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A Basic Men's Guide to Success with Women Watch

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    (Original post by dgeorge)
    Shame you can't just admit that maybe you aren't right about everything, and have decided to come off as as complete idiot on this thread. Sometimes, you make genuinely decent points
    ...which is more than could be said for any pickup guru.

    Anyway, I'm right about this like I'm consistently right about most things in the relationships forum. PUA is not good advice, its completely unnecessary for the vast majority of normal people (who are hugely under-represented on TSR, there's barely a handful of us here) and the socially awkward people who do need a little guidance would be far better taking some simple advice from people who actually know what they're talking about rather than a bunch of dorks who see women as a completely different species who need to be approached with "methods" and "techniques".

    People have managed to mate for millennia before the mystery method came along you know.
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    (Original post by Dededex)
    I like having long hair though!!
    Don't worry, I LOVE long hair

    Also OP... I think there are a lot of guys who actually look nicer with glasses, you don't need contacts.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    ...which is more than could be said for any pickup guru.

    Anyway, I'm right about this like I'm consistently right about most things in the relationships forum. PUA is not good advice, its completely unnecessary for the vast majority of normal people (who are hugely under-represented on TSR, there's barely a handful of us here) and the socially awkward people who do need a little guidance would be far better taking some simple advice from people who actually know what they're talking about rather than a bunch of dorks who see women as a completely different species who need to be approached with "methods" and "techniques".

    People have managed to mate for millennia before the mystery method came along you know.

    which is more than could be said for any pickup guru.
    PUA is not good advice
    Yet the SAME points you commended me on and seconded yourself form the basis of what many "pickup guru's" teach.
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    That OP is stating the bleeding obvious.

    Don't smell, wear decent clothes, be in decent shape.

    It's hardly rocket science.
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    (Original post by dgeorge)
    Yet the SAME points you commended me on and seconded yourself form the basis of what many "pickup guru's" teach.
    I don't know what points you're talking about.

    Of course if you take little snippets out of context even a PUA can sound like good advice, after all, even a broken clock is right twice a day.

    The more important point is that their entire attitude is backwards. Instead of constantly obsessing over how to impress women, men should be wondering how each individual woman they meet is going to impress them.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    Yes, probably because the normal guy is the only one not clumsily hitting on her like a clueless chump. That in itself is an extremely attractive quality.

    I really do feel sorry for guys who have such low self respect that they think simply being themselves isn't going to be enough to pull even the most attractive girl in the club, and they have to put on some kind of phony act.
    The entire point is that you DON'T hit on them like a "clueless chump", but you know that anyway, you just seem like you're trolling now.

    It probably isn't, Jesus we aren't talking to eight year olds here, "just be yourself and you can achieve anything!". Well you can't, you can't all play for Man United, you can't all motorboat Christina Hendricks, you can't all live in mansions and drive Ferraris. If being yourself allowed you to do those things, they would all be really easy and most people would have those things. Most people don't pull the most attractive girl in the club, and not everyone can go out with the beautiful women.

    Not acting exactly how you want all the time doesn't make you a phoney. Like sometimes, you are polite when you don't want to be, to get through social functions, you have these manners drilled into you all your life, but no one teaches you to chat up girls.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    I don't know what points you're talking about.

    Of course if you take little snippets out of context even a PUA can sound like good advice, after all, even a broken clock is right twice a day.

    The more important point is that their entire attitude is backwards. Instead of constantly obsessing over how to impress women, men should be wondering how each individual woman they meet is going to impress them.
    Instead of constantly obsessing over how to impress women, men should be wondering how each individual woman they meet is going to impress them.
    This is why I hate arguing with people who don't know about the topic they're arguing about, they've only heard a bit or two of information and suddenly think they know all about it

    What you pointing out is EXACTLY the end point of PUA. The "tips and tricks" are simply short term advice on how to deal with immediate situations. They are JUST training wheels, temporary information that you can easily discard once you have built an interesting and confident personality

    If you read "The Game" (you're probably going to give some excuse about not readying it, but I will suggest it anyway) you'll understand that what these guys suffer is from lack of self worth and neediness. The ONLY way to become truly successful is to toss away those things, and build yourself into a person of worth. Once you've reached that point, you'll be able to stop worrying about "how many girls you've pulled".

