There is no evidence for God

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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    Is there any proof of evolution?
    Really?

    Just watch this YouTube series, there's far too much for me to type out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isV9hWXpNjc
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    (Original post by The Empire Odyssey)
    A part of me always questions this as a religious believer myself.

    I personally believe it in because I was brought up to believe in Christ and therefore I do. Yes I do question it but when my life has been real low and I had no one or nothing to turn to, I turned to my religion for help and spiritual strength and prayed. And I truly believe every time I talk to God he answers my call or if that, I feel a lot more strength than if I hadn't been in contact with my spirituality.

    You may laugh at that, but I think a lot of religious people find religion from a crisis point in their life and found a lot of inspiration and strength in scriptures and so forth. I don't enforce my religion and I never post on threads like these 'cause they are so silly.

    Another interesting thing another poster said was the fear of death. Death is a natural thing in this world and I think believing in the soul being able to pass on through the other side is something that brings a lot of hope for people who want to live their life. But the philosophy of death is a murky and ambiguous subject to me.
    A very honest and moving account, so thank you for that. And I have no doubt that many people like you feel some sort of spiritual need and spiritual happiness from believing in God.

    But to think that that is evidence for the existence of God, is wrong, to put it nicely.
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    (Original post by LightAtTheEnd)
    So because it's all about 'personal' and 'spiritual experience' and you have no proof for it, how can you be certain that this experience is true? Why trust something you have no evidence for? You're basically assuming God exists on a whim then, and your discrediting your argument of probability like this anyway. We atheists might as well argue God doesn't exist because I had a spiritual experience that he doesn't exist. This argument really falls flat since both sides can use

    Regarding proof for evolution, there are pieces of evidences (often observations) that support it. I will re-iterate in Science, you do not prove, you support. Unfortunately there isn't a single legitimate evidence supporting the existence of a God.

    Here are the list of evidence that support the theory of Evolution
    1) Universal Genetic code
    2) Fossil record
    3) Genetic similarities
    4) Common traits in embryos
    5) Bacterial resistance to antibiotics
    Have you seen an evolved human?

    I'm in no way discrediting my argument on probability. I said there is no conspicuous evidence of God but that does not mean he isn't responsible for the existence of the Universe. The uniqueness of the Earth and the existence of the Universe creates an especially low probability, which i believe was the result of God's actions. Similar to the discovery of Gravitational Waves, there was no evidence of it but we now know they clearly exist. Personal experience i.e unique to me. I could tell you i felt God's presence but you would never believe that, i could tell you that i had a spiritually related dream but you would never believe that. But what i might have felt or saw was real, and for that reason i believe.

    Like i said to begin with it is all about FAITH. People had faith that Gravitational Waves (despite Einstein's doubt) existed and we now know they exist, that is the same with God have FAITH in him and soon enough he will reveal himself to you and everyone.
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    (Original post by Retropattern)
    I still don't see the problem, plus i don't care how our justice system works the fact of the matter is that you cannot prove everything. The fact that you have no evidence doesn't mean that something isn't so. But when it comes to supreme beings like the notion of God, every single religion in human history, every group of people have understood that there is something greater than us, regardless of religious background. Isn't that evidence enough, that for thousands of years culture, people that were isolated had this belief and faith? Any attempt of just saying that it is not real is an insult to human history. On the topic, just because we live in a time where technology is amazing and science is so relevant, doesn't mean that people can overlook religion as something of the past. Myself coming from a Sikh background and studying a science degree, I think science is just another way of uncovering the workings of God as did Isaac Newton, there is nothing I disagree with in science. I think that is the problem with abrahamic religions, is that they are a set of rules that people obsess over and its also why many ignorant people group every religion as if they were the same. And yes, religion provides order and way of life and spirituality, but that is what humans need, otherwise things become chaotic. And for those who blame war on religion, you can't it is the people not religion. People without faith are the most unhappy, true fact.
    No, they understood that they had no idea how something works so before not doing anything, they would pray for a good harvest to a God and offer gifts. Or they would offer gifts for a safe voyage across sea. These people believed in Gods. We would call them superstitious now.

    Monotheistic religions are no different in that sense. They are just a spiritual superstition that comfort those that believe. That on its own is perfectly fine.

    What is not fine is people a) trying to make out that it "proves" existence and b) when it leads to abhorrent practices e.g. witch burnings or Islamic culture.

    And the last part, even if that is true, that is still not evidence for the existence of God. What is really disheartening is that you people don't get that. And if you really were that happy, you wouldn't be so adamant on trying to fallaciously prove it. You would just accept it's faith that you have and that you could be wrong. Because you would be happy and content with yourself before God.
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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    Though the comparison is substantially larger, the probability of someone winning the lottery is immensely lower.

