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Do people have the moral 'right' to call each other fat? watch

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    (Original post by ziziii)
    1. i'm glad we agree about that

    2. however, you may wish to reconsider your statement based on a misunderstanding. it's not so much that i want fat people to "change [in order to...] be more like [me]" as you suggested. in fact, it's not that at all. i just don't think it's morally right to be fat in the first place. this is for biological reasons; we as a species, just like any other, thrive on survival of the fittest to pass on genetic material that is well-adapted and that we consider 'attractive'. no matter how we try to bend social perceptions, ultimately, extra fat collected on the body in soft lumps is simply not attractive. on top of that, there are health hazards involved. it has been long established that being fat can be very unhealthy, and will likely pose dangers in the long run. why wreck your body that way? it's not natural or desirable, and it should be addressed appropriately as the epidemic that it is.
    I can see what you're arguing and I don't overeat for the same reason, but if people want to overeat, then just let them. People aren't stupid and will realise if they're being unkind to their bodies.
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    (Original post by bottled)
    I really don't recall saying that taxing junk food was fat... i did say in my post it's stupid.

    Moreover, let's not insult doctors. they're not being smug when they say 'what you're doing is unhealthy you should not do it' they aren't making you do anything, they are advising you. They're doing their job. y'know like how they may recommend you to not smoke, cause it may hurt your health, but
    OK, I'll admit I was a bit harsh towards doctors. They can advise, but it's like they're stating the obvious. NHS is funded by the government, I want less government intervention in our lives.

    moreover everything has a side to it. Again, people are getting taxed unnecessarily , and the junk food tax may well reduce profits from businesses making it harder for more chains to open. (i'm no economist, just conjecture'. The more people making food, the more jobs of course, but that also results in more food wastage, more greenhouse gases released into the atmosphere, and more litter on the floor.
    1. You're right, if people are taxed there's less incentive to make money, so fewer chains will open, thus creating fewer jobs. I don't believe that's fair, so I see no need for a junk food tax or over tax (other than the basic rates).
    2. Leftover food can be distributed to charities, international aid, etc.
    3. Greenhouse gases, but you can apply that to anything.
    4. People don't have to litter. They should carry their rubbish home with them or wait until they find a bin.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    I can see what you're arguing and I don't overeat for the same reason, but if people want to overeat, then just let them.
    Sure.
    Just make sure that they will get a private health care. Why should I pay for pills for someone who got fat and diabetic?* From the other hand- maybe it's better- those who work will die out earlier, without getting state pension. More money for everyone else.


    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    People aren't stupid
    they are- just look how many obese people *have* to eat at kfc/mcdonald instead of cooking something healthier (which is neither expensive nor hard).

    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    and will realise if they're being unkind to their bodies.
    yeah, right.

    *yes, i know, you may be fat and not be diabetic or have good lifestyle/be fit and be diabetic.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    Sure, I agree, that then applies to anything, not just being fat.
    Agreed
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    I can see what you're arguing and I don't overeat for the same reason, but if people want to overeat, then just let them. People aren't stupid and will realise if they're being unkind to their bodies.
    i do let them! i would be infringing their rights to prevent them from overeating, if that is what they want to do. that being said, my only point is that i find it unnatural, and therefore arguably even morally incorrect. and unattractive, biologically. but certainly not liable to punishment. many people smoke, conscious of the risks, and eventually require healthcare funded by taxpayers. i myself smoke, so perhaps one day i will laugh at the way i treated fat people. i'm glad you understand my main point though.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    OK, I'll admit I was a bit harsh towards doctors. They can advise, but it's like they're stating the obvious. NHS is funded by the government, I want less government intervention in our lives.



    1. You're right, if people are taxed there's less incentive to make money, so fewer chains will open, thus creating fewer jobs. I don't believe that's fair, so I see no need for a junk food tax or over tax (other than the basic rates).
    2. Leftover food can be distributed to charities, international aid, etc.
    3. Greenhouse gases, but you can apply that to anything.
    4. People don't have to litter. They should carry their rubbish home with them or wait until they find a bin.
    That's the issue. There's a real issue about left over food right now. Take supermarkets (not quite fast food joints but whatever) they are infamous for throwing away foods just because they passed their best before date. Stuff like breads, which could easily be eaten up. IIRC there were homeless people who'd go around the back and just pick up their left over foodstuff.

    you are pretty much right about the greenhouse gases, and i do concede i was sorta grasping for straws there lol.

