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    Unfortunately I suspect Jammy is right, the entire left wing needs to do lots of posting everywhere with links in their signatures. Maybe if we get the widget for a lengthy period it'll be more balanced.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    I think he is expecting a widget poll to have a large impact if it is prominent for the entire election, allowing all TSR members to vote by not visiting the thread.

    RayApparently as the whole premise of a message to all TSR users, and a widget is to raise awareness of the MHoC, it would be good if users would have to click a link in the widget to be taken to the thread to vote; having only a poll defeats the purpose of advertising the MHoC. What form with any widget take?
    However, increasing election participation is a good in itself, and requiring a link defeats that. It should be a one-click poll.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Except the data does not back up that hypothesis, after the mass PM the extra votes were not in line with the RL election polling of TSR
    But that is to be expected. Some of the people who voted in the RL poll would have voted in the TSR poll too, also there are people who vote in the RL poll who will never vote in the MHoC one because they hate us. Your 'data' doesn't account for those variables. Also the RL poll was open for much longer so we don't know how many people who are on infrequently voted on that but then didn't happen to be on at the time that our one was going.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    I think he is expecting a widget poll to have a large impact if it is prominent for the entire election, allowing all TSR members to vote by not visiting the thread.

    RayApparently as the whole premise of a message to all TSR users, and a widget is to raise awareness of the MHoC, it would be good if users would have to click a link in the widget to be taken to the thread to vote; having only a poll defeats the purpose of advertising the MHoC. What form with any widget take?
    I would assume it is the usual voting widget which lets you vote and only then take you to the thread the poll is on, which is something I have never understood, especially given some of the crap that gets put there.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    But that is to be expected. Some of the people who voted in the RL poll would have voted in the TSR poll too, also there are people who vote in the RL poll who will never vote in the MHoC one because they hate us. Your 'data' doesn't account for those variables. Also the RL poll was open for much longer so we don't know how many people who are on infrequently voted on that but then didn't happen to be on at the time that our one was going.
    Given there were no major changes in the polls for RL other than in the very very early times I would say its a rather moot point to say that the time frame is different, that would only be a valid argument if, say, the greens were massively dominant for ages and then suddenly UKIP were in the lead, although bearing the greens in mind I might amend the prediction next week.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    However, increasing election participation is a good in itself, and requiring a link defeats that. It should be a one-click poll.
    I disagree, election participation is only a beneficial thing if the people voting are informed about the decision they make. The individuals voting based on real life parties, or the individuals voting with no understanding of political parties but select an option are not people the MHoC should be encouraging to vote; that defeats the purpose of manifestos.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    I disagree, election participation is only a beneficial thing if the people voting are informed about the decision they make. The individuals voting based on real life parties, or the individuals voting with no understanding of political parties but select an option are not people the MHoC should be encouraging to vote; that defeats the purpose of manifestos.
    Then the way to get around that is to ban use of RL likenesses. As it is, party names are an okay descriptor of ideologies, and accordingly voting based on them is better than no voting at all.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Unfortunately I suspect Jammy is right, the entire left wing needs to do lots of posting everywhere with links in their signatures. Maybe if we get the widget for a lengthy period it'll be more balanced.
    Stating a widget will balance thing implies the election is unbalanced when a message is not sent to all TSR users, but as the graph breaking down the votes shows, the message unbalances the election by giving a huge boost to Labour who see their share of votes after the message climb at a noticeably faster rate than any other party. The left-wing could post everywhere with intrusive signature, however, that would be considered spam under TSR rules.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    Stating a widget will balance thing implies the election is unbalanced when a message is not sent to all TSR users, but as the graph breaking down the votes shows, the message unbalances the election by giving a huge boost to Labour, and a slightly smaller boost to the Liberals who see their share of votes after the message climb at a noticeably faster rate than any other party. The left-wing could post everywhere with intrusive signature, however, that would be considered spam under TSR rules.
    It merely rebalances it by extending effective suffrage to the entire voting populace. The more people who are aware of the election, the more representative it is.

    It's not spam provided the messages themselves have substantive content. Also, I do not believe it is against TSR policy to mention the election in the content of the post where it is relevant.
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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    Then the way to get around that is to ban use of RL likenesses. As it is, party names are an okay descriptor of ideologies, and accordingly voting based on them is better than no voting at all.
    One could argue, are the sorts of things we try to pass that different to what our RL counterparts would try?

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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    Stating a widget will balance thing implies the election is unbalanced when a message is not sent to all TSR users, but as the graph breaking down the votes shows, the message unbalances the election by giving a huge boost to Labour who see their share of votes after the message climb at a noticeably faster rate than any other party. The left-wing could post everywhere with intrusive signature, however, that would be considered spam under TSR rules.
    Alternatively it shows that most people who casually come here at election time are Tories, or we have a much larger low activity party base, given we kept rising when the other parties stagnated but also were slower off the mark

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    (Original post by TheDefiniteArticle)
    It merely rebalances it by extending effective suffrage to the entire voting populace. The more people who are aware of the election, the more representative it is.

