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Feminists Vs Islam (women are disrespected in islam?) watch

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    Yes, Islam takes an inferior view to women compared to men.
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    (Original post by champ_mc99)
    Yeah I didn't really understand that. Ok let's say there is evidence of the resurrection, I get that. But there was no actual historical evidence of Jesus claiming to be the Son of God, right?
    There is, there are tonnes of verses from the gospels where Jesus indirectly and directly claims his own divinity. Whether one accepts and believes that is another matter, but no serious historian would deny that Jesus never said these things, he did.
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    (Original post by *Stefan*)
    It's hilarious that you call me all those things before even letting me give you the sources (which you should have known already).

    Matthew 26:36-42: And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as thou wilt. ... O my Father, if this cup may not pass away from me, except I drink it, thy will be done.

    Mark 14:35-36: And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible, the hour might pass from him. And he said, Abba, Father, all things are possible unto thee; take away this cup from me: nevertheless not what I will, but what thou wilt.

    Luke 22:41-42: And he was withdrawn from them about a stone's cast, and kneeled down, and prayed, Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

    I'm not really surprised - extremist Christians rarely know what they believe well enough. At least shut your mouth next time and save yourself from absolute embarrassment.
    I've always wondered about that verse, when Jesus went to pray to God about this wasn't he meant to be completely alone? If so then how does anyone know what he prayed to God about?
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    I've always wondered about that verse, when Jesus went to pray to God about this wasn't he meant to be completely alone? If so then how does anyone know what he prayed to God about?
    They were psychicly beamed the information.
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    this is a new one

    care to expand ?
    You can't look at Saudi Arabia as a representation of Islam. They have tainted the image in disgusting ways, and on the land of the prophet, but their intentions aren't religious but a patriarchy based on control.

    Muslim countries ruled by 'sharia' are based on nothing but men picking and choosing to suit their agendas

    Women were involved in politics and decision making with the prophet
    They weren't explicitly said to be allowed to vote in the Quran, but they weren't excluded either - so they were included, if that makes sense?

    The Qur'an has prescribed the following principle in deciding about issues related to the collective affairs of the Muslims (democracy):
    Their (Muslim's) affairs are decided through consultation among them.
    (Al-Shooraa 42: 38)

    Which isn't crystal clear at first glance but using passages from the Quran has to be done considering the context and hadiths as well. There is evidence of women being involved in politics

    A little busy now to give you a better answer, but it's a start
    Will follow up when I can!
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    (Original post by Beenieeee)
    Women were involved in politics and decision making with the prophet
    They weren't explicitly said to be allowed to vote in the Quran, but they weren't excluded either - so they were included, if that makes sense?
    it doesn't

    the first country to give women universal suffrage was New Zealand in 1893. The Isle of Man (a Crown dependency) had given women the suffrage in 1881, but only if they satisfied certain property requirements

    As to other rights, inheritance, divorce, financial independence etc etc, you may have e.g. a look at the status of women in ancient Egypt, before making any claims of Islam blazing any ground there http://www.ancient.eu/article/623/

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    Same goes for Christianity and Hinduism too.
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    (Original post by SuperStar#7)
    Jesus Christ however does.
    Until somebody can prove that Jesus Christ wasn't just the 21AD equivalent of Dynamo, agnosticism is probably the safer bet.
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    (Original post by *Stefan*)
    Can you please use your brain?

    I said that, EVEN IF WE ACCEPT WHAT YOU SAID, it changes nothing. Good lord.


    Actually it does Moron. He prayed to God not to pour out a cup of his wrath on his people.

    There are over 20 verses in the Bible that clearly say that God and Jesus work together in perfect unity, so all this nonsense about Jesus changing his mind is coming out from your ass.
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    (Original post by champ_mc99)
    . My best advice is keep these questions to yourself, research through Islamic scholars and their interpretations, and have hope.
    Sounds more like " don't question god, don't tell anyone that you question god or have a mind of your own because god forbid you're a woman. Research things that men have said only because female scholars are stupid because they aren't male and they forget things". (Men are superior, don't question what men have said about god)


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    (Original post by HAnwar)
    Have you bothered to look into the reasoning behind those?
    Well I have and it still doesn't put it into a better light. It still seems to imply that women are devoid of intelligence and really emotional, worth half of a man, cannot possibly be the breadwinner of the household so doesn't need to have equal inheritance and when she gets married because apparently it's perfectly impossible for her to live on her own and protect herself because she is physically weak, and that's the only way she should be able to move to a different household from her family's and any other way is dishonourable, and they person who she married gets to keep her inheritance anyways and apparently that OK because she gets dowry of a bunch of useless jewelry she wore at the wedding.