    Moreover, People don't have to litter. but they do. i've seen gum on the floor, bones on buses, chicken and chips boxes in tubes. That sort of nice stuff, fact of the matter is. some people just don't give a crap, and will just litter regardless. people in my school for instance would just discard crisp packets on the floor, because they can't be bothered to stick it in the bin a few meters away. that sort of junk.
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    [QUOTE=simon_g;42299612]Sure.
    Just make sure that they will get a private health care. Why should I pay for pills for someone who got fat and diabetic?* From the other hand- maybe it's better- those who work will die out earlier, without getting state pension. More money for everyone else.[/qupte]

    OK, but I favour a watered down version of the current social security system we have today.

    they are- just look how many obese people *have* to eat at kfc/mcdonald instead of cooking something healthier (which is neither expensive nor hard).
    LOL, if there are alternative they are making the choice to.

    yeah, right.

    *yes, i know, you may be fat and not be diabetic or have good lifestyle/be fit and be diabetic.
    What's "yeah right" about what I said?
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    (Original post by bottled)
    That's the issue. There's a real issue about left over food right now. Take supermarkets (not quite fast food joints but whatever) they are infamous for throwing away foods just because they passed their best before date. Stuff like breads, which could easily be eaten up. IIRC there were homeless people who'd go around the back and just pick up their left over foodstuff.

    you are pretty much right about the greenhouse gases, and i do concede i was sorta grasping for straws there lol.

    Moreover, People don't have to litter. but they do. i've seen gum on the floor, bones on buses, chicken and chips boxes in tubes. That sort of nice stuff, fact of the matter is. some people just don't give a crap, and will just litter regardless. people in my school for instance would just discard crisp packets on the floor, because they can't be bothered to stick it in the bin a few meters away. that sort of junk.
    1. I agree about the best before dates, it's really arbitrary. The best way to tell if food is off is to smell them. E.g. my current loaf of bread expired on 16 April, it's still fine now!

    2. But the people who spit out gum, discard crisp packets and general littering have personal issues (i.e. laziness) that they should tackle head on, in no better way than walking towards their nearest bin! I see no excuse for littering. But it's not the fault of excess food. It's individuals and their lazy and entitled attitudes. E.g. a gun is a gun, it doesn't kill anyone until someone picks it up and uses it deliberately. So food is food it's there to sustain and enjoy, however people choose to litter and be wasteful.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    And? Your parents and family have to live with your silly attitude.
    Oh look, insults rather than logic and rationality. How original.


    1. Fat people aren't a rare breed of people who do not pay taxes, some of whom are likely to be high earners and pay more tax than you do.
    2. I am skeptical towards the NHS and this idea of paying into a society. But that's for another discussion.
    Most fat people won't pay enough to cover their costs. How do I know this? Because 62% of the country is overweight...and 62% are not high earners.


    That's your opinion, not fact. It's ridiculous that you would even try to pass it off as fact. As I have said, overweight people are still people and can have nice looking faces or hair - those features contribute towards attractiveness. Just as slim people, blondes, brunettes or red hairs are as well. Characteristics do not define. If the fat is out of proportion and clothes are unflattering, yes that is unattractive, but that's not an excuse to say everyone who is fat is unattractive. I've seen some very ugly slim people... Weren't you taught that people come in all shapes and sizes?
    No, it is a fact. It has been proven in numerous research papers :rolleyes: You won't argue over gravity or the earth being round, so apply the same logic here and don't argue with overweight is unattractive.

    Erm, something like being fat does define. It changes a vast number of physical attributes. Waists become smaller, boobs become saggy, legs fatter, stomachs bigger, face rounder, the person looks older etc. Being overweight makes you look worse.



    Stop generalizing and that's bull**** reasoning, not everyone fat person whines and cries about being fat. If they were I'd be the first person to tell them to do something about it as they clearly want to change. But if they're happy, leave them alone.
    :rofl: Ok, warp reality. How many people have you ever met who are happy being single when they are 30+?
    Also no one is happy being fat. No one goes "Hey! You know what? I'm going to get fat! Yup, I want to be fat as it sounds like a great idea!".
    Being fat is always accidental/a result of a problem.


