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Trump & Brexit is what happens when you smear all who disagree as racist watch

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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    He didn't refuse to blame Islam. He was annoyed that the presenters refused to accept that it was predominantly a homophobic attack.


    If the same happened in a synagogue or black church no one would deny that it was primarily antisemitic or racist yet the presenters argued that the Orlando attacks wasn't primarily homophobic.

    He absolutely criticised Islam. I am not sure how that makes him a SJW.

    The only SJW are the centre left moderates like Clinton and Jess Phillips who pretty much accuse anyone who didn't vote for her of being sexist.

    You just done listen do you? The like or Jones have been saying for years that if the left do not stand up for working people and offer an alternative then the far right will.
    I don't listen? You've been repeating my original point as if it will come as news to me. This part of the conversation came about because you kept asking me my political stance and what I thought of Corbyn. I listened, 5 times now. I won't a sixth.

    Owen Jones sat there sulking like a child because the presenter and fellow guest disagreed that it was PURELY a homophobic attack. They simply made the point that there is something more going on than just homophobia. Then he stormed off rather than put forward a coherent counter point, probably because it's hard to keep deflecting criticism of Islam when it keeps nspiring mass murder.

    If that wasn't enough he refused to go on Channel 4 News with Douglas Murray, who is also a gay man, but a morally consistent journolist that has been argueing for years that Islam has an enormous problem with homosexuality, amongst other things. He got his way and they cancelled Dougla Murray.

    Sounds like SJW 101 to me.
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    (Original post by Dandaman1)
    I agree. People are getting tired of the browbeating by the media and a liberal establishment that is increasingly detached from Joe public. People don't trust the media anymore, either. All the articles and stories about how awful Trump is had little effect in turning the US population against him, apparently, and not so surprisingly. I think the Trump and Trump supporter-bashing just made more people want to vote for him out of spite.

    The media also fostered over-confidence in the anti-Trump and anti-Brexit populations. They thought victory was a sure thing. They were in a bubble with their John Oliver, their CNN, their social media... All the while a huge number of pissed off, disenfranchised citizens tired of being talked down to, feeling abandoned by the establishment and concerned for the future of their countries, were getting ready to do something the pundits and papers weren't expecting.
    I agree. The press seems to be looking in the mirror a little in the wake of this, unfortunately most people are doubling down and shouting racism. Trump is a racist ******** and voting for him was a stupid thing to do if it was in protest, but he is the logical conclusion of left wing authoritarianism.
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    (Original post by Damien96)
    I don't listen? You've been repeating my original point as if it will come as news to me. This part of the conversation came about because you kept asking me my political stance and what I thought of Corbyn. I listened, 5 times now. I won't a sixth.

    Owen Jones sat there sulking like a child because the presenter and fellow guest disagreed that it was PURELY a homophobic attack. They simply made the point that there is something more going on than just homophobia. Then he stormed off rather than put forward a coherent counter point, probably because it's hard to keep deflecting criticism of Islam when it keeps nspiring mass murder.

    If that wasn't enough he refused to go on Channel 4 News with Douglas Murray, who is also a gay man, but a morally consistent journolist that has been argueing for years that Islam has an enormous problem with homosexuality, amongst other things. He got his way and they cancelled Dougla Murray.

    Sounds like SJW 101 to me.

    He was arguing about the inconsistency of the media. If the attack was on a Synagogue then no one would deny that it was purely an anti-semitic attack. People wouldn't go 'ah but the greater reason is...'

    The presenters were very clearly trying to shift the focus away from homophobia on towards Islam, even though there is no proof that the perpetrator had any link with IS or Islamic extremism. The presenters were changing the facts, to suit their narrative.

    I don't agree with him rushing out but I can understand it, given that two presenters were arguing to him that the mass murder of 50 gay people was somehow not solely a homophobic attack. The perpetrator very deliberately targeted a gay club,it wasn't an accident.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Haven't you noticed? Pepetarians call everyone who speaks out for social equality and progressiveness a SJW regardless of whether they are right or wrong about a certain issue. Ironically they also call it the "regressive left". They try to pigeonhole people into categories that fit their (narrow) world view. And everyone who is not of their opinion is (aggressively) ridiculed.
    I could change the buzzwords and say the same thing in the opposite direction. The right don't get let off the hook for Trump, but the left has some serious soul searching to do.

