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    (Original post by Onde)
    Was the Aisha you mention the one that the Muhammad had sex with when she was nine years old?
    Mary was 12/13 years old when she married Joseph who was over 90 years old. Why do you not criticise that? There's a much greater age gap?

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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    Mary was 12/13 years old when she married Joseph who was over 90 years old. Why do you not criticise that? There's a much greater age gap?

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    Lol, the my prophet\religious person is less disgusting then your prophet argument. Swell!
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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    Mary was 12/13 years old when she married Joseph who was over 90 years old. Why do you not criticise that? There's a much greater age gap?

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    We, as people living in the 21st century cannot argue on this.
    We should not forget that people in the oldern times used to hit puberty much much earlier. I should note that this practice still occurs in India where 9 year old girls get married. Something so common in the olden days being criticized 2000 years later makes no sense
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    (Original post by shakeebshams)
    We, as people living in the 21st century cannot argue on this.
    We should not forget that people in the oldern times used to hit puberty much much earlier. I should note that this practice still occurs in India where 9 year old girls get married. Something so common in the olden days being criticized 2000 years later makes no sense
    First, absolute complete bulls*** on the reaching puberty earlier "back in the day". Second, puberty does not mean sexual maturity. Young girls die or face permanent damage from intercourse at that age (not to mention lifelong psychological damage). Have you ever considered why Aisha did not have children. Think about this, don't just throw out the same old regurgitated apologetic crap for the sake or protecting your sacred beliefs.

    It is wrong and vile during anytime in history, then and now. Furthermore, it needs to be stopped now, as some child bride marriages are still very prevalent in some Middle Eastern countries. It is another disgusting blight against humanity.
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    (Original post by animus1)
    First, absolute complete bulls*** on the reaching puberty earlier "back in the day". Second, puberty does not mean sexual maturity. Young girls die or face permanent damage from intercourse at that age (not to mention lifelong psychological damage). Have you ever considered why Aisha did not have children. Think about this, don't just throw out the same old regurgitated apologetic crap for the sake or protecting your sacred beliefs.

    It is wrong and vile during anytime in history, then and now. Furthermore, it needs to be stopped now, as some child bride marriages are still very prevalent in some Middle Eastern countries. It is another disgusting blight against humanity.
    You sure fam? It's way more prevalent in countries like India, Sri Lanka. I've even read that an 8 year old girl was suspected of having an evil soul and was forced to marry a dog......yup a dog
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    (Original post by shakeebshams)
    We, as people living in the 21st century cannot argue on this.
    We should not forget that people in the oldern times used to hit puberty much much earlier. I should note that this practice still occurs in India where 9 year old girls get married. Something so common in the olden days being criticized 2000 years later makes no sense
    Exactly my point. How can we talk and criticise something that happened 1400 years ago?

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    (Original post by shakeebshams)
    You sure fam? It's way more prevalent in countries like India, Sri Lanka. I've even read that an 8 year old girl was suspected of having an evil soul and was forced to marry a dog......yup a dog
    Well then, certainly Muhammad taking and raping his best friend's daughter is just fine because of other evils that exist. In that case, I think I'll go rob a couple convenience stores, everyone is doing it now a days!

    Edit: By the way, b.s. on your dog story, and the 90 year old Joseph story (a fabrication created to somehow defend the Mohammad \ Aisha rape). I've seen your other posts, and it is clear you despise India and Hindus - that aside, the point remains, the occurrence of evil event Y does not excuse evil event X. Save us from this silliness, please.
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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    Exactly my point. How can we talk and criticise something that happened 1400 years ago?

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    Good old fashioned circle jerking, great!
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    (Original post by Onde)
    Was the Aisha you mention the one that the Muhammad had sex with when she was nine years old?
    Ah, you didn't you know? Girls hit puberty and developed much earlier back in the olden days! (There are people who actually believe this, despite there being absolutely no evidence for it lol).
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    (Original post by animus1)
    Well then, certainly Muhammad taking and raping his best friend's daughter is just fine because of other evils that exist. In that case, I think I'll go rob a couple convenience stores, everyone is doing it now a days!

