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    (Original post by Steevee)
    Many things are risked in economics, it's a lare facet of the whole thing. Risk vs Reward and whatnot.

    And no, by scroungers I mean those that leech off the state. That work cash in hands jobs and still claim benifits, those that have non-existant 'back pain' and those that vote for people who promise them laptops. The underclass, the leeches and the plebs. Those are the scroungers. And sadly, there are more and more of them, because they have no pride or self respect and see the dole as a legitimate way to make money in life. If I had my way they'd all be in government work schemes.
    Let me tell you a true story.

    This happened in 2007, in this country.

    A 37 year old man born and raised in his hometown, educated to Bachelor Degree level, also having a wide a varied curriculum vitae having worked in both the public and private sectors, reached a threshold in the length of time a person who is unemployed can claim Job Seekers Allowance without attending a Government Work Scheme.

    This man was forced to attend a scheme called Working Links, and via them another called Action For Employment.

    He was required to every day attend a grubby youth club style environment where he would do nothing but apply for jobs on-line, and to do this for several months after which he would be placed on what was called a Work trial.

    The first "Work trial" he attended was in an Iceland store. It lasted exactly one day on account of the attitude of one of the managers there who wanted to humiliate him.

    This man was then placed on a Work Trial with Primark in the center of his hometown.

    He was told that there was a good chance of his gaining paid employment if he worked there full time and without pay for a certain period and if his supervisors thought he did a good enough job.

    Turns out that his manager was a Chinese lady who could barely speak English. Of her supervisor underlings 80% of them were Polish or Lithuanian and all of them were younger than him.

    This man was encouraged to undertake what amounted to slave labor, in a dingy stock room, full time, five days a week for one month without pay, and to swallow his pride, taking orders from foreign opportunists and all of this in his own town.

    To add insult to injury when he went to the Percy Ingles across the road for a break, he was served by Russians.

    When the trial came to end, the management asked this man if he could work over the Christmas period, not realizing the trial had ended. When this man explained the trial had ended and that he would only work if he was paid, the Polish manager offering the extra work lost interest.

    As you might assume, this man was never offered a job.

    This is the reality on the ground.

    So before you start throwing around names and calling people, shameless, lazy or scroungers, perhaps you should adjust the target of your abuse so that it's aimed at those who deserve those labels.

    There are two classes of people in this country: an ignorant class and a suffering class. You sir are from the former. You have absolutely no idea about what's going on in this country.

    This is why the violence to come will shock you.
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Your ignorance is astonishing.
    No I am serious, where are these slums?
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Let me tell you a true story.

    This happened in 2007, in this country.

    A 37 year old man born and raised in his hometown, educated to Bachelor Degree level, also having a wide a varied curriculum vitae having worked in both the public and private sectors, reached a threshold in the length of time a person who is unemployed can claim Job Seekers Allowance without attending a Government Work Scheme.

    This man was forced to attend a scheme called Working Links, and via them another called Action For Employment.

    He was required to every day attend a grubby youth club style environment where he would do nothing but apply for jobs on-line, and to do this for several months after which he would be placed on what was called a Work trial.

    The first "Work trial" he attended was in an Iceland store. It lasted exactly one day on account of the attitude of one of the managers there who wanted to humiliate him.

    This man was then placed on a Work Trial with Primark in the center of his hometown.

    He was told that there was a good chance of his gaining paid employment if he worked there full time and without pay for a certain period and if his supervisors thought he did a good enough job.

    Turns out that his manager was a Chinese lady who could barely speak English. Of her supervisor underlings 80% of them were Polish or Lithuanian and all of them were younger than him.

    This man was encouraged to undertake what amounted to slave labor, in a dingy stock room, full time, five days a week for one month without pay, and to swallow his pride, taking orders from foreign opportunists and all of this in his own town.

    To add insult to injury when he went to the Percy Ingles across the road for a break, he was served by Russians.

    When the trial came to end, the management asked this man if he could work over the Christmas period, not realizing the trial had ended. When this man explained the trial had ended and that he would only work if he was paid, the Polish manager offering the extra work lost interest.

    As you might assume, this man was never offered a job.

    This is the reality on the ground.

    So before you start throwing around names and calling people, shameless, lazy or scroungers, perhaps you should adjust the target of your abuse so that it's aimed at those who deserve those labels.

    There are two classes of people in this country: an ignorant class and a suffering class. You sir are from the former. You have absolutely no idea about what's going on in this country.

