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    The newspaper released some provocative pictures which definitely angered Islamic extremists not surprised this happened but I obviously don't condone it. Rest in peace.
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    (Original post by midnightice)
    there are absolute nut-cases out there who shouldn't be provoked because they are bat-**** insane.
    so, what should we do ? hand them over our society and our State ?
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    BTW the first police office who is thought to have been executed, was not. The bullet missed as you can see it ricochet off the pavement, hence the lack of blood and his head being split open.
    Second note, I mean, people say you can't blame the whole religion for x people's actions. But surely there has to be a line or some point at which action has to be took, its not a valid point to keep using that EVERY single time Muslims execute and murder people. It just seems like a kop out tbh, if it was any other religion then action but would be took, but nothing ever happens to these Muslims.
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    it has the same claim to legitimacy that other forms of Islam have

    and who are you to make takfir (i.e. declare to be non-Muslims) on "Islamic radicals" ?
    Which would be?

    Yet I never made takfir, dear old mariachi.
    All I said was radicalism as a concept, does not have a place in Islam.
    Racialists, on the other hand can only be ultimately judged by God, and have no further say on this.
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    Those claiming that it provoked the attack should really accept that if an ideology / religion is such that a cartoon is a sufficient provocation for a murder then it is simply a mad ideology..
    Uncensored video... https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i-FFx7Xy0Uo Maybe some people need it to feel the pain..
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    (Original post by IceJJFish(II))
    It's obviously more than a cartoon. The prophet is revered in a way that most can't comprehend (as there's not really a similar figure, could say Jesus in Christianity), and depictions are a big no-no. Of course you can argue freedom of speech, but what is there to gain from these cartoons bar spreading hatred?
    How is drawing a cartoon of your prophet in itself spreading hatred?

    It is attitudes like yours and incidents like this that spread hatred.
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    (Original post by missfats)
    Can you actually, just post a hadith that shows this?
    TheWikiIslam website, never fails to confuse me.

    Yet you seem to pick the "opposite reinterpretation", when Islam is presented in good light due to your own perfect agenda against this theology. And pick the original interpretation, when it's in a bad light to score points. I guess what perfectly describes people like you, in your own words is " the disingenuous and mendacious".

    Muhammad's assassination of the poet Ka'b ibn Al-Ashraf is stated in Sahih Bukhari, twice, and Sahih Muslim. Here's one, Bukhari vol 5 book 59, number 369:

    Narrated Jabir bin 'Abdullah:
    Allah's Apostle said, "Who is willing to kill Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf who has hurt Allah and His Apostle?" Thereupon Muhammad bin Maslama got up saying, "O Allah's Apostle! Would you like that I kill him?" The Prophet said, "Yes," Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Then allow me to say a (false) thing (i.e. to deceive Kab). "The Prophet said, "You may say it." Then Muhammad bin Maslama went to Kab and said, "That man (i.e. Muhammad demands Sadaqa (i.e. Zakat) from us, and he has troubled us, and I have come to borrow something from you." On that, Kab said, "By Allah, you will get tired of him!" Muhammad bin Maslama said, "Now as we have followed him, we do not want to leave him unless and until we see how his end is going to be. Now we want you to lend us a camel load or two of food." (Some difference between narrators about a camel load or two.) Kab said, "Yes, (I will lend you), but you should mortgage something to me." Muhammad bin Mas-lama and his companion said, "What do you want?" Ka'b replied, "Mortgage your women to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our women to you and you are the most handsome of the 'Arabs?" Ka'b said, "Then mortgage your sons to me." They said, "How can we mortgage our sons to you? Later they would be abused by the people's saying that so-and-so has been mortgaged for a camel load of food. That would cause us great disgrace, but we will mortgage our arms to you." Muhammad bin Maslama and his companion promised Kab that Muhammad would return to him. He came to Kab at night along with Kab's foster brother, Abu Na'ila. Kab invited them to come into his fort, and then he went down to them. His wife asked him, "Where are you going at this time?" Kab replied, "None but Muhammad bin Maslama and my (foster) brother Abu Na'ila have come." His wife said, "I hear a voice as if dropping blood is from him, Ka'b said. "They are none but my brother Muhammad bin Maslama and my foster brother Abu Naila. A generous man should respond to a call at night even if invited to be killed." Muhammad bin Maslama went with two men. (Some narrators mention the men as 'Abu bin Jabr. Al Harith bin Aus and Abbad bin Bishr). So Muhammad bin Maslama went in together with two men, and sail to them, "When Ka'b comes, I will touch his hair and smell it, and when you see that I have got hold of his head, strip him. I will let you smell his head." Kab bin Al-Ashraf came down to them wrapped in his clothes, and diffusing perfume. Muhammad bin Maslama said. " have never smelt a better scent than this. Ka'b replied. "I have got the best 'Arab women who know how to use the high class of perfume." Muhammad bin Maslama requested Ka'b "Will you allow me to smell your head?" Ka'b said, "Yes." Muhammad smelt it and made his companions smell it as well. Then he requested Ka'b again, "Will you let me (smell your head)?" Ka'b said, "Yes." When Muhammad got a strong hold of him, he said (to his companions), "Get at him!" So they killed him and went to the Prophet and informed him. (Abu Rafi) was killed after Ka'b bin Al-Ashraf."