    Edit: By the way, b.s. on your dog story, and the 90 year old Joseph story (a fabrication created to somehow defend the Mohammad \ Aisha rape). I've seen your other posts, and it is clear you despise India and Hindus - that aside, the point remains, the occurrence of evil event Y does not excuse evil event X. Save us from this silliness, please.
    A) I have nothing against Hindus and Indians just clearly stating that it was not Islam

    B) Rich coming from someone who despises Islam

    C) The story of Mary and Joseph is true please provide evidence it is not... In fact one google of Mary's age at marriage proves it

    D) So you can degrade Islam but I cannot mention another religion? Why so? Just pointing out that they are all the same

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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    ...C) The story of Mary and Joseph is true please provide evidence it is not... In factone google of Mary's age at marriage proves it
    I can care less about Mary and Joseph, although this is a fabricated story, I've seen this before. You are the one that made the claim, it is you that should provide the prove, otherwise the claim is disregarded. Regardless, if it were true, your point was that Joseph did it so why blame Mohammad; which of course is no defense at all. Sex with children is wrong, now or at any time in history. Furthermore, Mohammad is held to the standard as not only a prophet, but the perfect example for all human kind. Because Mohammad set this example with Aisha, child bride marriages are still occurring in the Middle East, and young girls are dying from this or suffering irreparable physical (and emotional) damage.

    Here are a few examples:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/yemen-child-brides/
    13-Year-Old Yemeni Bride Dies Of Bleeding
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_530349.html
    (Original post by From the article...)
    , a human rights group said. The practice of marrying young girls is widespread in Yemen and has drawn the attention of international rights groups seeking to pressure the government to outlaw child marriages. Legislation that would make it illegal for those under the age of 17 to marry is in serious peril after strong opposition from some of Yemen's most influential Islamic leaders. The 13-year-old girl from Hajja province, northwest of the capital, died on April 2, four days after her marriage to a 23-year-old man, said Majed al-Madhaji, a spokesman for the Sisters Arab Forum for Human Rights. A medical report from al-Thawra hospital said .
    Note: Now this girl was 13, where Aisha was 9! Aisha had a mother and father, why would they not stop this? Why shouldn't she continue to live out her childhood playing with her girlfriends on swings, playing with dolls (as stated in the hadiths), etc... until she is much, much older and prepared for marriage?

    Yemen: Where men marry children
    http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/m...d-brides-yemen
    Yemen Child Marriage: Rights Group Urges Authorities To Set Minimum Age
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1136613.html
    Dead Yemeni Child Bride Tied Up, Raped, Says Mom
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_533959.html
    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    D) So you can degrade Islam but I cannot mention another religion? Why so? Just pointing out that they are all the same
    Tear away at other religions all you like, I don't care and I have no problem with that at all. I'm not a fan or follower of any religion, some of them I find worse or much worse than others.If you want to learn how to defend Islam, just know that showing faults in other religions is not a defense for the ills with Islam and the life of Mohammad. That is simply the point I am trying to get across.
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    (Original post by Aceadria)
    Precisely. They would rather we give up core values so as to not 'offend' anyone.
    Thanks you, as I had this on mind but could not formue late it better.

    The left would likely to cease to exist in future. On one hand there would be muslims who do not like them (regardless however they tried with apeasement) on other side there willbe the indigenous population who would not like them because of their preference of muslims. So they will have enemies on both sides, thus the left will cease to exist.
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    (Original post by animus1)
    I can care less about Mary and Joseph, although this is a fabricated story, I've seen this before. You are the one that made the claim, it is you that should provide the prove, otherwise the claim is disregarded. Regardless, if it were true, your point was that Joseph did it so why blame Mohammad; which of course is no defense at all. Sex with children is wrong, now or at any time in history. Furthermore, Mohammad is held to the standard as not only a prophet, but the perfect example for all human kind. Because Mohammad set this example with Aisha, child bride marriages are still occurring in the Middle East, and young girls are dying from this or suffering irreparable physical (and emotional) damage.

    Here are a few examples:http://www.huffingtonpost.com/news/yemen-child-brides/
    13-Year-Old Yemeni Bride Dies Of Bleeding
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_530349.html
    Note: Now this girl was 13, where Aisha was 9! Aisha had a mother and father, why would they not stop this? Why shouldn't she continue to live out her childhood playing with her girlfriends on swings, playing with dolls (as stated in the hadiths), etc... until she is much, much older and prepared for marriage?

    Yemen: Where men marry children
    http://www.globalpost.com/dispatch/m...d-brides-yemenYemen Child Marriage: Rights Group Urges Authorities To Set Minimum Age
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/1...n_1136613.html Dead Yemeni Child Bride Tied Up, Raped, Says Mom
    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/0..._n_533959.htmlTear away at other religions all you like, I don't care and I have no problem with that at all. I'm not a fan or follower of any religion, some of them I find worse or much worse than others.If you want to learn how to defend Islam, just know that showing faults in other religions is not a defense for the ills with Islam and the life of Mohammad. That is simply the point I am trying to get across.
    I don't know... Maybe I'm sick of everyone scrutinising Islam when other religions are exactly the same. I am not pointing out faults, just showing how it is not just Islam that has its controversial bits but so do other religions. So why is it that just Islam is picked on. Yes child brides is not acceptable at any time. But in this instance it was the norm 1400 years ago so we can scrutinise it with the same level as today.