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    (Original post by mariachi)
    it doesn't

    the first country to give women universal suffrage was New Zealand in 1893. The Isle of Man (a Crown dependency) had given women the suffrage in 1881, but only if they satisfied certain property requirements

    As to other rights, inheritance, divorce, financial independence etc etc, you may have e.g. a look at the status of women in ancient Egypt, before making any claims of Islam blazing any ground there http://www.ancient.eu/article/623/

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    My point was that where matters of voting were concerned, women weren't excluded - they were considered citizens whose lives would be impacted by decisions, so they were given the right to have an input, even argue with the Prophet if they disagreed. Imagine being legally allowed to argue with any leader at the time? It's very much about context

    Historical records indicate women's active right to vote and participate in the political decision making process. I know without being able to give you evidence of this, it's almost meaningless but I will look for copies of this (but I'm not fluent in Arabic and also don't know where to look, so I'm not sure how successful I will be)

    At the time of the Prophet, many women held political responsibilities. For example, Ash-Shifa bint Abdullah was appointed to be in charge of market affairs in Medina (which was a massive deal if you consider the fact it was centre of all trade). She later became the head of Health and Safety in Iraq.

    "Aisha, Ume Warqa, and Samra Binte Wahaib took part in political activities.[354]
    Abdurrahman ibn `Awf consulted with women when he was charged of choosing `Uthman or Ali as the third caliphate after the death of Umar.[364] "

    Okay fair enough, Ancient Egypt was very cool.
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    (Original post by Butternuts96)
    1. Degree above them in security and strength. It's part of the reason why men are obliged to look after their womenfolk. How often do you see or is it said or practiced that women look after their families against criminals? Normally it's the guy's job to look after the family, lol. If you disagree with that, then that's cool but there is not interpretation that this means that men are better than women.

    2. The contact with women, lowering gaze and the tilth (having intercourse) thingy are rules that apply to both genders.

    3. Naming the angels female names? That is a characteristic of a certain group of people God speaks about in the Quran. The islamic belief about angels is that we do not prescribe them a certain gender.

    Stop cherry picking verses you have no knowledge of. You said in your first post that you weren't trying to offend when 100% you clearly are if you do stuff like this. Get outta here.
    1. I've seen grandmas in their 80s on the news beating the crap out the burglar with pots and pans, women lifting cars off their babies and pulling car doors right off to get to their children. How if any men have been able to lift a car that aren't Arnold Schwarzenegger? Really that goes to show women are perfectly able to look after their families themselves.

    2. People don't jump each others bones as soon as they make eye contact. Attraction is natural. If Islam is so against sex outside of marriage, why does it never teach how to deal with attraction and how to learn to resist sexual advances instead of quarantining men and women from each other. The only result of that ends up being child abuse and pedophilia because of that strong desire never being released. It's happened in both Muslim and Christian communities before you start picking on Christians and saying they are bad. All that's saying is that you are as bad as them.

    3. There are still religions today that worship a goddess instead of a god. Islam and Christianity fought to get rid of these religions and labeled them as devil worshippers and witches when all they were really pissed about was the suffix and the pronoun, that in some way females were thought to be superior than men. And in a masochist lead world, they were pissed off. People were also pissed off Queen Mary 1 was the first female to become queen and several communities revolted against her.

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    (Original post by Beenieeee)

    Historical records indicate women's active right to vote and participate in the political decision making process. I know without being able to give you evidence of this, it's almost meaningless
    women have always taken part in political decision-making. Check out Cleopatra, Semiramis, Boudica etc or, nearer to us, Catherine the Great, Queen Elizabeth etc

    but, if Queens and Empresses did rule, just like Aisha did exert political power, this did not mean that all women were systematically included in the decision-making process. Far from that.

