Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Why is gender equality still not a reality in 2016? Watch

    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by joecphillips)
    What a successful patriarchy.
    Good jobs all us, straight, white males have those regular meetings to make sure we can continue our privilege...
    • Political Ambassador
    Online

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MisterPC)
    I'm not sure I follow but you could just have equality? Within a company you have to have the same maternity/paternity benefit?
    As I said, if it's not the case it's a very easy legal battle.

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    Sapphire321 I'm sorry but I am just sick and tired of this b*llocks saying wage gap this and that. I don't understand man. Why do you feel such a victim complex? Men have issues too like Noodle mentioned. It's so naïve for women nowadays to still blab on about how hard their lives are. Come on man. It's ignorant and I find it very offensive. And trust me, I'm not easily bothered.
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    Precisely my point, men are paid on average more than women due to:
    So what? Men and women on average make different choices and have different preferences and traits. The leftist obsession with precise parity of groups at the expense of the freedom of individuals to make their own life choices makes me want to bang my head against a wall.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    The wage gap isn't a thing in the west, the "gap" you women are moaning about is the different choices women take in regards to work/jobs. Feminism in the west is a joke, you privileged women have no bloody clue.

    Go to countries like Saudi Arabia, Iran etc and see how it can be for a woman, women fighting for feminism in the West is quite frankly pathetic, to be perfectly honest there are more issues for men in the west then women in regards to sexism.

    Every single human being is born in some form or another sexist to men. It's called gynocentrism.

    I speak from experience coming from an Iranian family (only boy with three older sisters).
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Alextaylor6)
    If you honesty believe there is a wage gap you're retarded. If this was the case, why wouldn't firms just hire women and cut costs. There are differences in pay because women work in lower paid jobs and tend to take time off work (children ect)
    There is a 9.4% earnings gap between men and women working full-time and a 19.2% earnings gap when you include part-time employment. This is from the Office for National Statistics from 2015. Yes, of course it's affected by how women are often in lower level jobs in a particular career compared with men. This is my point, it shouldn't be so much easier for men to get promoted to top level jobs. Yes, this is affected by having children but it wouldn't have such an effect if there was more and better paid paternity leave and women weren't expected to do the majority of the childcare and housework in most cases.

    The earnings gap is also affected by how women are less likely to go into higher paid career paths such as science and engineering. In this case, more should be done to encourage women to go into careers like these and women who do or already are should be treated equally. The inequality in industry can be absolutely shocking. Someone I know was the only female manager in a company in the chemical industry that was very male dominated. She had faced loads of discrimination and sexism while she worked there although she was actually much better qualified and much better at her job than most of the male managers. The company then made her redundant and when she talked to other people in the company who had worked there for years and knew exactly what went on there and were mostly male they all said that the only reason she had been made redundant was because she was female and the top level management of the company didn't like having women in higher level jobs.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by an_atheist)
    Responses in bold.
    1. My first point was about how there are more men in generally higher paid career paths such as science, technology, engineering etc.

    2. My second point was about how in the same company/career path women are often in lower level jobs than men which is what you seemed to understand from both. In answer to what you said, yes childbirth does remove women from the workplace but only for a few weeks/months of maternity leave. That actually shouldn't have as much of an effect as it does and it wouldn't if there was more and better paid paternity leave so that the responsibility could be better shared between couples. Men and women should also do an equal amount of childcare and housework rather than women being expected to do most of it.

    3. Yes, it is illegal but unfortunately it still can happen. Employers can get round it and discrimination is difficult to prove.
    http://www.forbes.com/sites/jwebb/20.../#154a6afd16ee
    Approximately 40% of managers admit that they are less inclined to hire women who are of child bearing age or who already have children although that is also technically illegal. I don't accept that women are just less hard working and always leave earlier; that must just be down to the specific people that work at your parents' accounting firm. Although, this again could be down to how women most often have the primary responsibility for childcare.

    4. Yes, I do agree that men can also be discriminated against when hiring for certain jobs due to equality laws. However, as far as I know there is more discrimination against women than against men in the workplace, particularly in the private sector.