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    (Original post by SaalihahHusain)
    Your point is? Just because their constitution is the Quran and sunnah it does not mean that all of the wrong actions that happen in that country are from the Qur'an and Sunnah. I mean the Prince of Saudi was found drug trafficking but that is NOT part of the Qur'an or Sunnah. Messed up things go on in Saudi yet they get away with it, from my perspective, simply due to money along with other things. As said in https://www.quora.com/Which-is-the-i...ran-and-Sunnah, these countries have hypocritical government which have different laws for different people.
    You claimed that what goes on in places like Saudi Arabia has nothing to do with islam.
    The fact that their constitution and entire legal system is based wholly on the Quran and sunnah disproves this.
    The fact that certain individuals in the establishment have transgressed some of these laws makes no difference whatsoever.
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    (Original post by SaalihahHusain)
    I would much appreciate it if you could provide me with the source of your evidence because I have done a LOT of research on Islam, particularly the views it holds on women.
    The Prophet said, "Isn't the witness of a woman equal to half of that of a man?" The women said, "Yes." He said, "This is because of the deficiency of a woman's mind." - sahih Bukhari
    That is just one of many.
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    (Original post by SaalihahHusain)
    Khadijah did not change after the first supposed revelation or Islam, not did her status or anything else about her.
    Thus demonstrating that she had the same rights and position before Islam, as she did after.

    But are you going to tell me that Aisha was also married to the Muhammad before the supposed first revelation of Islam?
    But he did marry her when she was six years old, and consummated the marriage when she was nine (sahih Bukhari & sahih Muslim).
    So perhaps not the best example for Islam's attitude towards women.
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    (Original post by Peroxidation)
    That's actually why I follow it. 90% of the Dhamma is just a mixture of common decency, common sense and psychology which has actually been proven via PET scans and other sciencey stuff. It's oxymoronic putting "proven" and a religion together like that though, my guess is the Buddha was just a genius who got really lucky. The other 10% is all the spiritual stuff about rebirth etc. That's all a load of tosh though.
    Do you not believe in the spiritual side? Is it still possible to be a Buddhist?

    I always thought most Buddhist converts reject God and totalitarianism but can't bear to believe in a wholly materialistic, naturalistic view of the cosmos, so choosing Buddhism is a leeway (almost as a form of desperation) between the two - not believing in God but wanting to believe there's more to the world than the laws of Physics (ie. spiritualism).
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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    Mary was 12/13 years old when she married Joseph who was over 90 years old. Why do you not criticise that? There's a much greater age gap?

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    1. Whataboutery!
    A man having sex with a 12 year old does not excuse a man having sex with a 9 year old.

    2. Muslims claim that the Bible has been corrupted by men, so you can't use anything within it as evidence.

    Jeez, this is sooo easy!
    At least people like ash92:) and ThatMuslimGuy will present a word salad that people CBA to pick through.
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    (Original post by shakeebshams)
    We should not forget that people in the oldern times used to hit puberty much much earlier.
    Nonsense. There is no evidence for this. All the evidence shows that girls mature at a younger age now than they did in the past.
    http://www.mum.org/menarage.htm

    I should note that this practice still occurs in India where 9 year old girls get married. Something so common in the olden days being criticized 2000 years later makes no sense
    I agree that we cannot judge the behaviour of people in the 7th century by modern standards..... UNLESS......
    That person is claimed to be a timeles, universal and perfect example for all humanity to follow.

    In which case, we can, and should.
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    (Original post by Are you sure?)
    I don't know... Maybe I'm sick of everyone scrutinising Islam when other religions are exactly the same. I am not pointing out faults, just showing how it is not just Islam that has its controversial bits but so do other religions. So why is it that just Islam is picked on. Yes child brides is not acceptable at any time. But in this instance it was the norm 1400 years ago so we can scrutinise it with the same level as today.

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    But they are not!

    Why does no one arguing for Islam seem to get this very simple point.

    Yes, there are also many horrible things written in the Old Testament. That is fact. But unlike in Islam, where many, many Muslims use these horrible things and live by them, almost no Christian does.

    Compare the laws, the culture, the norms, the ethical values in Christian dominated countries versus those in Islam. If you deny a stark, glaring contrast then there is no point talking to you, because that difference exist. And that difference exists because of Islam. It is so easy to hold certain discriminatory believes, if you have divine justification for them.

    Finally, have you ever read anything about Christians and their gay bashing? People speak about about that, too, e.g. look at the backlash in the US when that woman refused to marry gays. Yes many (Christians) were supporting her, but the law was against her, and just as many people criticizing Islam, had a go (rightly) at her.
 
 
 
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