    I can only give evidence of God's existence from personal experience not anything relatively conspicuous.
    Why do you need to prove that God exists? In the end you have faith. That's all.
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    (Original post by Peroxidation)
    I find it genuinely hilarious that you've quote mined Hawking's A Brief History of Time and tried to use it as evidence. It's also a shocking display of the intellectually dishonest lows theists will stoop to in order to justify their beliefs. Your quote comes from page 126, but Hawking follows up on it in page 133:

    "Moreover, the rate of expansion of the universe would automatically become very close to the critical rate determined by the energy density of the universe. This could then explain why the rate of expansion is still so close to the critical rate, without having to assume that the initial rate of expansion of the universe was very carefully chosen."
    I used that quote specifically to give insight on the fact that the Earth and Universe were created from such unique conditions that to believe they exist only because of scientific explanations is absurd. Just because there is a lack of spiritual explanation doesn't mean it is not present.
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    No, they understood that they had no idea how something works so before not doing anything, they would pray for a good harvest to a God and offer gifts. Or they would offer gifts for a safe voyage across sea. These people believed in Gods. We would call them superstitious now.

    Monotheistic religions are no different in that sense. They are just a spiritual superstition that comfort those that believe. That on its own is perfectly fine.

    What is not fine is people a) trying to make out that it "proves" existence and b) when it leads to abhorrent practices e.g. witch burnings or Islamic culture.

    And the last part, even if that is true, that is still not evidence for the existence of God. What is really disheartening is that you people don't get that. And if you really were that happy, you wouldn't be so adamant on trying to fallaciously prove it. You would just accept it's faith that you have and that you could be wrong. Because you would be happy and content with yourself before God.
    What is it with you people thinking that religion was just to explain the unknown. No, it teaches you how to live a good life. And so what if people have customs that may be superstitious, at least they're inventive and creative unlike boring atheists that would rather believe in nothing.
    Plus i'm not going to try prove it to people as cynical as you, that would be a waste of time. I'm just stating my view.
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    Why do you need to prove that God exists? In the end you have faith. That's all.
    Because i believe it's not just about me. I want to motivate and inspire as much people as i can to get to know God. No one would want to go to Hell so i want to try my best to convince them of the existence of God, help them overcome their unbelief and have faith in God, trust him and love him and hopefully they can be saved and be relinquished of their sin. "Do not neglect to do good" .
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    (Original post by Retropattern)
    What is it with you people thinking that religion was just to explain the unknown. No, it teaches you how to live a good life. And so what if people have customs that may be superstitious, at least they're inventive and creative unlike you boring atheists that would rather believe in nothing.
    1. Because it was. Until it was used as a form of social control and oppression.

    2. I don't need a 2000 year old book to tell me how to live a good life.

    3. Inventive and creative? "Muh magic" is your answer to everything. We strive to understand the world as it functions scientifically. Meanwhile "muh magic" is all you can come up with.

    4. What is wrong with believing in nothing? Not that I do, I believe in a lot of things, just not ones that are fairy tales. Wouldn't you agree that still believing in the tooth fairy as an adult is, well, sad?
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    (Original post by inhuman)
    A very honest and moving account, so thank you for that. And I have no doubt that many people like you feel some sort of spiritual need and spiritual happiness from believing in God.

    But to think that that is evidence for the existence of God, is wrong, to put it nicely.
    I never said there was evidence for the existence of God. I'm simply explaining why and I think you literally misinterpreted what I was saying.

    My whole point was saying religion is a spiritual thing and you do not need any evidence for something like that. Regardless what you call the deity in the sky a God or not.

    It's the same principle for the "mind". It's only a concept but there's no evidence to suggest it's a thing. It's just a thought-concept to explain what we think and why we think. But people accept it as being something that's true.

    Why can't people understand that "religion" is a concept that doesn't need evidence to believe in. It's something that just is.

    I'm not going to argue with you or anything about my reasoning or beliefs. But that's my opinion. Have a good day.
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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    Well i do. But here's the problem by telling you that i believe in the existence of God would most probably not change your mind. Why? Because i would be simply declaring my faith and belief in God based of personal experience, spiritual experience. That is the nature of religion, whether people establish a reason as to why science does or does not disprove the existence of God and his work, when they declare there faith for God it will most frequently be based on personal experience rather than conspicuous evidence, through faith.

    Is there any proof of evolution?
    It's impossible to determine whether Gods exist in any meaningful way (scientifically) through personal experience. I have a problem with the word 'faith' itself, which implies something noble about believing things that are fundamentally contrary to reason.

