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    (Original post by InnerTemple)
    I think it unlikely that Russia ordered this.
    Where do you think they got the weaponry to gun down a boeing at 33 000ft? Russia should get the equal responsibility of the heinous crime.
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    (Original post by Monsieur Gamma)
    Where do you think they got the weaponry to gun down a boeing at 33 000ft? Russia should get the equal responsibility of the heinous crime.
    USA stealth drones or CIA operatives mate.
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    (Original post by PassingAlways)
    USA stealth drones or CIA operatives mate.
    :facepalm:
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    It was at 33,000ft, not low at all. They were well above the clouds. Clouds have no effect whatsoever on a radar-guided missile. You don't see AC-130s being shot down because A-the US uses them rarely and B-they only use them in areas with next-to-no SAM threat.
    It was only 300 feet above restricted airspace!?

    Why if you were a pilot would you not fly over restricted altitude at maximum altitude, why take the risk?
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    (Original post by Monsieur Gamma)
    Where do you think they got the weaponry to gun down a boeing at 33 000ft? Russia should get the equal responsibility of the heinous crime.
    I think that it could have been supplied by Russia. But there are reports that a Ukrainian weapons system was captured by the separatists.

    In either case, I doubt the Russian's ordered this.
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    (Original post by DanB1991)
    :facepalm:
    they have a history, they are worried about China so being able to sanction Russia out of the picture is a wet dream to the USA, they will do anything they need to to justify them.
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    (Original post by DanB1991)
    Tbh I'd say most of what has happened has been out of their control. Putting a BUK on the front-line against armed insurgents (which is what they are basically), is a pretty stupid, on the highest level, move.

    Firstly there's no need for it to be there and second all your doing is risking it's capture and use against your own forces.
    Well, they have done things like firing unguided missiles from a fighter jet into a park in the middle of the day. The armed forces have essentially been dismantled and put back together again since Yanukovych was deposed. They haven't been very well organised.
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    (Original post by PassingAlways)
    they have a history, they are worried about China so being able to sanction Russia out of the picture is a wet dream to the USA, they will do anything they need to to justify them.
    :facepalm::facepalm:

    You do realise china is a closer ally to america than russia right? China has virtually nothing to do with the current international politics concerning ukraine.
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    (Original post by Monsieur Gamma)
    Where do you think they got the weaponry to gun down a boeing at 33 000ft? Russia should get the equal responsibility of the heinous crime.
    When the Sepratists took over the areas they now control, It had Ukranian BUK missiles there. Ukraine Embassador to UK confirmed this now on Newsnight.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by Daniel9510)
    It was only 300 feet above restricted airspace!?

    Why if you were a pilot would you not fly over restricted altitude at maximum altitude, why take the risk?
    Try 3000ft. The NOTAMs issued say an exclusion zone between FL26 and FL30. MH17 was flying at FL33.

    And you don't go higher because ATC tells you where to go and how high to fly at. There was, additionally, no particular reason why they should fly higher. Nobody expected it.
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    (Original post by DanB1991)
    :facepalm::facepalm:

    You do realise china is a closer ally to america than russia right? China has virtually nothing to do with the current international politics concerning ukraine.
    LOL you believe that? they are at war already with cyber tech mate...directly? no, indirectly? they have everything to do with it...

    the USA put the fascists in power in the Ukraine & now they are framing Russia for this plane being shot down so they can minimize Russia's economic & military power in the region...
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    (Original post by PassingAlways)
    LOL you believe that? they are at war already with cyber tech mate...directly? no, indirectly? they have everything to do with it...

    the USA put the fascists in power in the Ukraine & now they are framing Russia for this plane being shot down so they can minimize Russia's economic & military power in the region...
    For your own sake, stop watching Russia Today.
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    (Original post by DaveSmith99)
    For your own sake, stop watching Russia Today.
    I don't...though I doubt anything can go beyond the bias of the British press, the BBC is run by Tory Zionists for gods sake...rest are corporate scum.

    but hey be a lap dog for the USA war machine, you may as well ruin lives yourself.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Try 3000ft. The NOTAMs issued say an exclusion zone between FL26 and FL30. MH17 was flying at FL33.

    And you don't go higher because ATC tells you where to go and how high to fly at. There was, additionally, no particular reason why they should fly higher. Nobody expected it.
    Was 300metres, 1k ft, thats my mistake.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...icted-airspace

    There have been 3 other planes shot down! You have a cruising altitude of 43,000 & restrictions are up to 32,000, why on earth would you fly at 33?

    Its not like its busy, BA, the Russians, the Germans and loads of other won't fly through there.
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    (Original post by PassingAlways)
    LOL you believe that? they are at war already with cyber tech mate...directly? no, indirectly? they have everything to do with it...

    the USA put the fascists in power in the Ukraine & now they are framing Russia for this plane being shot down so they can minimize Russia's economic & military power in the region...
    "mate" the usa is having a cyber war with the Germany, UK, France etc... their closest allys.... Cyber-warfare is a free for all right now.

    Also seeing china's propping up their entire economy in a rather public light.... and in economics it does matter how public matters are. Economic investments are rather ignorant of undercover stuff.

    Your sounding like a conspiracy nutter right now.
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    (Original post by Daniel9510)
    Was 300metres, 1k ft, thats my mistake.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...icted-airspace

    There have been 3 other planes shot down! You have a cruising altitude of 43,000 & restrictions are up to 32,000, why on earth would you fly at 33?

    Its not like its busy, BA, the Russians, the Germans and loads of other won't fly through there.
    The vast majority do fly through there....

    Why? Well the only people presumed to have such weapons were the ukrainian government and they have access to air traffic control.
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    (Original post by DanB1991)
    "mate" the usa is having a cyber war with the Germany, UK, France etc... their closest allys.... Cyber-warfare is a free for all right now.

    Also seeing china's propping up their entire economy in a rather public light.... and in economics it does matter how public matters are. Economic investments are rather ignorant of undercover stuff.

    Your sounding like a conspiracy nutter right now.
    thanks for proving my point

    lol, hardly, everything the USA/China do is motivated by economics, if you don't know that you may as well live under a rock.

    nope, just someone who sees through the propaganda of the UK/USA media scum.
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    (Original post by Daniel9510)
    Was 300metres, 1k ft, thats my mistake.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...icted-airspace

    There have been 3 other planes shot down! You have a cruising altitude of 43,000 & restrictions are up to 32,000, why on earth would you fly at 33?

    Its not like its busy, BA, the Russians, the Germans and loads of other won't fly through there.
    Military planes flying at low altitudes shot down by MANPADS, which are shoulder mounted mobile missile launchers.
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    (Original post by Daniel9510)
    Was 300metres, 1k ft, thats my mistake.
    http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...icted-airspace

    There have been 3 other planes shot down! You have a cruising altitude of 43,000 & restrictions are up to 32,000, why on earth would you fly at 33?

    Its not like its busy, BA, the Russians, the Germans and loads of other won't fly through there.
    Because there had previously been no threat whatsoever. The ICAO had okayed the route and plenty of other airlines followed it as well.

    The other aircraft that had been shot down bear no resemblance to the downed airliner.
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    (Original post by Drewski)
    Not always you can't, especially not if the conditions aren't creating contrails.. Additionally, if they are reacting solely to radar information, the two aircraft will appear similar.
    wow i'm an idiot i didn't account for clouds haha it was such a nice day here in england.
 
 
 
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