    This is why the violence to come will shock you.
    You sir, are an idiot.

    If he was looking for employment before his JSA ran out he wouln;t have had that problem. There are jobs out there, he just has to swallow his pride and take a job that might not be becoming.

    With all his education he should have realised that. Being on JSA should be humiliating after a while, it's supposed to be a prop, not a way of life. If he was proactive about job seeking then he wouldn't have ended up in that situation.

    I'm not ignorant, I just have some self respect. If more people had a little pride this country wouldn't be in the situation it is.
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    What a narrow-minded and oblivious OP.
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Let me tell you a true story.

    This happened in 2007, in this country.

    A 37 year old man born and raised in his hometown, educated to Bachelor Degree level, also having a wide a varied curriculum vitae having worked in both the public and private sectors, reached a threshold in the length of time a person who is unemployed can claim Job Seekers Allowance without attending a Government Work Scheme.

    This man was forced to attend a scheme called Working Links, and via them another called Action For Employment.

    He was required to every day attend a grubby youth club style environment where he would do nothing but apply for jobs on-line, and to do this for several months after which he would be placed on what was called a Work trial.

    The first "Work trial" he attended was in an Iceland store. It lasted exactly one day on account of the attitude of one of the managers there who wanted to humiliate him.

    This man was then placed on a Work Trial with Primark in the center of his hometown.

    He was told that there was a good chance of his gaining paid employment if he worked there full time and without pay for a certain period and if his supervisors thought he did a good enough job.

    Turns out that his manager was a Chinese lady who could barely speak English. Of her supervisor underlings 80% of them were Polish or Lithuanian and all of them were younger than him.

    This man was encouraged to undertake what amounted to slave labor, in a dingy stock room, full time, five days a week for one month without pay, and to swallow his pride, taking orders from foreign opportunists and all of this in his own town.

    To add insult to injury when he went to the Percy Ingles across the road for a break, he was served by Russians.

    When the trial came to end, the management asked this man if he could work over the Christmas period, not realizing the trial had ended. When this man explained the trial had ended and that he would only work if he was paid, the Polish manager offering the extra work lost interest.

    As you might assume, this man was never offered a job.

    This is the reality on the ground.

    So before you start throwing around names and calling people, shameless, lazy or scroungers, perhaps you should adjust the target of your abuse so that it's aimed at those who deserve those labels.

    There are two classes of people in this country: an ignorant class and a suffering class. You sir are from the former. You have absolutely no idea about what's going on in this country.

    This is why the violence to come will shock you.
    So? Are you xenophobic or what? You hate Conservatives, you hate Russians; do you only think in generalisations?
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Let me tell you a true story.

    This happened in 2007, in this country.

    A 37 year old man born and raised in his hometown, educated to Bachelor Degree level, also having a wide a varied curriculum vitae having worked in both the public and private sectors, reached a threshold in the length of time a person who is unemployed can claim Job Seekers Allowance without attending a Government Work Scheme.

    This man was forced to attend a scheme called Working Links, and via them another called Action For Employment.

    He was required to every day attend a grubby youth club style environment where he would do nothing but apply for jobs on-line, and to do this for several months after which he would be placed on what was called a Work trial.

    The first "Work trial" he attended was in an Iceland store. It lasted exactly one day on account of the attitude of one of the managers there who wanted to humiliate him.

    This man was then placed on a Work Trial with Primark in the center of his hometown.

    He was told that there was a good chance of his gaining paid employment if he worked there full time and without pay for a certain period and if his supervisors thought he did a good enough job.

    Turns out that his manager was a Chinese lady who could barely speak English. Of her supervisor underlings 80% of them were Polish or Lithuanian and all of them were younger than him.

    This man was encouraged to undertake what amounted to slave labor, in a dingy stock room, full time, five days a week for one month without pay, and to swallow his pride, taking orders from foreign opportunists and all of this in his own town.

    To add insult to injury when he went to the Percy Ingles across the road for a break, he was served by Russians.

    When the trial came to end, the management asked this man if he could work over the Christmas period, not realizing the trial had ended. When this man explained the trial had ended and that he would only work if he was paid, the Polish manager offering the extra work lost interest.

    As you might assume, this man was never offered a job.

    This is the reality on the ground.

    So before you start throwing around names and calling people, shameless, lazy or scroungers, perhaps you should adjust the target of your abuse so that it's aimed at those who deserve those labels.