    It's not noble to come to an illogical conclusion, so instead of using that term, perhaps say "I'd be declaring my fundamentally irrational belief in a deity I have no reason and never will have any reason to believe but do so anyway because I was coerced to as a child by all my authority figures using fear and indoctrination, and have been taught that my life would be worthless if I didn't believe"
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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    Because i believe it's not just about me. I want to motivate and inspire as much people as i can to get to know God. No one would want to go to Hell so i want to try my best to convince them of the existence of God, help them overcome their unbelief and have faith in God, trust him and love him and hopefully they can be saved and be relinquished of their sin. "Do not neglect to do good" .
    Do I deserve to burn in hell for eternity because I don't believe you?
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    (Original post by Retropattern)
    What is it with you people thinking that religion was just to explain the unknown. No, it teaches you how to live a good life. And so what if people have customs that may be superstitious, at least they're inventive and creative unlike boring atheists that would rather believe in nothing.
    Rubbish. People were living good lives long before religion came about, it's pretty sad if you can't live a decent life without an ancient book telling you to.

    False, atheists believe in plenty of things, they just don't believe in God.
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    (Original post by The Empire Odyssey)
    I never said there was evidence for the existence of God. I'm simply explaining why and I think you literally misinterpreted what I was saying.

    My whole point was saying religion is a spiritual thing and you do not need any evidence for something like that. Regardless what you call the deity in the sky a God or not.

    It's the same principle for the "mind". It's only a concept but there's no evidence to suggest it's a thing. It's just a thought-concept to explain what we think and why we think. But people accept it as being something that's true.

    Why can't people understand that "religion" is a concept that doesn't need evidence to believe in. It's something that just is.

    I'm not going to argue with you or anything about my reasoning or beliefs. But that's my opinion. Have a good day.
    I know you haven't. But others in this thread have. And that is what I find irritating, I have to admit.

    And yes, I actually understand perfectly well in that it is just faith and doesn't need evidence. But as I said, what irritates me is the very fact that so many people mistake their faith for evidence and go around pretending and telling others it is evidence.

    If anything, your post just confirmed that many religious people don't understand themselves what religion really is.
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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    Because i believe it's not just about me. I want to motivate and inspire as much people as i can to get to know God. No one would want to go to Hell so i want to try my best to convince them of the existence of God, help them overcome their unbelief and have faith in God, trust him and love him and hopefully they can be saved and be relinquished of their sin. "Do not neglect to do good" .
    Fair enough.

    But I believe in helping people escape the shackles of their weak minds, help them overcome the need to believe in magic in order to live a fulfilling life. Protect the children from such brainwashing, protect humanity from such evil ideologies.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    Rubbish. People were living good lives long before religion came about, it's pretty sad if you can't live a decent life without an ancient book telling you to.

    False, atheists believe in plenty of things, hey just don't believe in God.
    Look yeah if you think my point is rubbish, fine, cause i think your whole outlook is rubbish. How the heck do you know anything about people before religion, and i never said you couldn't live a decent life as an atheist. And there you go again 'ancient book telling you to'. You have no idea about what some religions are like, i'm pretty sure you never took the time to read into a religion without the use of the internet. You don't just bloody follow a book, its more about achieving a spiritual connection with god. Something you probably will never comprehend.
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    (Original post by Paranoid_Glitch)
    I used that quote specifically to give insight on the fact that the Earth and Universe were created from such unique conditions that to believe they exist only because of scientific explanations is absurd. Just because there is a lack of spiritual explanation doesn't mean it is not present.
    Well again, the quote that you gave is then re-addressed and S. Hawkins explains why the conditions were reached or could have been reached anyway, despite how unique they seem to be. So it's not as if they happened 'by chance' or by the works of a magical being.
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    (Original post by D3LLI5)
    Do I deserve to burn in hell for eternity because I don't believe you?
    No but because you have sinned. I can't say i have all the answers but from most of the passages i have read from the Bible, i have concluded it has an answer to almost any question you could ask.
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    (Original post by Retropattern)
    Look yeah if you think my point is rubbish, fine, cause i think your whole outlook is rubbish. How the heck do you know anything about people before religion, and i never said you couldn't live a decent life as an atheist. And there you go again 'ancient book telling you to'. You have no idea about what some religions are like, i'm pretty sure you never took the time to read into a religion without the use of the internet. You don't just bloody follow a book, its more about achieving a spiritual connection with god. Something you probably will never comprehend.
    I achieved a spiritual connection with my gf the other night. Does that count?
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    This is such an overdone thread
 
 
 
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