    What's worse is we've cried wolf too many times and no longer have even the lexicon to combat an openly bigoted president.
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    (Original post by Bornblue)
    He was arguing about the inconsistency of the media. If the attack was on a Synagogue then no one would deny that it was purely an anti-semitic attack. People wouldn't go 'ah but the greater reason is...'

    The presenters were very clearly trying to shift the focus away from homophobia on towards Islam, even though there is no proof that the perpetrator had any link with IS or Islamic extremism. The presenters were changing the facts, to suit their narrative.

    I don't agree with him rushing out but I can understand it, given that two presenters were arguing to him that the mass murder of 50 gay people was somehow not solely a homophobic attack. The perpetrator very deliberately targeted a gay club,it wasn't an accident.
    Are you seriously telling me if a man yelled "Allahu Ackbar" and killed Jews in a Synagogue no one would mention Jihadism? You're following him down a rather undignified rabbit hole by claiming such a ridiculous thing.

    Of course it wasn't an accident. In case you haven't noticed, this strain of Islam isn't too fond of gays and unfortunately they can find some very specific instructions in the manual.

    But even if I am completely wrong in that assessment, he doesn't get to have people disinvited from the news because he disagrees with them. That's not journalism, that's not even being an adult.
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    (Original post by Damien96)
    I could change the buzzwords and say the same thing in the opposite direction. The right don't get let off the hook for Trump, but the left has some serious soul searching to do.

    What's worse is we've cried wolf too many times and no longer have even the lexicon to combat an openly bigoted president.
    If we are at a point where we need to coddle right ideas then humanity as already lost.

    The same logic could be applied to Muslims - better not offend them, else they just become terrorists.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    If we are at a point where we need to coddle right ideas then humanity as already lost.

    The same logic could be applied to Muslims - better not offend them, else they just become terrorists.
    I have no problem with criticising Trump or many of the reasons people voted for him. The bigger issue is the environment that allowed such an unqualified bigot to gain power. There is no one reason, and plenty of blame to go around, but the claustrophobic discourse, and throwing around the word racist, is a large part of it.

    Trump is the logical conclusion, not the catalyst.
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    (Original post by Damien96)
    I have no problem with criticising Trump or many of the reasons people voted for him. The bigger issue is the environment that allowed such an unqualified bigot to gain power. There is no one reason, and plenty of blame to go around, but the claustrophobic discourse, and throwing around the word racist, is a large part of it.

    Trump is the logical conclusion, not the catalyst.
    Could not disagree more.

    Not to mention, you are in fact using the logic as I said "America calls Muslims terrorists, America bombs Muslims countries, of course they will be terrorists".
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Could not disagree more.

    Not to mention, you are in fact using the logic as I said "America calls Muslims terrorists, America bombs Muslims countries, of course they will be terrorists".
    Comparing voting for a bigoted clown to suicidal, mass murder is not logical.
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    (Original post by Damien96)
    Comparing voting for a bigoted clown to suicidal, mass murder is not logical.
    It is the same logic "say mean things about group x, then group x will do y".

    There is actually a guy on Islam threads alevelstress who was just saying that. How ironic you guys would now say that about Trump's voters.
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    (Original post by Damien96)
    I have no problem with criticising Trump or many of the reasons people voted for him. The bigger issue is the environment that allowed such an unqualified bigot to gain power. There is no one reason, and plenty of blame to go around, but the claustrophobic discourse, and throwing around the word racist, is a large part of it.

    Trump is the logical conclusion, not the catalyst.
    It's arguably a cause but is not the only or main cause as your OP implies.

    A far larger cause is the lefts failure to provide any economic alternative whatsoever to communities which have been battered by globalisation and neoliberalism.

    And the fact that they put up Clinton...
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    Also everyone should remember what Trump said he would do on his FIRST DAY

    Stop Obamacare
    End The War On Coal
    Remove Criminal Immigrants On Day One (Actually in the first hour of office)
    Build that Wall

    But his supporters don't care about whether or not he follows through on his policy proposals.Trump’s opponents take him literally but not seriously while his supporters take him seriously but not literally

    Maybe Congress will let him build a building somewhere, since that's what he knows. Mostly he'll whine and bluster, and blame the banks and the insurance companies and foreign governments and the Democrats and even his fellow Republicans, but he will not achieve a god damn thing.

