Pakistan vs India

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Four things that unis think matter more than league tables 08-12-2016
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    (Original post by AngryRedhead)
    Thank you, I'd appreciate that immeasurably
    Here is an independent source reporting the barbarism of the Indian army and that's from last year when tensions were relatively low so just imagine what's going on now
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...ndroid-samsung
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    If your Hindu extremist government has nothing to hide then why don't they let UNHCR come and investigate like they are being allowed to in azad Kashmir
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...6sBU-jTWA98l7g
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    (Original post by AngryRedhead)
    This is horrific and should not be allowed at all!
    How is India getting away with this flagrant abuse of human rights?
    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    Here is an independent source reporting the barbarism of the Indian army and that's from last year when tensions were relatively low so just imagine what's going on now
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.the...ndroid-samsung
    I and many other Indians accept that the Indian Army goes overboard in Kashmir. However, how many Pakistanis will accept that Pakistan's military goes overboard in Balochistan?

    In short, Pakistan is nobody to lecture India on human rights.




    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-26272897

    "So many journalists have been killed in Balochistan that there are few honest reports from the province in the national print or electronic media because journalists are too scared. The story of this bloody civil war is going untold."

    "As long as the government stays silent on Balochistan, the longest civil war in Pakistan's history will only create more casualties and break more records for longevity and heartbreak."

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...cret-dirty-war

    "In Balochistan, mutilated corpses bearing the signs of torture keep turning up, among them lawyers, students and farm workers."
    Several human rights groups, including Amnesty International, have accounted for more than 100 bodies – lawyers, students, taxi drivers, farm workers. Most have been tortured. The last three were discovered on Sunday.

    If you have not heard of this epic killing spree, though, don't worry: neither have most Pakistanis. Newspaper reports from Balochistan are buried quietly on the inside pages, cloaked in euphemisms or, quite often, not published at all."

    https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ion-black-hole

    "Province is the hardest place in the country for human rights workers, diplomats and journalists to operate, as the Guardian discovered on a visit to the region.

    Journalists in Quetta, the provincial capital, say they cannot confirm most claims made by separatists because they have limited access to insurgent hotspots. They also say their lives are at risk if they do not report the version of events provided by state agencies.

    According to Amnesty International, 12 journalists have been killed in Balochistan for doing their jobs since 2008. Mustafa Qadri from Amnesty said the province is the hardest place in the country for human rights researchers to operate. “State and non-state actors exploit the lawlessness and remoteness of these areas to stifle independent investigation of what is happening on the ground,” he said."


    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-34334271

    "The latest wave of insurgency was triggered after the army bombed and killed an elderly Baloch tribal chief, Nawab Akbar Bugti, in 2006.

    Over the years, the army and its subsidiary security force, the Frontier Corps, has captured and killed hundreds of suspected separatists.

    Rights activists accuse the military of bombing entire villages in its attempt to hunt down alleged Baloch militant leaders.

    "The operation was unannounced and indiscriminate," points out Bibi Gul, a Baloch human rights activist. "Women and children were killed and thousands left the area. The army cordoned off the entire area.

    "For nearly a month, people weren't allowed to go there to pick up the dead bodies."

    Pakistan has a vibrant and thriving news media. But there's been a virtual blackout of alleged abuses on privately-owned national news channels, say Baloch rights activists.

    Journalists say they are under intense pressure to promote a positive image of the army and its chief, General Raheel Sharif - they believe it's part of a public relations offensive to present the army as a saviour of the nation, while discrediting the political class."
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    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    If your Hindu extremist government has nothing to hide then why don't they let UNHCR come and investigate like they are being allowed to in azad Kashmir
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...6sBU-jTWA98l7g
    Firstly, all the political parties including the Communists not just the Hindu nationalists, objected to the UNHRC going to J&K.

    Pakistan allowing a third party to intervene in Kashmir is directly breaking the 1972 Shimla Agreement that Pakistan ITSELF signed which stated that J&K would be resolved BILATERALLY.


    Secondly, if your Jihadi government has nothing to hide then why don't they allow journalists into Balochistan?