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    (Original post by Radicalathiest)
    So what should the backlash be against muslims then?
    Obviously not murder, think of the poor terrorists! They're just excercising their right to- hold on, no that's not right. It seems as though this person thinks murder is a right but free speech isn't...
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    (Original post by missfats)
    I never made takfir, dear old mariachi.
    yes, you did dear old missfats

    when you say that someone's Islam, is not Islam, you are making takfir

    in fact, if you say that the Paris terrorists are not Muslim, you are making takfir
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    (Original post by DiddyDec)
    Even the Guardian backs Charlie Hebdo's right to free speech even though it may cause offense.

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/gre...e-hebdo-attack
    Thanks for posting that - a really interesting piece.

    His last sentence sums up the origin and the purpose of satire brilliantly.

    "Satire challenges sacred cows, but it does not slaughter them. Satire hurts, but it does not cause physical injury. Satire wounds, but it does not kill."
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    (Original post by missfats)
    Said, I copied and pasted much of what I wrote... I only copied a definition? mate, are you seriously going to go clutch at straws... it's quite painful reading your last line but the ramblings above, is what's worse.

    1) Please learn your history? But don't worry! I'll do your homework for you, because I couldn't trust you to... His name is Ernst Rohm.... and many more homosexuals in the commands of Nazi Germany.

    2)...but the core principles of feminism is to achieve equality, whereas radical feminism, wants to oust the patriarchy and create the new superior sex "Females". It has nothing to do with feminism... because it shuns it's core principle. Sounds similar to Islamic radicalism!
    As you can see, followers aren't all as you'd like. Radical Islam is not a form of Islam, it is man-made and has nothing to do with Islam.

    3) Yet I never mentioned "alcohol" in my post, did I now?
    So first, you accuse me of copying (from where?), then you accuse me of typing "alcohol"? what! I said "drunkenness" is not allowed in Christianity, ergo (before you accuse me of copying, these are quotes from the bible, so pipe down). Ephesians 5:18 ESV / 315 helpful votes

    And do not get drunk with wine, for that is debauchery, but be filled with the Spirit,

    Galatians 5:21 ESV / 234 helpful votes

    Envy, drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

    Proverbs 20:1 ESV / 164 helpful votes

    Wine is a mocker, strong drink a brawler, and whoever is led astray by it is not wise.

    1 Peter 5:8 ESV / 129 helpful votes

    Be sober-minded; be watchful. Your adversary the devil prowls around like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.


    4) What did this have anything to do with my #4? You randomly quote for what purpose?

    Please stop kidding around.
    1. Yes and what happened to Rohm? Oh wait Hitler had him killed

    2. Feminism is not ONE ideology. There is not ONE feminist manifesto. There is however ONE quran.

    3. So what? You are missing the point. People don't criticise religions for things that go against their teachings. And Jesus drank wine... one of the many biblical contradictions.

    4. These verses of the quran clearly condone what happened today. Hence Islam is responsible.
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    A piece by the Guardian of all papers which actually backs Charlie Hebdo's freedom of speech.

    http://www.theguardian.com/media/gre...e-hebdo-attack
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    yes, you did dear old missfats

    when you say that someone's Islam, is not Islam, you are making takfir

    in fact, if you say that the Paris terrorists are not Muslim, you are making takfir
    Now, my good mariachi... let's not get ahead of ourselves.

    I said - radical Islam does not have a place in Islam.
    Nothing about radical Muslims.


    Dear Lord! Everyone who states "radicalism and moderation in Islam is a facade, and only one Islam exists" must be making takfir - including tons of sheiks and scholars.
    I honestly can't take you seriously any more, miss mariachi.



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    Absolutely horrified by today's attack. I know quite a few Muslims living in Paris, and they are just as outraged and shocked.A very sad day for freedom of expression.The fact that incidents like this are becoming increasingly common in secular countries is alarming.
    These murderers did not 'avenge the prophet.' Honestly so saddened
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    I posted some of the names of the people ordered to be killed by Muhammad in the ISOC thread, in response to a ludicrous claim that he never even once sent anyone to kill those who 'abused' or 'harassed' him. Needless to say, it's been entirely ignored.
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    The people making excuses for these vile murderers barely deserve Western citizenship

    If you hate freedom of speech so much, why don't you go live in the Islamic State? Surely you would feel more comfortable there?
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    (Original post by missfats)

    I said - radical Islam does not have a place in Islam.
    this makes about as much sense as saying that extreme Communism does not have a place in Communism
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    (Original post by childofthesun)
    Absolutely horrified by today's attack. I know quite a few Muslims living in Paris, and they are just as outraged and shocked.
    Actually, the evidence from Twitter suggests many of them are cheering on this vile attack.
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    (Original post by Decorpi12)
    This is absolutely disgusting! A vile attack on freedom of expression and press.



    This is not the solution. Why give up freedom of expression because of extremists? Security should be tightened even further. I think political correctness and the fear of offending have gone too far.
    Because such use of expression is not needed in are society.
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    (Original post by childofthesun)
    Absolutely horrified by today's attack. I know quite a few Muslims living in Paris, and they are just as outraged and shocked.A very sad day for freedom of expression.The fact that incidents like this are becoming increasingly common in secular countries is alarming.
    These murderers did not 'avenge the prophet.' Honestly so saddened
    Perhaps we will see the hundreds of thousands of them that live around Paris in the square where they are protesting, holding placards saying " I am a Muslim- not in my name! "
    Can but hope.
 
 
 
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