only tests but also uses parts of animals. Whales - ones of the most beautiful and also an endangered creature used in lipsticks. Horses and glue, cows and leather.
    I never said that plants were superior - where did you even come to that conclusion from the content of my post?So both feel pain. So maybe we should eat neither. That is what I am getting at. Vegans and Veggies still eat plants - yet they may feel the same distress that an animal feels.
    Yeah but most of the fruit or veg I eat falls naturally from a plant if you don't pick it then the fruit from the tree falls naturally so essentially the tree or plant is not feeling pain.


    Also, not being offensive to anyone but what is happening currently to animals, being locked in cages, enclosed in small spaces and essentially waiting to be murdered can be similar to what happened during the holocaust. If all the animals in the factory farms were replaced with humans then that would be called a another genocide, hell would occur. So, what is happening to animals today enclosed in cages and waiting to die is a 'animal' genocide. Yet no one cares.
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    (Original post by MW-19--)
    Someone needs a cheeky Nandos
    What's a cheeky nando? There must be a MEANING
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    I really am curious what vitamin/mineral do we not get from plants that we can ONLY get from another animal?
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    (Original post by big_dreamer)
    Yeah but most of the fruit or veg I eat falls naturally from a plant if you don't pick it then the fruit from the tree falls naturally so essentially the tree or plant is not feeling pain.


    Also, not being offensive to anyone but what is happening currently to animals, being locked in cages, enclosed in small spaces and essentially waiting to be murdered can be similar to what happened during the holocaust. If all the animals in the factory farms were replaced with humans then that would be called a another genocide, hell would occur. So, what is happening to animals today enclosed in cages and waiting to die is a 'animal' genocide. Yet no one cares.
    Yeah you always just wait for that apple to fall from the tree, eh?

    You do realise not all farms are like that, right? If you simply buy the meat from certified farmers, who allow cows to grow up in a natural environment, and gives them a quick painless deaths, then the animal hasn't ever been treated badly. I eat that meat, so what is the problem there?
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    (Original post by Andy98)
    No. It just seems stupid how everyone seems to use the argument "it hurts the animals" to support vegetarianism and whatnot - as if they don't know that plants also have feelings in a sense.

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    So, you don't eat plants, only animals, then? I never have seen a plant be happy or cry, like an animal
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    (Original post by big_dreamer)
    So, you don't eat plants, only animals, then? I never have seen a plant be happy or cry, like an animal
    No I'll eat pretty much anything.
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    (Original post by big_dreamer)
    I really am curious what vitamin/mineral do we not get from plants that we can ONLY get from another animal?
    Vitamin B12
    Vitamin D3
    One form of Omega-3 (DHA)

    (And more...)

    Some sources
    http://authoritynutrition.com/5-brai...eat-fish-eggs/
    http://www.mnwelldir.org/docs/nutrition/meat.htm
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    (Original post by Protégé)
    Why should I care about not eating animals when they kill and eat others? It's fair.
    I just applied your line of reasoning to humans:

    Why should I care about not killing humans when they kill others? It's fair.
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    (Original post by omarkhatri)
    La howla walla ku wata illa billa :|
    I didn't ask for an essay relaxxx
    Getting bare emotional raaa
    haha i didnt mean to post an essay, i tried to copy paste something of the internet and it didnt know it had worked so it added on to the end of an already sort of long comment. go back and read it if u can be bothered ive edited it down
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    (Original post by Tillybop)
    Yeah you always just wait for that apple to fall from the tree, eh?

    You do realise not all farms are like that, right? If you simply buy the meat from certified farmers, who allow cows to grow up in a natural environment, and gives them a quick painless deaths, then the animal hasn't ever been treated badly. I eat that meat, so what is the problem there?
    Their natural environment is not be murdered after a year or less. There is no such thing as a 'painless' death, and if they wanted it to be quick and painless they have to inject the cow with whatever, and you essentially ate that too. What even is a certified farmer I mean all of them have to keep them in enclosed, not every commercial farmer is going to give one cow hundreds acres of land. The cow did not ask to be murdered, how would you feel if from the moment you were born someone already gave you the date of your death, and mostly likely within a year. Even organic farmers which may give animals more land whilst they're living, still murder them and actually because they use more land per cow or animal it contributes to destroying the environment more than one which was factory farmed.
 
 
 
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