    5. I'm not saying that the curriculum in schools is a problem. I'm saying that society and culture in general can be problematic. Girls are often encouraged/expected to do arts and humanities subjects at school and university by their peers, their parents and even their teachers whereas boys are encouraged to do science, maths, computing etc. Women are expected to take the most responsibility for childcare and housework and if they don't they are told they are bad mothers whereas if men take the most responsibility for childcare and housework they are often looked down on. Women are told that not having/wanting to have children makes them unnatural but no-one says that about men who don't have children.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by wildleaves)
    If you think women are oppressed in the Uk relative to men you are not a feminist.
    I don't think women in the UK are oppressed by men. I am saying that we don't have proper gender equality though. If you read my other posts then you can see what I'm saying. Women are oppressed in other countries though.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IronicalMan)
    Most prominent feminists=Jews.
    Breakdown of society, low birth rates ect. Within the jews interest considering most nationalists are against the jews... See the Polish anti jew posters in the Soviet-Polish war. After the holocaust, the jews realized they needed to eliminate white European societies, and not only does feminism increase the work force participation, decreasing labour costs for corporations and banks, it increases cheap labour overall, it decreases birth rates for an excuse of mass immigration(to create a divisive society and to decrease labour costs).
    That is probably one of the weirdest conspiracy theories I have ever read. I also think that it's ridiculous to say that gender equality causes the breakdown of society. It creates a more progressive society. Having more women in work grows a county's economy. More women in work doesn't have to lower birth rates either. Women can have successful careers and children, especially if men take an equal amount of responsibility for childcare and housework so that women can focus more on developing their careers.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    Women don't fight in wars. Your life expectancy is longer. You live comfortable lives.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    There is a 9.4% earnings gap between men and women working full-time and a 19.2% earnings gap when you include part-time employment. This is from the Office for National Statistics from 2015. Yes, of course it's affected by how women are often in lower level jobs in a particular career compared with men. This is my point, it shouldn't be so much easier for men to get promoted to top level jobs. Yes, this is affected by having children but it wouldn't have such an effect if there was more and better paid paternity leave and women weren't expected to do the majority of the childcare and housework in most cases.

    The earnings gap is also affected by how women are less likely to go into higher paid career paths such as science and engineering. In this case, more should be done to encourage women to go into careers like these and women who do or already are should be treated equally. The inequality in industry can be absolutely shocking. Someone I know was the only female manager in a company in the chemical industry that was very male dominated. She had faced loads of discrimination and sexism while she worked there although she was actually much better qualified and much better at her job than most of the male managers. The company then made her redundant and when she talked to other people in the company who had worked there for years and knew exactly what went on there and were mostly male they all said that the only reason she had been made redundant was because she was female and the top level management of the company didn't like having women in higher level jobs.
    Business is there to make profit, not pay someone to go on maternity leave, not to mention they then have to pay to employ someone else in their place, you will not get men to take paternity leave either, as they'll be paid less and they are not the ones pregnant lol. Businesses aren't there to pay someone to have children ? and you can't pay men the same, or one equal to what they would have received in work as businesses can't afford it.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IronicalMan)
    Business is there to make profit, not pay someone to go on maternity leave, not to mention they then have to pay to employ someone else in their place, you will not get men to take paternity leave either, as they'll be paid less and they are not the ones pregnant lol. Businesses aren't there to pay someone to have children ? and you can't pay men the same, or one equal to what they would have received in work as businesses can't afford it.
    It is illegal to discriminate against a woman who either is going on maternity leave or has gone on maternity leave in the past although unfortunately some employers still do. It is also illegal not to hire a woman because she already has children or may have children in the future although again around 40% of managers surveyed in a study admitted they do this and unfortunately the percentage is probably higher in reality.

    Yes, businesses do have to pay someone else to take their place on a fixed term contract but it has been proved that having more women working is actually an economic benefit. That's what I already said about paternity leave. There should be more and better paid paternity leave so that it is economically viable for men to do that. Obviously, I wasn't suggesting men take the part where their partner is actually still pregnant but they can take some time off after the baby is born so that the woman can return to work. Men and women both choose to have children so why should women almost always be the ones to sacrifice their careers. A man can have children and not be disadvantaged in his career so why shouldn't a woman have the same opportunities. Businesses must be able to afford it. Why can they pay maternity pay for a woman but not paternity pay for a man?