    There will be no wall because it's an infrastructure project the Repubs won't want to pay for and Mexico surely won't. He'll sign whatever legislation Mitch and Paul can muster up. Goodbye planned parenthood, hello fetal personhood.

    I don't know whether Mitch gets rid of the filibuster--that would be a radical step even for him--but he'll threaten to do it and that'll stop the Dems from using it. Pence chooses the SCOTUS pick.

    Things will go on this way for a few weeks until one day a foreign leader pisses Trump off, and then it's hello, war. Obviously he'll want to hit ISIS, but they're already doing that, and Flynn has to get Putin's permission first to do anything rash.

    Everyone know he's hankering to sock it to Iran, but that will take time too. My bet is that it comes in March or April when North Korea usually gets riled up. Kim will be itching for a confrontation, and he knows Trump will bite. It'll escalate from there.

    This sounds like doomsaying, but I see nothing in Trump's character that would prevent him from launching a nuclear missile at Pyongyang five months hence.

    I do think he’s going to repeal Obamacare, obviously, whether or not he replaces it with something else. He’s going to replace Scalia with an even more far-right fire-breathing nutjob. He’s going to try to heavily pressure Kennedy to step down so he can replace him with the like.

    He’s going to begin the process of privatizing and ending Social Security and Medicare as we know them, and all other entitlements.

    Gone will be all of Obama’s executive orders, especially ones intended to right wrongs and level the playing field. Torture will be back in style, big time. Boots will be back on the ground in the mideast. Trade deals will be abandoned. The Iran deal will be nullified. Putin and Erdogan will be embraced, and Bibi will have his own room in the East Wing.

    Oh, and black lives officially no longer matter, more police killings of black men, more black people locked up, more closing down of black schools and businesses and limit investment in black areas, tighter controls on black and non-white immigrants, he'll look to open the door to more white immigrants though.
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    Reason 1:

    http://www.esquire.com/news-politics...rs-undercover/

    His chief strategist will be his campaign guy Bannon - ex boss of Breitbart, the alt-right bible.

    Reason 2:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YKeYbEOSqYc

    He captured a class of Americans that probably used to vote Democrat. There is no denying that there are some people of globalization. Same way there will be losers with ever-increasing technological advancement.

    Trump was very good at mobilizing these groups and get turnout. Hillary was not. And to boil it down to "call people racists and they will vote against you" is wishful thinking.
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    (Original post by MossSide50)
    Also everyone should remember what Trump said he would do on his FIRST DAY

    Stop Obamacare
    End The War On Coal
    Remove Criminal Immigrants On Day One (Actually in the first hour of office)
    Build that Wall

    But his supporters don't care about whether or not he follows through on his policy proposals.Trump’s opponents take him literally but not seriously while his supporters take him seriously but not literally

    Maybe Congress will let him build a building somewhere, since that's what he knows. Mostly he'll whine and bluster, and blame the banks and the insurance companies and foreign governments and the Democrats and even his fellow Republicans, but he will not achieve a god damn thing.

    There will be no wall because it's an infrastructure project the Repubs won't want to pay for and Mexico surely won't. He'll sign whatever legislation Mitch and Paul can muster up. Goodbye planned parenthood, hello fetal personhood.

    I don't know whether Mitch gets rid of the filibuster--that would be a radical step even for him--but he'll threaten to do it and that'll stop the Dems from using it. Pence chooses the SCOTUS pick.

    Things will go on this way for a few weeks until one day a foreign leader pisses Trump off, and then it's hello, war. Obviously he'll want to hit ISIS, but they're already doing that, and Flynn has to get Putin's permission first to do anything rash.

    Everyone know he's hankering to sock it to Iran, but that will take time too. My bet is that it comes in March or April when North Korea usually gets riled up. Kim will be itching for a confrontation, and he knows Trump will bite. It'll escalate from there.

    This sounds like doomsaying, but I see nothing in Trump's character that would prevent him from launching a nuclear missile at Pyongyang five months hence.