    There are two classes of people in this country: an ignorant class and a suffering class. You sir are from the former. You have absolutely no idea about what's going on in this country.

    This is why the violence to come will shock you.
    Anecdotal evidence =\= universally applicable.
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    (Original post by profoflife)
    My sources are my experience, having actually been through the whole process as well as knowing undergrads now and recent grads, and my superior wsidom having studied and worked in numerous countries around the world, not just the UK.

    I agree that cuts will strain the country in some way, inevitably, but if it isnt done now, things will just get worse...more unemployment, larger class sizes, fewer hospital beds, fewer doctors, less businesses based in the UK particularly manufacturing and high-tech industries etc etc.

    It may seem harsh now, but the alternatives are not a solution. This is the best way forward when you look at all the options and resultant medium and long term effects of them all. You're just going to have to suck it up.
    http://falseeconomy.org.uk/cure/what-do-the-experts-say
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    (Original post by Steevee)
    You sir, are an idiot.

    If he was looking for employment before his JSA ran out he wouln;t have had that problem. There are jobs out there, he just has to swallow his pride and take a job that might not be becoming.

    With all his education he should have realised that. Being on JSA should be humiliating after a while, it's supposed to be a prop, not a way of life. If he was proactive about job seeking then he wouldn't have ended up in that situation.

    I'm not ignorant, I just have some self respect. If more people had a little pride this country wouldn't be in the situation it is.
    So you're suggesting that a person as qualified as this man, who had many different jobs and years of experience, decided suddenly that £60 a week was better for him?

    You believe this person WANTED to be unemployed?

    From where do you derive this asinine notion?

    Furthermore, does not taking on unpaid work in the hope of securing paid employment constitute a swallowing of pride?


    Perhaps you've never been unemployed!

    Perhaps you ought to know that in order to receive JSA payments a client must prove he or she is actively looking for work.


    The more you respond the more ignorant and clueless you turn out to be.
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    (Original post by Craig_D)
    So? Are you xenophobic or what? You hate Conservatives, you hate Russians; do you only think in generalisations?
    Everyone is xenophobic, especially those who find that vacancies once easily secured are now filled by people born recently in other countries.

    I wonder how some of the ignorant people responding in this thread would feel if suddenly government policy ensured that they would experience a similar phenomenon.
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    (Original post by Ocassus)
    Anecdotal evidence =\= universally applicable.
    Re-read the first sentence.


    Or, if you have the patience, read some random on-line complaints against New Deal Workinglinks/A4e:

    Here's some videos:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xoczJfaQmM

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=BG6TjJ1qpCI




    Here are some comments:

    http://claimantsactionsouthwales.blo...a-tactics.html

    Monday, 18 January 2010

    Flexible New Deal: Guerrilla tactics against MWRA slavery collaborators.

    One of the main ways we will defeat the Flexible New Deal is to fight the imposition of its Mandatory Work Related Activity (MWRA) provision. The MWRA relies on collaborators in the private, public or voluntary sector to provide its victims with "work placements" or "work experience" - slave labour, for practical purposes - for which the collaborators will usually be paid for their trouble. We simply need to ensure that no amount of dirty Government money is sufficient to compensate the collaborators for having dole slaves on their premises, which will cause FND to fail miserably. As a group or union we have several options open - warnings, bad publicity an if this gains no response, their premises should be - peacefully - occupied by claimants to disrupt their business and/or receive bricks through the windows, superglued locks (£1/bottle on the market) and suchlike nuisance attacks. Continued over weeks, possibly months, for a clear reason, most organisations are going to pull out.

    Individual victims, however, also have many options. For a start, simply keeping a journal of your time on the collaborators' premises, and publishing online, isn't going to do their public image much good at all so long as you make it very clear why you're doing it. Even better is if you can blow the whistle on dodgy practices - most places develop dodgy practices - within that organisation. There is the possibility of stealing confidential information and records, and publishing those online - in fact, steal whatever you can, even if you only chuck it in the nearest bin! There is sabotage, either of the collaborators' machinery or premises. If nothing else, releasing live rats (or similar) inside and then calling the local health inspector is almost guaranteed to be highly disruptive. Whatever happens, you don't have to be efficient or even fully awake. You don't have to polite to customers or staff. Just being persistently grumpy (I usually am anyway) or making bad tea/coffee will go a long way. In any public or private organisation with other staff around, you should do all you can to unionise the staff - which you can do overtly with no fear of sanction. Unionising is a basic right, and you should point out to paid staff that their jobs are at risk from dole slavery. The boss will, of course, hate this, but will be powerless to act and, if they try, will be breaking the law as dole slaves are to be counted as employed - except for not getting paid that is... If you're slotted into any sort of customer facing position, I suggest badges or printed Ts with slogans like "DOLE SLAVE" or "I DON'T GET PAID". If it's a scuzzy charity shop or the like, "I'M NOT A VOLUNTEER" could go down very well. Use your imagination, as I've only covered a fraction of what is possible. FND will fail if the collaborators it relies on find the whole thing is simply too much trouble.

