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    (Original post by Economist)
    Then 95% of players are diving pricks because they would have done what he did, he's a wum but if he doesn't go down then chances are N'Z doesn't get sent off, would have been stupid not to go down
    Yeah I know almost any other player would have done the same, I didn't say otherwise, but it still deserves a mention. It's part of the diving culture in football which the refs don't help by not giving fouls and cards unless a player rolls around on the floor.
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    A draw is exactly what I was expecting tbh, big mistake by Wenger in making 8 changes.

    No time to dwell on it though, the focus needs to shift to the game at St. Andrews on Saturday. We'll have Cesc back which is great, but I'm still really worried about this fixture.
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    Only one expression can sum up Squillaci's performance
    :lolwut:
    But then again that expression goes the same to Wenger for making 8 changes and not playing Djourou.
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    (Original post by Louis.)
    Yeah I know almost any other player would have done the same, I didn't say otherwise, but it still deserves a mention. It's part of the diving culture in football which the refs don't help by not giving fouls and cards unless a player rolls around on the floor.
    It deserves a mention, not name-calling.
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    Making 8 changes was a good call. You have to take into concideration that Arsenal have 2 games a weeks for the next 3 months so he need to rest his players.

    Having said that, the stupid move was to put on Nasri and Walcott on at the 81st minutes.
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    Well i'm sure Utd/Chelsea and the like have similar fixtures and didn't feel the need to make so many changes. We only brought in Gibson for Park, which was enforced, and that was against a team who hadn't played in a couple of weeks so were fresh. Chelsea brought in Bosingwa for Ferreira (somewhat tactical), Ramires for Mikel (enforced) and Anelka for Kalou (who's 1st choice anyway). It makes me question your medical staff further if Wenger doesn't trust them to ensure adequate recovery when teams in similar positions are playing the same teams. The changes were excessive and Wenger got it wrong.
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    (Original post by mrdoovde1)
    Making 8 changes was a good call. You have to take into concideration that Arsenal have 2 games a weeks for the next 3 months so he need to rest his players.

    Having said that, the stupid move was to put on Nasri and Walcott on at the 81st minutes.
    :rolleyes: There was no need for 8 changes. Stupid decision that cost us 2 points. Agree about the subs though, should have come on after half time.
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    Dammit Wenger!
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    Squillaci hasn't impressed in his short spell at the club so far. This isn't on the basis of the own goal yesterday, over the course of the season so far he's not played good enough. Would have preferred to keep Sol Campbell instead.

    Arsenal keep throwing away points. So frustrating, you can talk about the team that played Wigan tonight all you want, but we had more than enough out there to beat Wigan Athletic. They aren't a great side, we made the opportunities and got unlucky with the Rodallega dive and the handball penalty claim that wasn't given at the end. Ridiculous.

    Champions in situations of 3 games in 6 days can field a 2nd string and go to Wigan and get the result. We should have won it tonight, especially after the sending off. Really don't know what Arshavin was trying to do in the 1 on 1, just smash it, why make such delicate contact? It just keeps looking more and more like Man Utd will win the league.
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    Seen a few Newcastle games and Sol's been a car wreck. He wouldn't have been any better. Squillaci was brought on as cover and the injury to Vermaelen's hit us hard...although with Wenger in charge we have to accept we're going to concede a bucketload. No matter what defenders are out there, our defensive record will be cack.

    That's why the 8 changes become important. Because we can't defend, every line-up we name has to have a lot of goals in them. We might've had 'enough' but the manager has to pick the XI that gives us the best possible chance of winning. If you're telling me Van Persie, Walcott, Nasri, Wilshere, Song, Rosicky/Arshavin wouldn't have offered us a better chance of scoring more than Bendtner, Chamakh, Arshavin, Diaby, Denilson, Rosicky -- I just can't agree with that.

    You're saying that Champions would've fielded a 2nd string and got a result -- that's not true. Champions wouldn't have fannied about with the line-up so much in the first place. Man City, Tottenham, Man Utd, Chelsea -- none of them made anywhere close to 8 changes. What makes us so special that we can afford to do that?