    Are you going to reply to my other quotes to you now btw?

    I do realise that I'm probably arguing with a lost cause with you though because looking at your posts on other threads I can see that you are far right wing, admit to being a fascist and have used escorts in the past so it is very unlikely that we are going to agree on this and I have to admit I'm pleased that I don't have the same views as you.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    It is illegal to discriminate against a woman who either is going on maternity leave or has gone on maternity leave in the past although unfortunately some employers still do. It is also illegal not to hire a woman because she already has children or may have children in the future although again around 40% of managers surveyed in a study admitted they do this and unfortunately the percentage is probably higher in reality.

    Yes, businesses do have to pay someone else to take their place on a fixed term contract but it has been proved that having more women working is actually an economic benefit. That's what I already said about paternity leave. There should be more and better paid paternity leave so that it is economically viable for men to do that. Obviously, I wasn't suggesting men take the part where their partner is actually still pregnant but they can take some time off after the baby is born so that the woman can return to work. Men and women both choose to have children so why should women almost always be the ones to sacrifice their careers. A man can have children and not be disadvantaged in his career so why shouldn't a woman have the same opportunities. Businesses must be able to afford it. Why can they pay maternity pay for a woman but not paternity pay for a man?

    Are you going to reply to my other quotes to you now btw?

    I do realise that I'm probably arguing with a lost cause with you though because looking at your posts on other threads I can see that you are far right wing, admit to being a fascist and have used escorts in the past so it is very unlikely that we are going to agree on this and I have to admit I'm pleased that I don't have the same views as you.
    Oh I forgot about them and revising theory so cba, plus drinking...again. Though, Men don't have the children do they, so they aren't effected by their gf/wife being pregnant, that's the point, Women have to take the time off.....
    Economic benefit via growth doesn't always benefit the individual, think about it, to have children now both parents need to work. Basically everyone does more work.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    It is illegal to discriminate against a woman who either is going on maternity leave or has gone on maternity leave in the past although unfortunately some employers still do. It is also illegal not to hire a woman because she already has children or may have children in the future although again around 40% of managers surveyed in a study admitted they do this and unfortunately the percentage is probably higher in reality.

    Yes, businesses do have to pay someone else to take their place on a fixed term contract but it has been proved that having more women working is actually an economic benefit. That's what I already said about paternity leave. There should be more and better paid paternity leave so that it is economically viable for men to do that. Obviously, I wasn't suggesting men take the part where their partner is actually still pregnant but they can take some time off after the baby is born so that the woman can return to work. Men and women both choose to have children so why should women almost always be the ones to sacrifice their careers. A man can have children and not be disadvantaged in his career so why shouldn't a woman have the same opportunities. Businesses must be able to afford it. Why can they pay maternity pay for a woman but not paternity pay for a man?

    Are you going to reply to my other quotes to you now btw?

    I do realise that I'm probably arguing with a lost cause with you though because looking at your posts on other threads I can see that you are far right wing, admit to being a fascist and have used escorts in the past so it is very unlikely that we are going to agree on this and I have to admit I'm pleased that I don't have the same views as you.
    What's wrong with escorts, you should support them as a Feminist. Also I have something you could agree with, as a fascisti, Mass free childcare, Ie nursery type things provided by the state. Also, free holidays, free activity groups, fitness and health of the nation ect.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    It is illegal to discriminate against a woman who either is going on maternity leave or has gone on maternity leave in the past although unfortunately some employers still do. It is also illegal not to hire a woman because she already has children or may have children in the future although again around 40% of managers surveyed in a study admitted they do this and unfortunately the percentage is probably higher in reality.

    Yes, businesses do have to pay someone else to take their place on a fixed term contract but it has been proved that having more women working is actually an economic benefit. That's what I already said about paternity leave. There should be more and better paid paternity leave so that it is economically viable for men to do that. Obviously, I wasn't suggesting men take the part where their partner is actually still pregnant but they can take some time off after the baby is born so that the woman can return to work. Men and women both choose to have children so why should women almost always be the ones to sacrifice their careers. A man can have children and not be disadvantaged in his career so why shouldn't a woman have the same opportunities. Businesses must be able to afford it. Why can they pay maternity pay for a woman but not paternity pay for a man?