    Also remember that if at all possible you should covertly record EVERYTHING to guard yourself against fraudulent allegations of misconduct by Working Links (or similar contractors) in pursuit of a sanction. Bear in mind that the real motivation for all these fascist back-to-work punishment schemes is to find a way to get you sanctioned and off benefits, so that the Government can crow about how much unemployment has fallen, how many less people are claiming benefits. The bill for the contractors used to achieve this, and the bribes they pay to collaborators, can be conveniently forgotten. That is why me must smash the MWRA, and smash the Flexible New Deal with it.


    http://www.ne21local.co.uk/a4e.html

    Modern Day Slavery .. That's what some people say about A4e....


    A4e, Modern Day Slavery, Yes or No:
    If you live in the Gateshead area are unemployed sooner or later you will find yourself at A4e said Mike.
    The Job Center sends you to A4e for a 2 week assessment this consists mainly of sitting in a classroom and watching American style teaching on how to improve your job prospects.
    On your second day you go to a computer room which consists of some old computers to undertake assessments, an Initial Assessment and Soft Outcomes basically one is English and one is Maths, your score determines if you go back to A4e on a 13 week or 26 week course.




    http://myreader.co.uk/msg/13973207.aspx

    > "We have a number of participants who are eager and immediately available to
    > start work in your warehouse, do you need any staff at the moment to help
    > out in a work trial, at no cost to your company"
    >
    In any other time that would have been called slavery.




    http://www.newdealscandal.co.uk/flex...omings-of-a4e/


    Keith says:
    October 2nd 2009 at 3:04 pm

    New Deal training fraud

    If political parties are looking for painless cuts in public spending, New Deal fraudulent training courses should be their top priority.

    If a training course was worth attending, there would be a waiting list. It speaks volumes that it requires these courses to be made mandatory with the loss of benefit if you refuse to attend.

    Humiliating and degrading treatment, breach of Human Rights Act?

    Government data shows New Deal to be a failure. New Deal inmates know why it is a failure. Why is no one listening? Why no investigation by the National Audit Office? Why no investigation by the Public Accounts Committee? Or has public service in this country become so tainted and corrupted that no one gives a damn?

    http://www.indymedia.org.uk/en/2009/10/439070.html



    ken says:
    October 2nd 2009 at 11:27 pm

    new deal has constantly failed to deliver results,criticism has been simmering for sometime as to its viability in delivering any objectives objectives’

    this was a story dating back to 2007.

    Brown’s New Deal on jobs a ‘woeful failure’

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...l-failure.html

    these stories are not a good start to what would be someones working life,new deal has been dogged with controversy.

    many including myself have gone through it and are still unemployed looking back thinking what was that all about.a complete waste of time being placed on a placement that had noting to do with previous work history.
    being classed as a volunteer when was anything but,double standards rife between new deal and other volunteers,dire facilities donated museum equipment at the center a hostile environment by staff as well as other users evidence of drug ties formed between themselves,of course there was other people that were no way associated with this behavior and left as bewildered as me.


    ALLAN JOHNSTONE says:
    October 4th 2009 at 10:07 am

    if the facilities at a4e were as bad as you say perhaps a phone call to enviromental health would have sorted the problem as the inspectors would have come down on them like a ton of bricks for not providing proper facilities in the toilets and clean cups it is also obvious that a4e do not have a cleaner strange when every other business employs one
    ALLAN JOHNSTONE did not rate this post.


    Gerry Attric says:
    October 5th 2009 at 10:59 pm

    Let’s hope claimants on the Flexible New Deal kick up a fuss if they are confronted with the same conditions they experienced on the old New Deal.


