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German Hunter pays £39,000 to kill largest elephant in living memory watch

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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    So basically you have no defence to the forced impregnation of cows and killing of their babies so you can drink their milk? Glad we got that cleared up.
    No.

    I support it more than no kill dairy though
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    (Original post by JD1lla)
    Sort of depresses me thinking about a world with no meat...as bad as that sounds.
    My hope is soon well be able to grow all meat in a lab sustainably.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    redferry

    As much as this guy is annoying you you can bring facts to support his views. Al Though I can also think of facts that discredit some of his views based on the ethical axioms he subscribes to.

    I mean there are actual scientists that say certain primates should be given rights similar to human rights... They use scientific reasoning.

    Point is, they are all these views are based on totally arbitrary foundations.
    The pretentious nature of your posts are annoying. You don't see me moaning about that. Keep your personal comments to yourself in future please. It is not nice being called annoying.
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    The pretentious nature of your posts are annoying. You don't see me moaning about that. Keep your personal comments to yourself in future please. It is not nice being called annoying.
    Her posts have been completely sensible and informative. You've made plenty of personal comments calling us savages etc.
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    (Original post by redferry)

    I support it more than no kill dairy though
    That's also based on an arbitrary ethical stand point. You place environmental concerns on a macro level over individual well being of the animals human's rear.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    His views are based pureley on anthropomorpging animals in a way that I'd not at all supported by scientific evidence, so not really.

    Don't even get me started on primatologists and their totally unprofessionalism and disregard for scientific practice...
    People with different views are seen as annoying, unprofessional and show disregard for scientific practice because their own views don't line up with yours. Interesting...
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    The pretentious nature of your posts are annoying. You don't see me moaning about that. Keep your personal comments to yourself in future please. It is not nice being called annoying.
    I;m pretty sure I annoy redferry as well.

    Moan away.

    Ultimately, I think you are mostly right on an ethics level.
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    your reply is laughable. You cannot eat meat and have compassion for a dead animal. That's hypocritical. Also dairy cows suffer immensely so people have have milk so vegetarianism isn't much better in my opinion. If you truly care about animals you would go vegan. I don't buy the argument that you are living with your parents so cannot stop eating meat - that's rubbish. I live with my parents and i've become a vegan when they are not. You just don't care about animals enough to stop eating/consuming animal products. When you become a vegan I will take your 'compassion' towards animals seriously.

    Just wanted you to know what a great job you are doing on this thread.

    Also you've saved me the trouble of saying some things I know wouldn't go down well.


    There are few things that annoy me more than westerners complaining about this kind of thing when they are nearly all complicit in incredible,INCREDIBLE cruelty to animals just so they can eat foods they don't need to eat, ie for pleasure,not to mention wearing leather or sitting on leather sofas.


    Then again the people on this thread are mostly teenage girls I expect and thus its more understandable.

    No doubt that last sentence will be seen as patronising.It wasn't meant to be.When I was 11 I was immensely saddened to see,on a TV programme about the wild, a bear being shot and its cub being left by its mothers body.I cried myself to sleep that night I'm not ashamed to say.

    Then over a period of many years I came to realise - through newspaper articles and eventually books- just how disgustingly cruel the food industry is.

    The fact is that elephant almost certainly had a better life than 99% of the mammals on this planet.

    And that's down purely to the utter selfishness and hypocrisy of people.


    Anyone who is a vegan has my utmost respect.

    Far more respect than I have for anyone else on this forum indeed.
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    (Original post by redferry)
    My hope is soon well be able to grow all meat in a lab sustainably.
    Like the work of Patrick Brown, although that's entirely vegetarian.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    I;m pretty sure I annoy redferry as well.

    Moan away.
    I don't understand redferry. She is okay with drinking milk and eating cheese. Did you know to make 1gallon of milk 2000 gallons of water are needed? Yet she preaches about conversation, climate change, killing deer etc. I will never understand how her brain works. Her rationale and hypocrisy hust doesn't compute for me.
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    I don't understand redferry. She is okay with drinking milk and eating cheese. Did you know to make 1gallon of milk 2000 gallons of water are needed? Yet she preaches about conversation, climate change, killing deer etc. I will never understand how her brain works. Her rationale and hypocrisy hust doesn't compute for me.
    I also said you were annoying redferry... Which I think is fair to say is probably true?
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    (Original post by moggis)
    Just wanted you to know what a great job you are doing on this thread.

    Also you've saved me the trouble of saying some things I know wouldn't go down well.


    There are few things that annoy me more than westerners complaining about this kind of thing when they are nearly all complicit in incredible,INCREDIBLE cruelty to animals just so they can eat foods they don't need to eat, ie for pleasure,not to mention wearing leather or sitting on leather sofas.