    As someone who is slightly bigger I happen to have a high standard of life. Even if I did hate my life, why would you need to intervene unless I asked you to?
    Oh I don't want to help you or intervene, just kick overweight people out of the country :awesome: Most overweight people have chosen to become like that and I have no patience for people who have chosen such silly options when all the information is there to avoid it, along with your instinct.
    As I said, overweight people only cause problems, be it in life or in health. No one become fat from having good self control and determination.
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    When fat people who've been fat for ages get offended when people call them fat... If they cared so much they'd have lost some weight by then.
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    LOL, if there are alternative they are making the choice to.
    Dare to elaborate? Almost always there are alternatives, usually- quite cheap. Like: 3kg of frozen chicken breast for a tenner, bag of barley for 90p (you can feed on it for a week), fresh veggies from Lidl/Aldi or local market etc- all that is reasonable cheap and easy to cook.
    And yes, I know what I'm talking about: I also used to prefere to order a pizza/go to kfc than to prepare something by myself. results? weight over 100kg and problems with buying good looking pants.
    And if I could do it, everyone else should. Especially if its a mummy with children- than they should be even more eager to do something.



    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    What's "yeah right" about what I said?
    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    and will realise if they're being unkind to their bodies.
    yeah. they will realize. Good for them. How many people will do anything?

    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    1. I agree about the best before dates, it's really arbitrary. The best way to tell if food is off is to smell them. E,g. my current loaf of bread expired on 16 April, it's still fine now!
    "Best before" date is, as you wrote, an arbitrary (more or less) date- after it, it will loose it's "good look" etc- but still will be edible- if stored properly (i.e. in cool dry place).
    For example: i'm feeding on "scottish porridge oats" with BB date of Oct 11... :P
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Oh look, insults rather than logic and rationality. How original.
    You were the one insulting people just because they are fat. I think someone's attitude is a better indicator of their character than their size.

    Most fat people won't pay enough to cover their costs. How do I know this? Because 62% of the country is overweight...and 62% are not high earners.
    Then change the system so they do cover the cost, that goes for anyone.

    No, it is a fact. It has been proven in numerous research papers :rolleyes: You won't argue over gravity or the earth being round, so apply the same logic here and don't argue with overweight is unattractive.

    Erm, something like being fat does define. It changes a vast number of physical attributes. Waists become smaller, boobs become saggy, legs fatter, stomachs bigger, face rounder, the person looks older etc. Being overweight makes you look worse.
    Why don't you just focus on you and your attractiveness then? Stop trying to be the martyr and make the "fat people" change so they're suddenly attractive.

    :rofl: Ok, warp reality. How many people have you ever met who are happy being single when they are 30+?
    So what if they're single? Not everyone thinks relationships are important. Don't assume happiness depends on that. Even if someone is unhappy, that's their problem, not yours.

    Also no one is happy being fat. No one goes "Hey! You know what? I'm going to get fat! Yup, I want to be fat as it sounds like a great idea!".
    Being fat is always accidental/a result of a problem.
    Some people were fat during the childhood years (making it harder to break those habits, I don't condone this, parents have the responsibility to feed their children properly but also allow them to make choices if they want to eat unhealthier foods) or some people may think they look better a few pounds (note a few, not morbidly obese) heavier. Again, its' not your problem and don't quote health concerns as I don't want to discuss the NHS as it's too off track (but I see your point but my suggestion is they pay for it).

    Oh I don't want to help you or intervene, just kick overweight people out of the country :awesome:
    You do seem like you want to help them become more attractive (how sweet, but oh so very shallow and superficial) or perceived health threats or how it lessens their chances of a relationship or makes it harder to work with. If people complain about their size, it's because they like to complain, not because they're fat. Again, slim people complain, not necessarily about the size, but other things. Get over it, people complain, now direct your vendetta elsewhere.

    Most overweight people have chosen to become like that and I have no patience for people who have chosen such silly options when all the information is there to avoid it, along with your instinct.
    For the one millionth time, don't be friends with them then. You can't change other people. You do realize they're just eating more, they're not doing silly things like robbing a bank or running away from a family. Get a grip.

    As I said, overweight people only cause problems, be it in life or in health. No one become fat from having good self control and determination.
    But they may exercise it in other areas and not see their size as an issue if their health is in tact. Not everyone cares about looks or relationships, you're really superficial Jim. :sadnod: - not good.

    (Original post by simon_g)
    Dare to elaborate? Almost always there are alternatives, usually- quite cheap. Like: 3kg of frozen chicken breast for a tenner, bag of barley for 90p (you can feed on it for a week), fresh veggies from Lidl/Aldi or local market etc- all that is reasonable cheap and easy to cook.
    Exactly. But if they choose McDonald's or KFC, why does it matter to you?