    It's not spam provided the messages themselves have substantive content. Also, I do not believe it is against TSR policy to mention the election in the content of the post where it is relevant.
    No, the idea of the manifestos is TSR users vote based on the TSR parties, trying to ignore that aspect by wanting to bypass the need to click the link to the thread demonstrates a desire to use real life parties to influence votes. Saracen's Fez tabled an amendment to the Guidance Document banning the use of real life images of recognisable people, and the use of attributed quotes on the grounds both detract from the TSR manifestos, to then demand a widget poll that ignores the thread containing the TSR manifestos is completely hypocritical, and is sour grapes as it become obvious the Prime Minister wants to use real-life likeness only when it suits the Prime Minister's party.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    No, the idea of the manifestos is TSR users vote based on the TSR parties, trying to ignore that aspect by wanting to bypass the need to click the link to the thread demonstrates a desire to use real life parties to influence votes. Saracen's Fez tabled an amendment to the Guidance Document banning the use of real life images of recognisable people, and the use of attributed quotes on the grounds both detract from the TSR manifestos, to then demand a widget poll that ignores the thread containing the TSR manifestos is completely hypocritical, and is sour grapes as it become obvious the Prime Minister wants to use real-life likeness only when it suits the Prime Minister's party.
    I think that many people would support the end to RL likeness but no one wants to table the amendment because no one thinks that it will pass.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    I think that many people would support the end to RL likeness but no one wants to table the amendment because no one thinks that it will pass.
    I don't want it and I'm sceptical that it would pass given that arguably it needs to be constitutional

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    (Original post by Aph)
    I think that many people would support the end to RL likeness but no one wants to table the amendment because no one thinks that it will pass.
    I would support the end to real life likeness if it was done properly, that means no message, no widgets, no logos in manifestos, and no party names in manifestos. At the moment the moment members are all for ending real life likeness when it does not suit their party, for example, people were happy to ban UKIP using Farage photos when it is known Farage gives a boost to the party, however, the same people were not happy when it the message send to sent to TSR users was being stopped, and the same members are demanding a widget that detracts from real life but boosts their party; very hypocritical.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    I don't want it and I'm sceptical that it would pass given that arguably it needs to be constitutional

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    Yes it would. But I think that it would be better and maybe divide the larger parties but it would mean parties get votes based on merit. Do you not belive in meritocracy?
    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    I would support the end to real life likeness if it was done properly, that means no message, no widgets, no logos in manifestos, and no party names in manifestos. At the moment the moment members are all for ending real life likeness when it does not suit their party, for example, people were happy to ban UKIP using Farage photos when it is known Farage gives a boost to the party, however, the same people were not happy when it the message send to sent to TSR users was being stopped, and the same members are demanding a widget that detracts from real life but boosts their party; the hypocrisy is unreal, you are included in that.
    I think that most of that is nothing to do with RL likeness at all. It would be banning the use of party names and logos of parties who Recived more then 1000 votes in the last general election...
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    (Original post by Aph)
    Yes it would. But I think that it would be better and maybe divide the larger parties but it would mean parties get votes based on merit. Do you not belive in meritocracy?

    I think that most of that is nothing to do with RL likeness at all. It would be banning the use of party names and logos of parties who Recived more then 1000 votes in the last general election...
    Arguably it wouldn't do that, any smart party will get as close as possible to something recognisable, depending on how it is written we could easily change from informally to formally being the Tories, for instance. On top of this, the constitutional amendment makes passage close if it does pass.

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Arguably it wouldn't do that, any smart party will get as close as possible to something recognisable, depending on how it is written we could easily change from informally to formally being the Tories, for instance. On top of this, the constitutional amendment makes passage close if it does pass.

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    It would be worded to give the speaker disgression to regect similarity.
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    (Original post by Aph)
    Yes it would. But I think that it would be better and maybe divide the larger parties but it would mean parties get votes based on merit. Do you not belive in meritocracy?

    I think that most of that is nothing to do with RL likeness at all. It would be banning the use of party names and logos of parties who Recived more then 1000 votes in the last general election...
    You are contradicting yourself, the purpose of the amendment was about ending a beneficial real-life association for one party but not for the others; your comment prove this. If you stood by that comment you would support ending the message, and not having a widget as both suggest an association that does not exist.

    Aph
    Pictures and quotes from IRL politicians are misleading as it suggests an association that doesn't exist.
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    (Original post by Nigel Farage MEP)
    I think he is expecting a widget poll to have a large impact if it is prominent for the entire election, allowing all TSR members to vote by not visiting the thread.

    RayApparently as the whole premise of a message to all TSR users, and a widget is to raise awareness of the MHoC, it would be good if users would have to click a link in the widget to be taken to the thread to vote; having only a poll defeats the purpose of advertising the MHoC. What form with any widget take?
    I don't know what form the widget will take - I can't even promise there'll be one.
 
 
 
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