    (Sources in my previous post)
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    Why are Indians changing the topic to Baluchistan which is in a lot better compared to occupied Kashmir? Secondly Indian interference in balochistan is responsible for these acts
    https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sour...X9uYs6CZLNt57g
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    I and many other Pakistanis agree that Bakochistanis are treated poorly by the Pakistani administration however balochistan is Pakistan's internal matter while Kashmir is supposed to have a referendum according to the UN resolution passed 60 years ago and that is the concern of both countries
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    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    I and many other Pakistanis agree that Bakochistanis are treated poorly by the Pakistani administration however balochistan is Pakistan's internal matter while Kashmir is supposed to have a referendum according to the UN resolution passed 60 years ago and that is the concern of both countries
    :lol:

    Hang on, YOU were the one complaining that the UN is an organisation that has no power on a previous page, so why are you referring to any resolution or the institution of the UN at all? :dontknow:

    But now that you have, I was hoping you would pick up on UN Security Council Resolution 47.

    Have you read the Resolution?
    http://www.un.org/en/ga/search/view_...S/RES/47(1948)

    It has 3 steps which are sequential and conditional. Which means first step has to be acted upon and then 2nd and 3rd steps can be taken

    First step is that PAKISTAN has to remove entire military, tribals and Pakistani nationals that were not part of the former Princely state of Jammu and Kashmir and who entered for the purpose of fighting. This means Pakistan army, tribals and people that entered into Azad Kashmir and Gilgit-Baltistan from other parts of Pakistan ALL have to leave.

    Second step is that India removes its military from Indian administered Jammu and Kashmir but is allowed to keep sufficient forces for the maintenance of law and order and support of civilian power.

    Third step is that referendum is to be conducted.


    Pakistanis are so upset about the referendum that never happened, but you only have your own government to blame because the first step was never acted upon by Pakistan in the first place. So how can you expect steps 2 and 3 to be acted upon when they were conditional on step 1 being acted upon?


    The Truce Agreement between India and Pakistan at the UN:
    http://repository.un.org/bitstream/handle/11176/87642/S_995-EN.pdf

    "1. As the presence of troops of Pakistan in the territory of the State of Jammu and Kashmir constitutes a material change in the situation since it was represented by the Government of Pakistan before the Security Council, the Government of Pakistan agrees to withdraw its troops from that State."

    Indirectly, the UN is saying that Pakistan lied on the question of whether there were Pakistani troops in J&K.


    The resolutions that state that people from other parts of Pakistan that have entered into J&K are to leave, it also says that those who were normally resident of the State who have left because of disturbances are also to return.
    That way any referendum will be fair.
    In 1980s Jihadi militants forced 100,000 Kashmiri Pandits to leave and are not allowing them to return to their homes in the Valley.
    Similarly people from other parts of Pakistan who have settled in AJK and Gilgit-Baltistan are higly unlikely to leave.
    So how can any referendum be fair?
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    (Original post by Indian_Muslim)
    :lol:


    In 1980s Jihadi militants forced 100,000 Kashmiri Pandits to leave and are not allowing them to return to their homes in the Valley.
    So how can any referendum be fair?
    Source?
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    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    Source?
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-india-35923237

    "It also tore apart the centuries-old harmony that existed between the majority Muslim and tiny but influential Hindu communities, after the latter was terrorised into leaving.
    Muslim militant groups targeted Hindus by killing their men, burning their homes and damaging their places of worship. Mosques would make calls for them to leave the valley."

    "According to one estimate, 3,000-5,000 Pandits are left in the valley today - a far cry from the 300,000 who used to live there. These few thousand are scattered over 185 places in the valley, where seven million people live.
    Today the Pandits are condemned to live a life of anonymity in their own homeland."
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    No where in the article does it say that 100000 were driven out in 1980s
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    The Shimla agreement ruled out external 3rd party interference( Whether it be the UN or a third country, and the UN has to honor it since your beloved Bhutto signed it, )or a plebiscite
    So Pakistan raising the "Kashmir issue" in the UN is illegal, so India can legally attack and annex all the territories the Indian armed forces had captured in the 71' Bangladesh liberation/13 Day war (Eg Gilgit Baltistan, parts of Sialkot, sindh etc) and no Nation(they wont anyway everyone knows Pakistan is an International jihadi migrane) or organization in the world can do anything about it or oppose India if India were to decide to Invade.
    Because Pakistan is not honouring the Shimla agreement , India can take steps

    The Shimla agreement was signed out of goodwill and all the 90,000-93,000 Pakistani POWs, Captured territories were given back to Pakistan out of pity for Bhutto and Pakistan because Indra thaught that this was the last chance Pakistan would have at democracy and Zulifikar ali bhutto begged her because he was scared of a army coup.