    And yes, I know what I'm talking about: I also used to prefere to order a pizza/go to kfc than to prepare something by myself. results? weight over 100kg and problems with buying good looking pants.
    And if I could do it, everyone else should. Especially if its a mummy with children- than they should be even more eager to do something.
    Quite, which is what I meant by "they will realize". You did something about it, others will do something about theirs; you're not an isolated case. You can't bring a horse to water and make it drink it. It will build up resentment. But you can display the water and encourage them to. What I think should happen is leave people to their own devices, sooner or later they will realize eating fast food all day isn't doing anything for them: it's greasy, fattening and loses its appeal after a while. So they will turn to alternatives like the healthier options and have fast food as a treat. But having a breathing dragon down your neck will only make matters worse, and people will do the opposite to spite them.
    yeah. they will realize. Good for them. How many people will do anything?
    "Best before" date is, as you wrote, an arbitrary (more or less) date- after it, it will loose it's "good look" etc- but still will be edible- if stored properly (i.e. in cool dry place).
    For example: i'm feeding on "scottish porridge oats" with BB date of Oct 11... :P
    I'm not sure of the situation but are there legal implications for supermarkets if they do stock out of date food? That's not really fair, especially if it's edible after.
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    I used to be quite overweight and I had strangers actually shout stuff at me in the street like fatty, lose some weight etc it caused me to develop anxiety and I had to be put on medication for it. People should keep their mouths shut and keep their mind on their own business in my opinion lol xx
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    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    You were the one insulting people just because they are fat. I think someone's attitude is a better indicator of their character than their size.

    Then change the system so they do cover the cost, that goes for anyone.

    Why don't you just focus on you and your attractiveness then? Stop trying to be the martyr and make the "fat people" change so they're suddenly attractive.

    So what if they're single? Not everyone thinks relationships are important. Don't assume happiness depends on that. Even if someone is unhappy, that's their problem, not yours.

    Some people were fat during the childhood years (making it harder to break those habits, I don't condone this, parents have the responsibility to feed their children properly but also allow them to make choices if they want to eat unhealthier foods) or some people may think they look better a few pounds (note a few, not morbidly obese) heavier. Again, its' not your problem and don't quote health concerns as I don't want to discuss the NHS as it's too off track (but I see your point but my suggestion is they pay for it).

    You do seem like you want to help them become more attractive (how sweet, but oh so very shallow and superficial) or perceived health threats or how it lessens their chances of a relationship or makes it harder to work with. If people complain about their size, it's because they like to complain, not because they're fat. Again, slim people complain, not necessarily about the size, but other things. Get over it, people complain, now direct your vendetta elsewhere.

    For the one millionth time, don't be friends with them then. You can't change other people. You do realize they're just eating more, they're not doing silly things like robbing a bank or running away from a family. Get a grip.

    But they may exercise it in other areas and not see their size as an issue if their health is in tact. Not everyone cares about looks or relationships, you're really superficial Jim. :sadnod: - not good.
    Hm, so you think debates work by utterly ignoring every point someone makes and go off on a random rant? :facepalm:

    • What part of "I have to live and work with people" do you not understand?
    • What part of "NHS" do you not understand? That is not going to change so stop acting like it will.



    All you do is rant on about me wanting to help people (:confused:) and wanting to be left alone. Clearly that is because you have a problem with people offering advice, think people only want to help you (has this happened to you before?) etc as I have said none of that, simply "I don't like fat people because of what they stand for". How is that advice? :rofl:

    Wanting a happy family is sad and superficial? :lolwut: Wow, talk about warping reality.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    Oh look, insults rather than logic and rationality. How original.




    Most fat people won't pay enough to cover their costs. How do I know this? Because 62% of the country is overweight...and 62% are not high earners.




    No, it is a fact. It has been proven in numerous research papers :rolleyes: You won't argue over gravity or the earth being round, so apply the same logic here and don't argue with overweight is unattractive.

    Erm, something like being fat does define. It changes a vast number of physical attributes. Waists become smaller, boobs become saggy, legs fatter, stomachs bigger, face rounder, the person looks older etc. Being overweight makes you look worse.