    I do think he’s going to repeal Obamacare, obviously, whether or not he replaces it with something else. He’s going to replace Scalia with an even more far-right fire-breathing nutjob. He’s going to try to heavily pressure Kennedy to step down so he can replace him with the like.

    He’s going to begin the process of privatizing and ending Social Security and Medicare as we know them, and all other entitlements.

    Gone will be all of Obama’s executive orders, especially ones intended to right wrongs and level the playing field. Torture will be back in style, big time. Boots will be back on the ground in the mideast. Trade deals will be abandoned. The Iran deal will be nullified. Putin and Erdogan will be embraced, and Bibi will have his own room in the East Wing.

    Oh, and black lives officially no longer matter, more police killings of black men, more black people locked up, more closing down of black schools and businesses and limit investment in black areas, tighter controls on black and non-white immigrants, he'll look to open the door to more white immigrants though.
    Almost nothing of that will happen.

    Everything Trump said in his campaign was strategically to gain votes. But he will only do a fraction of what he said.

    And launching a nuke? Lel.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Almost nothing of that will happen.

    Everything Trump said in his campaign was strategically to gain votes. But he will only do a fraction of what he said.

    And launching a nuke? Lel.
    Steve Bannon (Below) has been given a gig in the Trump Team.



    He’s one of the big chiefs in the Alt-Right movement (Which is just another fancy name for white supremacy) and runs the website Breitbart which is Alt-Right central.

    He looks like a total slob, a goddamned alcoholic, look at the nose and blood vessels all over his face. And the skin cancer popping up everywhere. At least Obama looked the part.

    Trump's team along with Rudy Gulliani is gonna be ugliest team ever (YEAH I'M THAT PETTY)

    So what positions do Hannity, O’Reilly and Limbaugh, the other stooges get.Hate crimes on the rise in schools and on the streets.

    The president elect should be doing something to promote calm, but he instead tweets and complains about the media, threatens his political opponents via Conway , and promotes a white nationalist crazy bomb thrower to a top position in his revised “swamp.

    Dylan Roof goes into a church and kills 9 black people. This is one of those cases where most white people can't squeeze out of it. But looks like he will not stand trial due to a judge saying he is not "mentally able" enough. (Yup - The old "mental illness" tactic)

    They are setting it up as I speak.

    These are radicalised white supremacists no different to Isis militants, by Isis fighters are mentally sick ? Roof knew exactly what he wanted to achieve. He worked out every painstaking detail, right down to the stock piling of ammunition and the use of multiple weapons — just so he could ensure an uninterrupted hail of gunfire. One gun runs out of ammo, switch to the next one. That’s architecture. That's engineering. His intent was to destroy as much as he possibly could in the shortest amount of time.

    I wouldn't be surprised if Trump didn't appoint Roof to his cabinet. Secretary of Defence.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Almost nothing of that will happen.

    Everything Trump said in his campaign was strategically to gain votes. But he will only do a fraction of what he said.

    And launching a nuke? Lel.
    Steve Bannon has been given a gig in the Trump Team. He’s one of the big chiefs in the Alt-Right movement (Which is just another fancy name for white supremacy) and runs the which is Alt-Right central.

    He looks like a total slob, a goddamned alcoholic, look at the nose and blood vessels all over his face. And the skin cancer popping up everywhere. At least Obama looked the part. Trump's team along with Rudy Gulliani is gonna be ugliest team ever (YEAH I'M THAT PETTY)

    So what positions do Hannity, O’Reilly and Limbaugh, the other stooges get ?

    Hate crimes on the rise in schools and on the streets. The president elect should be doing something to promote calm, but he instead tweets and complains about the media, threatens his political opponents via Conway , and promotes a white nationalist crazy bomb thrower to a top position in his revised “swamp.

    Dylan Roof goes into a church and kills 9 black people. This is one of those cases where most white people can't squeeze out of it.

    But looks like he will not stand trial due to a judge saying he is not "mentally able" enough. (Yup - The old "mental illness" tactic)

    They are setting it up as I speak. These are radicalised white supremacists no different to Isis militants, by Isis fighters are mentally sick ? Roof knew exactly what he wanted to achieve.