    Mr G says:
    October 13th 2009 at 3:35 pm

    As an an ex – employee of A4E (action for employment) I have found most of the articals sent in by ex-customers have been pritty much spot on. I started work for A4E some years ago.

    I have been asked to tell lies in court as one of the clients had been treated unfairley and with recist comments. as I had been delivering courses and this learner had been in my groups and I was black, they said it would look good for us and make him look the fool. I was asked to say that he would never participate nor would he even communicate with staff and he had been treated very well. (NOT A CHANCE). i was then asked if I would write a statement to that effect. NOT A CHANCE. Time sheets and job out comes had all been doctored so as to claim the outcome for jobs.

    Time sheets signed by staff due to learners not being in centre, dates changed and placements forged so as to get payments. Promissed boneses as we hit a massive target beating all other offices in the country. Only to be told the weeks before Xmas that the money will be put back into the company to go to pay for our office in Iran?.

    I myself manage in induction each week seventy two(72) learners in one room for a week trying to complete cv,s ?
    No support not much resources.? Mishall street had no runing water not toilets unsafe floors and no refreshments for our clients?managers getting big boneses for doing nothing and clients being punished with sanctions for missing one day ? come on there is more very much more!
    infact lots more. wacth this space.

    I am going to have my say as I am nolonger employed by them I can tell all! do you want to know more? I’ll tell you.
    Mr G did not rate this post.

    Flexible New Deal says:
    October 13th 2009 at 5:57 pm

    We would be very interested in hearing more. You are not the first ex- a4e employee to raise such severe concerns which is indeed very worrying.

    Bree says:
    October 15th 2009 at 10:07 am

    I am a lone parent of 3 children. I went to A4E for an induction and spent the day filling out forms. An appointment was made for me to see a Customer Mentor for the following week. This appointment was putting the details onto their database. No job searches was made but I had my CV as I needed help with it and they were going to make changes to it. Two members of staff read my CV said that although it was long and needed changing they were very impressed. They gave my CV to their manager and I was offered an interview for the following week with A4E for the job role of Customer Mentor. I did not want to cut my options short in case I did not get the job so I asked for another appointment with my mentor to do some job searches.

    I returned to the office two days later to do some job searches but this did not happen as both customer mentors told me that they were absolutely certain I would get this job as they were very short-staffed and I had “the charisma, energy and enthusiasm that the office needed!” and my mentor told me that they would amend my CV. I was very pleased with these comments and made arrangements for my three-year old son to settle into a new nursery and to start full-time.

    I came to the offices two hours before the interview took place to go over my new CV but my mentor told me that she had not yet done this but it is okay. The interview went very well and I was asked when I would be able to start work. I explained that my youngest son will be starting full-time nursery by the following Monday. I was then told that I would be contacted by the end of the week with an date for the second interview where I would be meeting another manager.

    By the end of the week I had not yet heard anything so I rang my mentor and told him that I could not wait for this job alone as the nursery fees are £160 per week and I could not afford to pay that being on benefits and could I come in to apply for these other jobs. So again I went to A4E offices expecting to do job searches, but both mentors again told me not to worry, I must be patient as they are short-staffed, but it is good news for me and that I should be expecting a letter in the post for a 2nd interview.

    I returned again to the offices on the following Monday and asked my mentor if I could apply for these other jobs just in case I didn’t get the role of Customer Mentor. Again their reply, don’t worry, there is a new manager who is settling in and he will contact me by telephone later on in the day to come in for the 2nd interview. I returned home, anxious as I had paid nursery fees that morning.

    On Tuesday I telephoned my mentor and she said that I will be called later on that day. No call came through. I returned again to the offices on Friday and asked to do some job searches with my mentor and again the response was that there is no need because the new manager will be calling me but as he is still busy settling in, if he does not call, come to the office on Monday 12th September and dress smartly and be prepared for the interview.

    Monday came, I was at the offices, waiting for my interview, a bit more anxious now as I had borrowed money to pay for the 2nd week of nursery. Two hours after waiting, my mentor called me into the office and told me that they could not offer me the job now as it has to be offered to internal staff before being offered externally. She then told me to come back the following Monday to do some job searches for me.

    I left their offices dejected, deflated and in tears. On my way home I cried on the bus and felt so alone and like I had been lead on. I had recieved no help or support from A4E. I felt the pinch of spending £1 on the bus journey (for which A4E were supposed to help with travel costs) and I panicked at what I was going to feed my children for the rest of the week. I sat on the bus trying hard to fight back my tears and the feeling of wanting to get sick. I got off the bus and walked around dropped my CV to anywhere I could think of.