    :rofl: Ok, warp reality. How many people have you ever met who are happy being single when they are 30+?
    Also no one is happy being fat. No one goes "Hey! You know what? I'm going to get fat! Yup, I want to be fat as it sounds like a great idea!".
    Being fat is always accidental/a result of a problem.




    Oh I don't want to help you or intervene, just kick overweight people out of the country :awesome: Most overweight people have chosen to become like that and I have no patience for people who have chosen such silly options when all the information is there to avoid it, along with your instinct.
    As I said, overweight people only cause problems, be it in life or in health. No one become fat from having good self control and determination.
    you cant stop my happiness
    Cos i like the way i am
    And you just cant stop my knife and fork
    When i see a christmas ham
    So if you dont like the way i look
    Well i just dont give a damn
    Cos the world keeps turning round and around..
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    If I truly cared for someone I would tell them straight it they're too fat or thin, I told friend she was getting too skinny as she saw it as the only being attractive. Just don't let go to the extreme otherwise there is no problem.
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    (Original post by MrHappy_J)
    you cant stop my happiness
    Cos i like the way i am
    And you just cant stop my knife and fork
    When i see a christmas ham
    So if you dont like the way i look
    Well i just dont give a damn
    Cos the world keeps turning round and around..
    Haha.
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    (Original post by MrHappy_J)
    you cant stop my happiness
    Cos i like the way i am
    And you just cant stop my knife and fork
    When i see a christmas ham
    So if you dont like the way i look
    Well i just dont give a damn
    Cos the world keeps turning round and around..
    And you will keep getting healthier, less attractive and more miserable...because you didn't choose to become overweight did you? Most likely your lack of control caused that.
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    (Original post by Jimbo1234)
    And you will keep getting healthier, less attractive and more miserable...because you didn't choose to become overweight did you? Most likely your lack of control caused that.
    lol at how you think that anyone who doesn't hate fat people must be fat themselves...

    sorry but it strikes me as slightly Nazi when you said fat people should be kicked out of the country...

    a lot of them are quite jolly actually
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    (Original post by MrHappy_J)
    lol at how you think that anyone who doesn't hate fat people must be fat themselves...

    sorry but it strikes me as slightly Nazi when you said fat people should be kicked out of the country...
    You're an old user and we've had this dance many times before. I know what side of the scale you are on so I'm not presuming anything.

    "Slightly nazi", wow, what a spectacular argument. Or how about I don't want to live with miserable people who lack ambition, self control, motivation, the ability to deal with emotional issues etc. But just to make it fair, I would want a lot of people kicked out of this country for numerous reasons, not just overweight people, though that would be 62% of England...so it really is a massive problem.


    (Original post by Iron Lady)
    What part of it doesn't affect you if someone is fat, don't you understand? Go on, please explain why it's so difficult to "live" and "work" with heavier people. Just stay away if it offends you so much.
    Are you deliberately being obtuse? :dunce: People who are overweight will have more sick days, will likely be lazier, lack self control, emotional support etc. As I have said, being fat is a unwanted byproduct of another problem. WHy are you in absolute denial about this? Do you honestly think 62% of people said "Hey! lets get fat !"?


    If someone overeats, it affects them, they pay the fine. Simples. But they do pay taxes.
    Again, you are not reading what I post. We all pay the fine in taxes. Most overweight people will take more from the NHS then they contribute. You keeping up with that?


    You imply it's for the "greater good".
    How is losing weight not going to benefit them? :rolleyes:

    I only do when: 1) they're forceful, 2) they're wrong and 3) when they're not perfect. Ultimately I am in control.
    Issue with control. Got it :top:

    I'm not fat. But I'm a staunch defender of freedom.
    Before you said you where. Why the change in mind?


    What the....? "What they stand for"? They're not a collective entity, all with similar outlooks and views. They probably stand for eating too much and exercising not enough according to you, but so ****ing what? You're not perfect, Jimmy. All of your reasons (like I have to live and work with people doesn't make sense) are silly; healthcare issues can be resolved, or simply ignore heavier people if they upset you so much. You need some perspective.
    See above.
    No one is perfect, but being overweight shows only very bad qualities. You are warping reality with liberalism. You make out that people are not instinctively affected by becoming fat, that they don't emotionally change etc. They do. Go use google scholar if you want to argue otherwise.


    No, you're sad and superficial because you base someone's self-worth on their eating habits and size.
    See above. Basing someone on their actions is a pretty damn good idea. Not too is flat out retarded.
 
 
 
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