    Then again the people on this thread are mostly teenage girls I expect and thus its more understandable.

    No doubt that last sentence will be seen as patronising.It wasn't meant to be.When I was 11 I was immensely saddened to see on to a programme about the wild and saw a bear bring shot and its cub being left by its mothers body.I cried myself to sleep I do believe I'm not ashamed to say.

    Then over a period of many years I came to realise - through newspaper articles and eventually books- just how disgustingly cruel the food industry is.

    The fact is that elephant almost certainly had a better life than 99% of the mammals on this planet.

    And that's down purely to the utter selfishness and hypocrisy of people.


    Anyone who is a vegan has my utmost respect.

    Far more respect than I have for anyone else on this forum indeed.
    Thank you for your kind words and support. Sorry to hear about the bear documentary you saw. Sounds truly horrific, especially to watch at a young age. I hope you are on the path to veganism or are considering it. If you need something to help you on your way, I highly recommend watching Earthlings. I became a vegan overnight after watching it. Becoming a vegan for ethical reasons is far easier than for environmental reasons.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Ultimately, I think you are mostly right on an ethics level.
    He sees animals as our equals.

    That is simply not practical, or morally sound.
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    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    I also said you were annoying redferry... Which I think is fair to say is probably true?
    Probably true but no need to make personal attacks. Keep to the debate. Calling people annoying is just petty.
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    (Original post by JD1lla)
    He sees animals as our equals.

    That is simply not practical, or morally sound.
    Maybe replace 'mostly' 'sort of'. There is some sense in what he is saying though imo.
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    (Original post by JD1lla)
    He sees animals as our equals.

    That is simply not practical, or morally sound.
    If it is practical for me, anyone can do it. Laziness is no excuse. Also what is the moral flaw? Being kind to animals by not killing them is not morally flawed. Sounds like you are clutching at straws and trying to defend the slaughter and torture of animals without explaining why. Do elaborate the moral flaw in my choice.
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    If it is practical for me anyone can do it. Laziness is no excuse. Also what is the moral flaw? Being kind to animals by not killing them is not morally flawed. Sounds like you are clutching at straws and trying to defend the slaughter and torture of animals without explaining why. Do elaborate the moral flaw in my choice.
    No, treating them as equals is morally flawed. They are not our equals? In what way is an animal equal to a human? Take for example, a coral. It is a Marine invertebrates which are multicellular animals.

    Do you think that a coral, WHICH IS AN ANIMAL, is equal to a human being?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Flynn_Reef.jpg heres some coral
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    (Original post by JD1lla)
    No, treating them as equals is morally flawed. They are not our equals? In what way is an animal equal to a human? Take for example, a coral. It is a Marine invertebrates which are multicellular animals.

    Do you think that a coral, WHICH IS AN ANIMAL, is equal to a human being?

    https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...Flynn_Reef.jpg heres some coral
    Why is treating animals as equals morally flawed? I don't see how moral comes into it. A cow wouldn't kill us, but we kill it. A cow doesn't harm me so I down harm a cow. What is the flaw in that? Are you going to use the: "but a lion would kill you" argument in defence of that too? :rolleyes:

    And to answer your latter question, yes, we are equals with coral. We should not be damaging their ecosystem. But again, I don't see the moral flaw in caring about coral. Why is it flawed to care about something?
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    Why is treating animals as equals morally flawed? I don't see how moral comes into it. A cow wouldn't kill us, but we kill it. A cow doesn't harm me so I down harm a cow. What is the flaw in that? Are you going to use the: "but a lion would kill you" argument in defence of that too? :rolleyes:

    And to answer your latter question, yes, we are equals with coral. We should not be damaging their ecosystem.
    You think we are equal with corals.

    Man I want some of that sh*t you've been smoking.

    I didn't say it's morally flawed to care about something. I said it's morally flawed to treat animals, especially f**king CORAL?!!! as our EQUALS?! Are you insane? Are you actually batsh*t crazy? You want to tell me that parasitic worms that kill children are equal to humans?
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    (Original post by rock_climber86)
    If it is practical for me, anyone can do it. Laziness is no excuse. Also what is the moral flaw? Being kind to animals by not killing them is not morally flawed. Sounds like you are clutching at straws and trying to defend the slaughter and torture of animals without explaining why. Do elaborate the moral flaw in my choice.
    Really there are several levels of cruelty here, killing a (supposedly) protected, wild animal for fun, which is completely morally indefensible. vs killing a domestically bred animal grown expressly for food, to feed people. which is sort of ok because people have to eat.
    at least that's the majority opinion.
 
 
 
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