    So that Pakistan could have some of its lost "Dignity" back
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    The 3,00,000 claim is an underestimate by the BBC
    Its probably more like 4,00,000-8,00,000

    Most of them have settled in the NCR region or other Major cities a fewer number immigrated to Jammu or Overseas
    So highly unlikely to ever return to the Hell that Kashmir and Jihadi groups had become for them

    Even the Ladakis(People from Ladakh) and people from Leh are demanding for Ladakh&Leh to be seperated from the Conflict ridden Kashmir and wantLadakhk& leh to be declared a seperate Union territory directly to be governed by the center. Now people in Jammu are starting to demand for the same and protest against being included with kashmir

    Also when the Kashmir resolution was passed in the UNGA aksai chin was part of the Kingdom of Jammu and Kashmir but it was later annexed by China, so if a plebiscite is truly to be carried out then the same resolution should be applied on aksai chin aswell and China is never going to let that happen so.....
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    (Original post by Idunno99)
    The Shimla agreement ruled out external 3rd party interference( Whether it be the UN or a third country, and the UN has to honor it since your beloved Bhutto signed it, )or a plebiscite
    So Pakistan raising the "Kashmir issue" in the UN is illegal, so India can legally attack and annex all the territories the Indian armed forces had captured in the 71' Bangladesh liberation/13 Day war (Eg Gilgit Baltistan parts of Sialkot, sindh etc) and no Nation(they wont anyway everyone knows Pakistan is an International jihadi migrane) or organization in the world can do anything about it or oppose India if India were to decide to Invade.
    Because Pakistan is not honouring the Shimla agreement , India can take steps

    The Shimla agreement was signed out of goodwill and all the 90,000-93,000 Pakistani POWs, Captured territories were given back to Pakistan out of pity for Bhutto and Pakistan because Indra thaught that this was the last chance Pakistan would have at democracy and Zulifikar ali bhutto begged her because he was scared of a army coup.

    So that Pakistan could have some of its lost "Dignity" back
    The only thing that's stopping India is that they don't have the military strength and what parts of sindh and GB did they capture may I know pls
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    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    No where in the article does it say that 100000 were driven out in 1980s
    Apologise it was a mistake on my behalf. It was 1990s not 1980s. And the most conservative figure I have seen published elsewhere was 100,000. But as you can see the BBC source says 300,000.
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    (Original post by AlvlVictim)
    3 Wars that you supposedly won and Pakistan is still here and Kashniris are still fighting for independence 😊. I like how you conveniently forgot 1965
    2nd largest army, nuclear weapons and power, 4th largest airforce, top 10 defence budget, top notch space program, SLBM capability. Aircraft carrier (and more to come)...excellent navy, ELINT and AWACS much superior to yours.

    we will decimate you. and all the anti india/pro pakshitan elements in india and kashmir. Just watch.
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    (Original post by AlwaysFitin')
    2nd largest army, nuclear weapons and power, 4th largest airforce, top 10 defence budget, top notch space program, SLBM capability. Aircraft carrier (and more to come)...excellent navy, ELINT and AWACS much superior to yours.

    we will decimate you. and all the anti india/pro pakshitan elements in india and kashmir. Just watch.
    Indias a great nation with a powerful army but I wouldn't sleep on Pakistan if I were you, us Pakis will surprise you and embarrass Indian forces more than the Chinese did 😂😂

    Anyway all big talk aside I truly wish the split never happened, one nation would've been better.
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    (Original post by ApplyYourself)
    Indias a great nation with a powerful army but I wouldn't sleep on Pakistan if I were you, us Pakis will surprise you and embarrass Indian forces more than the Chinese did 😂😂

    Anyway all big talk aside I truly wish the split never happened, one nation would've been better.
    lol keep dreaming. we lost against the chinese due to our politicians and learnt many lessons from it. One nation? Lol pakistan is a shitestain on the face of this universe, keep it.
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    (Original post by AlwaysFitin')
    2nd largest army, nuclear weapons and power, 4th largest airforce, top 10 defence budget, top notch space program, SLBM capability. Aircraft carrier (and more to come)...excellent navy, ELINT and AWACS much superior to yours.

    we will decimate you. and all the anti india/pro pakshitan elements in india and kashmir. Just watch.
    All this and still can't suppress Kashmiri's freedom movement and regularly lose many worthless soldiers like at URI. Immense embarrassment for people who are keen to destroy Pakistan
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    both countries sucks bawls .. one is an islamic terrorist country ... india is a hindu terrorist country ...


    i hope both end up in a nuclear war and anihilate each other ...
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    (Original post by 123teddy)
    both countries sucks bawls .. one is an islamic terrorist country ... india is a hindu terrorist country ...


    i hope both end up in a nuclear war and anihilate each other ...
    *suck *balls *Islamic *Hindu *India
 
 
 
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