    Especially with Fabregas missing, we needed to show more respect to Wigan. A better line-up would've seen us out of sight by half-time.
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    i honestly don't know what to think of arshavin....second to nanis 10 assists...he has 9...
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    This looks like a nice place to hang out at.
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    (Original post by Overmars)
    Seen a few Newcastle games and Sol's been a car wreck. He wouldn't have been any better. Squillaci was brought on as cover and the injury to Vermaelen's hit us hard...although with Wenger in charge we have to accept we're going to concede a bucketload. No matter what defenders are out there, our defensive record will be cack.

    That's why the 8 changes become important. Because we can't defend, every line-up we name has to have a lot of goals in them. We might've had 'enough' but the manager has to pick the XI that gives us the best possible chance of winning. If you're telling me Van Persie, Walcott, Nasri, Wilshere, Song, Rosicky/Arshavin wouldn't have offered us a better chance of scoring more than Bendtner, Chamakh, Arshavin, Diaby, Denilson, Rosicky -- I just can't agree with that.

    You're saying that Champions would've fielded a 2nd string and got a result -- that's not true. Champions wouldn't have fannied about with the line-up so much in the first place. Man City, Tottenham, Man Utd, Chelsea -- none of them made anywhere close to 8 changes. What makes us so special that we can afford to do that?

    Especially with Fabregas missing, we needed to show more respect to Wigan. A better line-up would've seen us out of sight by half-time.
    A lot of those players that were out there today have been regulars all year round barring Eboue, Denilson, Diaby and Bendtner. You mentioned Rosicky/Arshavin twice btw, although you may have meant this as a combination with the other players, I'm not sure.

    It's not as if they're an inexperienced bunch, they should be ready made cover (they've been first team for the last few years anyway) who can (and should have) beaten Wigan convincingly last night. We created the opportunities to dispatch this Wigan side at 2-1, and this was after we under-performed. That's my gripe with this team really, they regularly under-perform and don't finish the job, especially when we're a goal up.

    Arshavin was his usual on-off self, contributing to the goals but wasting opportunities for more. Djourou not starting wasn't a good move by Wenger either, but Koscielny and Diaby were absolutely useless for that Rodallega drive at our box leading to his dive. This complacency has really got to stop, but we know it won't this season at the very least and as you point out, maybe never while Wenger is in charge.

    I agree with the view that Wenger changed the side around far too much, not playing Walcott against their woeful left-back was a sorry sight to see. Didn't please me that he decided to bring Nasri and Walcott on after the equaliser so late in the game, it's poor tactics, he does this very often. I don't know if he had the Birmingham game in mind or what or if some players incurred knocks from Monday night. But on paper that line-up ****s all over Wigan IMO, we had the game and threw it away (but got unlucky too). With our injury record, you can see why Wenger would be a little wary on team selection, but he's very confident about this squad. Post-match interview saying they could have been the line-up against Chelsea, he'd still be confident in them. A similar Carling Cup team beat Newcastle away and Wigan at home so there was evidence to suggest that the team was good enough to win and failed.

    But anyway what's done is done, it's not gotten any easier that we have to play Birmingham now and do something we haven't done in the last three seasons (one of those when Brum were in the Championship), win at St. Andrews.
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    just heard that henry will be training with our squad until mls starts...take lessons theo!
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    (Original post by antonfigo)
    just heard that henry will be training with our squad until mls starts...take lessons theo!
    That's excellent news
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    Should be good, tbh. Saw a load of his goals in some programme that was on in the Rocket before the game on Monday and realised just how much I miss the guy. Our squad may not be kids any more, but they hardly have a great deal of winning experience, hopefully he can have a positive effect.

    (Original post by Arsene Wenger (on the 8 changes))
    We had a disadvantage that Wigan played three days ago and only 48 hours ago we played a big game in the evening. I had to change it because we play on Saturday and again on Wednesday so we can't always play with the same team. But I don’t think that was a problem at all.
    Excuses and then the infuriating bull**** that it wasn't a problem. Unacceptable.
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    people need to stop taking wenger's post match interviews seriously....
    His priorities are 'protecting' his players by shifting the blame to the ref , pitch etc even if it means spouting bs.
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    (Original post by antonfigo)
    people need to stop taking wenger's post match interviews seriously....
    His priorities are 'protecting' his players by shifting the blame to the ref , pitch etc even if it means spouting bs.
    I have to disagree, tbh. At times what you're saying would be right, but not all of time and not this time. This isn't about protecting the players, it's about accepting his tactical failure; something he'll never do. His overprotection of players is part of the reason we lose games like this anyway, they know that they can walk all over him without any backlash and generally don't give a ****. Other than Wilshere and Rosicky, can you name a player out there last night that looked as if they really genuinely cared? Even if you can, there's no way can you say every player did, which is something you should be able to do.