    I am still without a job, but convinced there is something better out there for me.

    IMPROVING PEOPLES LIVES, A4E has done anything but…

    ALLAN JOHNSTONE says:
    October 16th 2009 at 10:27 am

    i would take legal advise as to the possibility of claiming the child care costs from a4e as they seem to have led you up the garden path as regards this job also the fact they wouldnt allow you to do jobsearch and apply for other jobs seems strange also suggest you speak to your ndpa about this as well as you were keeping yourself in the right by stating you wanted to do jobsearch but they refused to let you might be worth asking ndpa if it is possible to claim the child care costs back from a4e as they gave the impression that the job was more or less yours

    Flexible New Deal says:
    October 16th 2009 at 2:28 pm

    I thought New Deal covered the costs of Childcare!

    Nathan Kearney says:
    March 29th 2010 at 4:28 pm

    I worked for A4e for just over a year in various offices in Liverpool and fraud is both rife and normal especially the defrauding of governemnt documentations that signal the payment of money both managers I worked for tried to encourage me to defraud time sheets etc amongst other even more serious documents I have witnessed on numerous both managers and staff forging clients signatures in order to claim money for job outcomes what a crock of crap we all know about it its even on the news and laid out in full documentaires but still the govt use them and still its allowed to go go to a4e in liverpool for a week its all there to see
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    Now read these comments made by the woman who runs this modern day slave trade and tell me if they don't sound familiar!

    A4e Emma Harrison: ConDem Coalition Cuts are Fantastic!

    “The coalition government’s cuts are, in fact, fantastic!” says Emma Harrison. “Cutting benefits will put a stop to people making a profession out of being unemployed.” Actually, I am not surprised. In fact, its long overdue for an outburst of this nature."
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Everyone is xenophobic, especially those who find that vacancies once easily secured are now filled by people born recently in other countries.

    I wonder how some of the ignorant people responding in this thread would feel if suddenly government policy ensured that they would experience a similar phenomenon.
    I do not agree that everyone is xenophobic, though the fact that you confess to be tells a lot (though I am surprised that you did).

    To think that in the OP you speak of compassion, where is your compassion for those born in poverty who wish to move to the UK for a better life?
    You deride the Conservatives for policies that favour the rich over the poor (it seems), yet you favour people based on what country they were born in?

    How can you rectify supporting two completely conflicting viewpoints? You declare that Conservatives aren't human because of their lack of empathy with students, yet you have no empathy at all for the majority of human beings simply because they don't have the same passport as you? Does this mean that you aren't human either? Your hypocrisy is astounding.
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    (Original post by Craig_D)
    I do not agree that everyone is xenophobic, though the fact that you confess to be tells a lot (though I am surprised that you did).

    To think that in the OP you speak of compassion, where is your compassion for those born in poverty who wish to move to the UK for a better life?
    Coming to a country in search of a better life is only something indigent and destitute people should be allowed to do. By this I mean the genuine refugees of wars, famine, drought and other catastrophes should be allowed to come to this country in order to seek refuge, be that temporary or if necessary permanent.

    People from countries in temperate climates, countries with bountiful natural resources, an abundance of foodstuffs, decent infrastructure, enjoying a stable peaceful political climate, should not be allowed to settle in this country as economic migrants, especially not when their presence here deprives natural born citizens of access to jobs, housing and benefits. Instead they should be encouraged to develop the economies of their own countries.

    They should only be allowed to settle here if they have exceptional skills or talent, and even then only a very small amount should be allowed in.

    Funds should be set aside to develop home grown skills and talents.


    You deride the Conservatives for policies that favour the rich over the poor (it seems), yet you favour people based on what country they were born in?
    A British government should be concerned first and foremost with the wellbeing of British people. Otherwise there is no reason for British Citizens to observe and obey rules or laws imposed upon them by such a government.

    How can you rectify supporting two completely conflicting viewpoints? You declare that Conservatives aren't human because of their lack of empathy with students, yet you have no empathy at all for the majority of human beings simply because they don't have the same passport as you?
    The word you are looking for is reconcile.

    To answer your illogical question (there is no contradiction in my position), I ask you: what is the significance of a passport?

    For what reason do passports exist?