    He worked out every painstaking detail, right down to the stock piling of ammunition and the use of multiple weapons — just so he could ensure an uninterrupted hail of gunfire.

    One gun runs out of ammo, switch to the next one. That’s architecture. That's engineering. His intent was to destroy as much as he possibly could in the shortest amount of time.

    I wouldn't be surprised if Trump didn't appoint Roof to his cabinet. Secretary of Defence.
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    (Original post by MossSide50)
    x
    Don't misunderstand me, I don't support Trump at all. I just believe a lot of what he says will not happen.
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    (Original post by MossSide50)
    Also everyone should remember what Trump said he would do on his FIRST DAY

    Stop Obamacare
    End The War On Coal
    Remove Criminal Immigrants On Day One (Actually in the first hour of office)
    Build that Wall

    But his supporters don't care about whether or not he follows through on his policy proposals.Trump’s opponents take him literally but not seriously while his supporters take him seriously but not literally

    Maybe Congress will let him build a building somewhere, since that's what he knows. Mostly he'll whine and bluster, and blame the banks and the insurance companies and foreign governments and the Democrats and even his fellow Republicans, but he will not achieve a god damn thing.

    There will be no wall because it's an infrastructure project the Repubs won't want to pay for and Mexico surely won't. He'll sign whatever legislation Mitch and Paul can muster up. Goodbye planned parenthood, hello fetal personhood.

    I don't know whether Mitch gets rid of the filibuster--that would be a radical step even for him--but he'll threaten to do it and that'll stop the Dems from using it. Pence chooses the SCOTUS pick.

    Things will go on this way for a few weeks until one day a foreign leader pisses Trump off, and then it's hello, war. Obviously he'll want to hit ISIS, but they're already doing that, and Flynn has to get Putin's permission first to do anything rash.

    Everyone know he's hankering to sock it to Iran, but that will take time too. My bet is that it comes in March or April when North Korea usually gets riled up. Kim will be itching for a confrontation, and he knows Trump will bite. It'll escalate from there.

    This sounds like doomsaying, but I see nothing in Trump's character that would prevent him from launching a nuclear missile at Pyongyang five months hence.

    I do think he’s going to repeal Obamacare, obviously, whether or not he replaces it with something else. He’s going to replace Scalia with an even more far-right fire-breathing nutjob. He’s going to try to heavily pressure Kennedy to step down so he can replace him with the like.

    He’s going to begin the process of privatizing and ending Social Security and Medicare as we know them, and all other entitlements.

    Gone will be all of Obama’s executive orders, especially ones intended to right wrongs and level the playing field. Torture will be back in style, big time. Boots will be back on the ground in the mideast. Trade deals will be abandoned. The Iran deal will be nullified. Putin and Erdogan will be embraced, and Bibi will have his own room in the East Wing.

    Oh, and black lives officially no longer matter, more police killings of black men, more black people locked up, more closing down of black schools and businesses and limit investment in black areas, tighter controls on black and non-white immigrants, he'll look to open the door to more white immigrants though.
    I think I agree with most of this.
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    Tell me, does Donald pay his low-skilled workers enough?

    Do Americans need more jobs or better paid jobs?
    Thing is, outsourcing has been a big thing in America in recent years. People in middle America been losing their jobs all over the place with many many more to come. Despite what the media reports, one of the main themes of Trump's campaign and rallies has been about stopping and reversing this. You can't be surprised when people vote for this over someone who only offers more of the same. It might shock some people, but job security is something many people consider when voting.

    Now whether or not he can do it is another matter entirely of course.....
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    (Original post by yudothis)
    It is the same logic "say mean things about group x, then group x will do y".

    There is actually a guy on Islam threads alevelstress who was just saying that. How ironic you guys would now say that about Trump's voters.
    No,not saying something about some group but silencing them. It's a form of social censorship to tell people they are not allowed to have an opinion, address a problem or even joke about it without paying a huge price socially or even losing your job. When that problem is steeped in fear then yes, x will often do y. It doesn't take responsibility away, but it does explain a part of the problem.

    Whatever the case, comparing a vote to suicidal, mass murder is still ridiculous and hints at the type of hyperbole that I was originially getting at.
 
 
 
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