    Whilst at times it may be frustrating to see, being a bad loser is a good characteristic at the top level; it drives teams to success. Look at most of the managers considered to be the best around and you'll see it. Which is why, in principle, I have no problem with us being managed by a poor loser, in fact, I'd probably encourage it. Wenger however, is different to these other managers - they might initially react badly to a poor result, not accept blame where it's due and look for excuses, but they'll go away, examine their failures and not let them happen again. Wenger seems to genuinely believe the ****e he feeds the media and even if he doesn't, he never seems to learn from the actual mistakes, anyway. He's such an arrogant ****ing WUM, it's unbelievable.
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    (Original post by JK.)
    I have to disagree, tbh. At times what you're saying would be right, but not all of time and not this time. This isn't about protecting the players, it's about accepting his tactical failure; something he'll never do. His overprotection of players is part of the reason we lose games like this anyway, they know that they can walk all over him without any backlash and generally don't give a ****. Other than Wilshere and Rosicky, can you name a player out there last night that looked as if they really genuinely cared? Even if you can, there's no way can you say every player did, which is something you should be able to do.

    Whilst at times it may be frustrating to see, being a bad loser is a good characteristic at the top level; it drives teams to success. Look at most of the managers considered to be the best around and you'll see it. Which is why, in principle, I have no problem with us being managed by a poor loser, in fact, I'd probably encourage it. Wenger however, is different to these other managers - they might initially react badly to a poor result, not accept blame where it's due and look for excuses, but they'll go away, examine their failures and not let them happen again. Wenger seems to genuinely believe the ****e he feeds the media and even if he doesn't, he never seems to learn from the actual mistakes, anyway. He's such an arrogant ****ing WUM, it's unbelievable.
    Indeed, he's deluded by his belief in his own players. Wigan were shocking yesterday, there's no defence of letting the victory slip like that but he's tried to find one. List of mistakes yesterday:
    1) 8 changes after we hadn't played for 14 days, how exactly are these 4 fixtures so different from back to back CL and CC weeks?
    2) Leaving out Walcott after he's played bugger all minutes this year considering his form
    3) Leaving out Djourou off the back of one of our most impressive defensive displays in ages
    4) Playing a proven crap CB partnership
    5) Playing an average RB at LB against their best player
    6) Playing a hopeless Rosicky as our playmaker
    7) Not even using our 1st teamers until it went 2-2, after the dross served up 1st half, Clichy/Nasri,Walcott should have been on to see out the game
    I can't defend this nonsense anymore
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    Glad I missed the brigade of dumb United fans mouthing off last night. It used to be entertaining when they rocked in with meaningful brainpower, now they're just dumb and it isn't sporting.

    Our loss was not Wenger's fault. The team he played may have shown some disrespect to Wigan (they don't deserve respect from the way they played), but that point loses relevance when the fielded side goes a goal up and the opponents are reduced to 10.

    It is the team's responsibility to get that other goal and to defend with the appropriate balance. Arsene perhaps should have made a sub earlier, but that change would not have been the very players who cost us the points: Fabianski and Squillaci.

    Fabianski - ANY keeper knows, when they have good instincts, that you do not chase a high ball to where it will fall. You stand your ground, protect your goal and try to anticipate the ball at its highest point where you can intercept it.

    For that reason, he should've held on his line, got close to Caldwell (the only player in 6 yards of the goal) and snatched the knock-down before it even got there. No excuses... drop him for Sczezny and see how the big man does vs Zigic.

    Squillaci - caught the wrong side of a rubbish player and then unnecessarily heads the ball that was too high for Caldwell anyway... He should have stayed on his feet and leapt to block Caldwell, fouled him if needs be... but he ****ed it up. I generally have time for Squillaci, but he is not a first choice CB. Those are Koscielny and Vermaelen, and we desperately need our joke medical staff to bring the latter back.

    Vermaelen being back by January could be the difference between winning this league and not. I reckon with him and Sczeznynynyny in the back-line we will get a good number of clean sheets and cut out the launch antics of most teams.

    With our players fresh, we MUST do what United couldn't and pummel Birmingham in their backyard. It's a tough call, but we go there to win. No excuses now.
 
 
 
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