    If I should have empathy for the majority of human beings, if you or your government should, then why are the majority of human beings restricted from settling in this country on account their not being members of the EU?

    Why are EU countries, countries who joined this arbitrary political union, just a few years ago, given the right to free movement in this country, while the citizens of others, nations with centuries old traditions and relations with Britain, restricted from coming here?

    Are EU nations better than non-EU nations? Are they more deserving of your brand of "compassion"? Are they poor? Are they suffering from drought or famine or war? Are they starving? Do their children have files in their mouths? Are they dying of artificial diseases?

    Have you failed to notice that the citizens of most EU nations are white? Do you not realize? A racially motivated immigration policy has been put in place here. White Eastern Europeans are encouraged to come and partake of the wealth of Britain at the expense of the poor people of Britain, a sizable number of whom are non-white.

    Is that compassion?

    Is this the compassion you want me to have?
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    To answer your illogical question (there is no contradiction in my position), I ask you: what is the significance of a passport?

    For what reason do passports exist?

    If I should have empathy for the majority of human beings, if you or your government should, then why are the majority of human beings restricted from settling in this country on account their not being members of the EU?

    Why are EU countries, countries who joined this arbitrary political union, just a few years ago, given the right to free movement in this country, while the citizens of others, nations with centuries old traditions and relations with Britain, restricted from coming here?

    Are EU nations better than non-EU nations? Are they more deserving of your brand of "compassion"? Are they poor? Are they suffering from drought or famine or war? Are they starving? Do their children have files in their mouths? Are they dying of artificial diseases?

    Have you failed to notice that the citizens of most EU nations are white? Do you not realize? A racially motivated immigration policy has been put in place here. White Eastern Europeans are encouraged to come and partake of the wealth of Britain at the expense of the poor people of Britain, a sizable number of whom are non-white.

    Is that compassion?

    Is this the compassion you want me to have?
    A passport is a construct designed by states so as to allow its citizens to move through borders where other states have put up restrictions. Now, more commonly it's used so that states can have a hold on where their citizens are at any one time.

    Well yes, the EU is a nightmare scenario. I would withdraw in a heartbeat, enacting open borders and unilateral free trade, to both benefit Britain and the rest of the world. Crossing a border to seek a better life should never be a crime, anywhere, anytime.

    A note on the EU immigration policy, though, and Britain's. People are not encouraged or discouraged from coming here by the immigration policy (from within the EU I am talking). No, they are merely allowed to. The reason they come? Better living conditions, pay and so forth over here. Why should we protect those who happen to already be here above any other citizen? We shouldn't. Opening it to 27 nations is a start, and better than just 1, but as the EU shall never expand to be a world union, then we should be out.
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    No, they're dancer.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RIZdjT1472Y
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    So you're suggesting that a person as qualified as this man, who had many different jobs and years of experience, decided suddenly that £60 a week was better for him?

    You believe this person WANTED to be unemployed?

    From where do you derive this asinine notion?

    Furthermore, does not taking on unpaid work in the hope of securing paid employment constitute a swallowing of pride?


    Perhaps you've never been unemployed!

    Perhaps you ought to know that in order to receive JSA payments a client must prove he or she is actively looking for work.


    The more you respond the more ignorant and clueless you turn out to be.
    There are jobs out there, he just as to lower himself to them. Cleaner, cashier, whatever. That's swallowing his pride.

    No my dear, I'm not ignorant and clueless, I tell the hrsh truth you don't want to hear. There i little to no excuse to be on JSA for than 6 months if you've left school with GCSE's.
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    (Original post by Steevee)
    There are jobs out there, he just as to lower himself to them. Cleaner, cashier, whatever. That's swallowing his pride.

    No my dear, I'm not ignorant and clueless, I tell the hrsh truth you don't want to hear. There i little to no excuse to be on JSA for than 6 months if you've left school with GCSE's.
    Let's hope you don't have to learn how wrong you are.

    In the meantime take my advice and stick to talking about only what you know.
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    (Original post by Gimme More)
    Let's hope you don't have to learn how wrong you are.

    In the meantime take my advice and stick to talking about only what you know.
    I'm not wrong my dear, you are.
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    (Original post by Steevee)
    I'm not wrong my dear, you are.
    http://www.yourdictionary.com/gramma...junctions.html
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    Did you read your own article? It has little relevence to my previous post :rolleyes:
 
 
 
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