    Are you going to reply to my other quotes to you now btw?

    I do realise that I'm probably arguing with a lost cause with you though because looking at your posts on other threads I can see that you are far right wing, admit to being a fascist and have used escorts in the past so it is very unlikely that we are going to agree on this and I have to admit I'm pleased that I don't have the same views as you.
    Also I never said employers aren't allowed to discriminate, I am explaining why..
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IronicalMan)
    Oh I forgot about them and revising theory so cba, plus drinking...again. Though, Men don't have the children do they, so they aren't effected by their gf/wife being pregnant, that's the point, Women have to take the time off.....
    Economic benefit via growth doesn't always benefit the individual, think about it, to have children now both parents need to work. Basically everyone does more work.
    Reply some time when you haven't been drinking then haha! Also, seriously I saw your thread about how much you were drinking (and of course your private message to me) and that's really not sensible to keep doing and I mean that in a concerned, nice way. Are you actually drinking while you're revising?

    No, men don't literally have the children but women only need to go on maternity leave for a few weeks/months while they are actually in the later stages of pregnancy to it shouldn't have as big an effect as it does. Women have to take some time off when they are actually pregnant, yes, but they don't have to take all the time off after the baby is born. Men can take some time off then instead. Women also do not have to do most of the childcare and housework as the child grows up.

    I meant the economic benefits to businesses. In the current economic situation many families do have one or both parents unemployed btw not by choice and some families still do choose for one parent not to work (again still usually the woman).
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by IronicalMan)
    Also I never said employers aren't allowed to discriminate, I am explaining why..
    That's what I was saying. That it is technically illegal to discriminate. Do you mean you were explaining why they do still discriminate even though it's illegal?
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    Sapphire321 Can you please explain how you think the wage gap is actually real? It confuses me that people believe it but I will continue to try and see their side of the story.

    You only have to look at something as random as football managers - 99% male and they're paid incredibly high amounts. Used towards "wage gap" statistics, but has nothing to do with equality. Anyone can be a manager, getting the qualifications has no gender restriction.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    Reply some time when you haven't been drinking then haha! Also, seriously I saw your thread about how much you were drinking (and of course your private message to me) and that's really not sensible to keep doing and I mean that in a concerned, nice way. Are you actually drinking while you're revising?

    No, men don't literally have the children but women only need to go on maternity leave for a few weeks/months while they are actually in the later stages of pregnancy to it shouldn't have as big an effect as it does. Women have to take some time of when they are actually pregnant, yes, but they don't have to take all the time off after the baby is born. Men can take some time off then instead. Women also do not have to do most of the childcare and housework as the child grows up.

    I meant the economic benefits to businesses. In the current economic situation many families do have one or both parents unemployed btw not by choice and some families still do choose for one parent not to work (again still usually the woman).
    I stopped revising, naa dw, I get enough of that off my parents but tbh, as wrong as it sounds I don't really care lol. My dads an alcoholic and so was his dad etc...
    But women, are maternal, they have more bond with the baby etc and know what to do(and usually want to spend time with their baby etc)
    Men aren't as sensitive etc, and tbh I'd have no idea how to look after a baby, it took my father a few goes lmao. It all depends if most want to, you earn less money and the mother would usually prefer it in my opinion. I'd say men do quite a bit of housework in my experience, I mean my great grandfather did nothing and he had 12 children...lol. But all the men in my family that have children do(those that don't have no gf/wife so they do it all obvs), my dad even looks after my baby brother and little brother(I don't live with them) however, that's mainly due to him not being at work or if his gf is at work. I wouldn't have a problem doing housework/cleaning or cooking, actually I'd just higher a cleaner LMAO. Cooking is bad, when you can just drink beer which is far easier lmao,unless someone depended upon me. But another point, feminism leads to less time cooking, so kids get *****er meals for example as parents don't have time.
    But for business's there's no incentive, men and women are just as good at doing a job, that's why they pick the man usually. Unless it's a really valued employer/friend.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Sapphire321)
    That's what I was saying. That it is technically illegal to discriminate. Do you mean you were explaining why they do still discriminate even though it's illegal?
    yes
 
 
 
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Are unpaid trial work shifts fair?
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.