    As far as voting is concerned, there were no formal voting arrangements in the Caliphate until the mid-19th century (and then, as an imitation of what some Western countries were doing -and women were of course excluded)

    The "shurah" system was an informal consultation system : it did not imply elections, elector lists, constituencies, candidates, majority voting. It was a consultative assembly of elders, tribal/clan chiefs, religious authorities .... what you would expect in a traditional tribal structure

    Heavily patriarchal, of course : and, while wives and mothers of potentates may have had some kind of influence in such a system, via their respective husbands, sons etc, or even as widows, the common woman most surely didn't have any

    However, if you can produce proof to the contrary, I would be interested in learning about it

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    Dear all,

    If any of you would like to provide any constructive arguments, then feel free to post on here. I’ve seen a lot of this “feminist vs islam” nonsense before, and I’ll try to sort it out.

    Thank you.
    P.S.: Thank you for brainwashing the minds of the youth with this anti-Islam trash.
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    (Original post by Butternuts96)
    . Get outta here.
    People still widely ignore that our friend Butternuts owns this forum, having bought it (for a song) a few days ago. So, he decides things around here.

    This leaves only one question open :

    -which was the song he sung ? and was that halal, in consideration of what islamqa says about music ? https://islamqa.info/en/5000

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    (Original post by Oilfreak1)
    people can be pregnant virgins though, you just have to fap over the vagina and hope it happens.
    I don't think anyone fapped over a 14 year old girl mate...
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    (Original post by Tim12345)
    Thank you for brainwashing the minds of the youth with this anti-Islam trash.
    hmmm... do you think that the minds of the youth should be brainwashed also with pro-Islam trash, so as to preserve a balance ?
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    (Original post by mariachi)
    hmmm... do you think that the minds of the youth should be brainwashed also with pro-Islam trash, so as to preserve a balance ?
    It's quite funny that the first thing you did when I said give a "constructive argument" was play a "silly picky" game.

    I repeat, give any constructive argument and I'll do my best to refute them.
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    (Original post by WBZ144)
    Honestly I will never believe in any organised religion and don't compare one with the other but there are far more Muslim apostates than you think. I grew up being taught that no one leaves Islam, that such a thing would be unimaginable to most Muslims. The fact is that Muslim apostates are far more likely to keep it a secret because so many of them face social isolation, maybe even violence, death in extreme cases. When there are so many consequences for leaving Islam, why would they be open about it? There is also the principle of "enjoining the right and forbidding the wrong", so there would be more pressure on young Muslims to practice their faith from their families and the community. Of all the Muslim kids I grew up with there is a significant number that either left or no longer practice. Two of my sisters are apostates.

    Atheism and Agnosticism are the fastest growing beliefs. In comparison Islam does not fair very well and the growth by conversions isn't all that impressive. You can't deny that many Muslim countries tend to have higher birthrates.

    The so-called scientific miracles do not really exist and are a fairly recent phenomenon. After nearly 3 years of truth seeking I actually found scientific errors and contradictions in the Quran.
    Haha what are you talking about they don't exist?
    The things that have been mentioned in the Quran 1400 years ago that have only been able to be proven miracles now due to the recent scientific advancements are miracles.
    I do understand that there are obviously Muslims who leave their religion but the reason it's secret has nothing to do with Islam. It is forbidden in Islam to force the religion on someone so all these pressures are social pressures and can't be linked to Islam. A reason that people leave Islam is due to relating cultural/social pressures to the practice of Islam and being ill informed and not educated enough.
    And Islam IS the fasted growing religion. Just because u notice a lot of agnostics around you, you can't assume that the fastest growing religion are them without studies.
    You are very used to stereotyping and generalising which is a very bad thing and I have also met people who have lost their faith due to generalising too much and judging the religion on the people which is wrong!
    There has been no scientific errors in the Quran, I would like you to provide me evidence please from a reliable source. Multiple reliable sources would be helpful. The contradictions you will find are most probably due to ill interpretation and the quotation taken out of context and not understanding it.
    Thanks
 
 
 
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