    Of course, if you are already a confident person, none of this is necessary for you. But it's not aimed at confident people is it?
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    (Original post by dgeorge)
    This is why I hate arguing with people who don't know about the topic they're arguing about, they've only heard a bit or two of information and suddenly think they know all about it

    What you pointing out is EXACTLY the end point of PUA. The "tips and tricks" are simply short term advice on how to deal with immediate situations. They are JUST training wheels, temporary information that you can easily discard once you have built an interesting and confident personality

    If you read "The Game" (you're probably going to give some excuse about not readying it, but I will suggest it anyway) you'll understand that what these guys suffer is from lack of self worth and neediness. The ONLY way to become truly successful is to toss away those things, and build yourself into a person of worth. Once you've reached that point, you'll be able to stop worrying about "how many girls you've pulled".

    Of course, if you are already a confident person, none of this is necessary for you. But it's not aimed at confident people is it?
    I'm pretty sure I recommended The Game to you a year or so ago. Its a really genuinely funny book about how sad and pathetic the pickup community really is, I highly recommend it. My girlfriend is reading it at the moment.

    I've read a few other pick up books as well, they're all pretty funny. The one thing they don't contain is useful advice, for anyone, full stop.

    If you're not a confident person, then you need to confront that and deal with it.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    The entire point is that you DON'T hit on them like a "clueless chump", but you know that anyway, you just seem like you're trolling now.

    It probably isn't, Jesus we aren't talking to eight year olds here, "just be yourself and you can achieve anything!". Well you can't, you can't all play for Man United, you can't all motorboat Christina Hendricks, you can't all live in mansions and drive Ferraris. If being yourself allowed you to do those things, they would all be really easy and most people would have those things. Most people don't pull the most attractive girl in the club, and not everyone can go out with the beautiful women.

    Not acting exactly how you want all the time doesn't make you a phoney. Like sometimes, you are polite when you don't want to be, to get through social functions, you have these manners drilled into you all your life, but no one teaches you to chat up girls.
    Once again, you've missed the fundamental point here.

    There is no need to learn to chat up girls, because girls generally do not require chatting up. If you just talk to them like you talk to anyone else you will find they are actually human beings with sexual desires of their own and they would probably actually find you quite attractive if you took five minutes off from objectifying them once in a while.

    PUA is a method for completely clueless chumps to learn to act like marginally less of a clueless chump. If you took good advice instead from people who are actually successful with women and social interactions in general, you could just not be a clueless chump altogether.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    I'm pretty sure I recommended The Game to you a year or so ago. Its a really genuinely funny book about how sad and pathetic the pickup community really is, I highly recommend it. My girlfriend is reading it at the moment.

    I've read a few other pick up books as well, they're all pretty funny. The one thing they don't contain is useful advice, for anyone, full stop.

    If you're not a confident person, then you need to confront that and deal with it.
    You are so confident you feel the need to act smug and superior on the internet. Hmmm.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    You are so confident you feel the need to act smug and superior on the internet. Hmmm.

    No I don't, I've highlighted several times that I'm nothing more than a normal guy.

    I'm genuinely, honestly trying to help. It breaks my heart to see so many clueless kids take this terrible advice from guys that clearly don't have a clue themselves.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    I'm pretty sure I recommended The Game to you a year or so ago. Its a really genuinely funny book about how sad and pathetic the pickup community really is, I highly recommend it. My girlfriend is reading it at the moment.

    I've read a few other pick up books as well, they're all pretty funny. The one thing they don't contain is useful advice, for anyone, full stop.

    If you're not a confident person, then you need to confront that and deal with it.
    If you're not a confident person, then you need to confront that and deal with it
    How?

    You don't suddenly "decide" to become confident, just like a person with depression can't suddenly "decide" not to be depressed, or a persona with OCD can't suddenly "decide" to stop being obsessive They can WORK at it, but they can't simply "decide" to have a massive fundamental shift in their personality. You're really making no sense whatsoever if you think you can simply "decide" to change your personality

    I'm pretty sure I recommended The Game to you a year or so ago
    And I'm sure I read it in 2006, so any "recommending" you did would have been long after i'd read it
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    Once again, you've missed the fundamental point here.

    There is no need to learn to chat up girls, because girls generally do not require chatting up. If you just talk to them like you talk to anyone else you will find they are actually human beings with sexual desires of their own and they would probably actually find you quite attractive if you took five minutes off from objectifying them once in a while.

    PUA is a method for completely clueless chumps to learn to act like marginally less of a clueless chump. If you took good advice instead from people who are actually successful with women and social interactions in general, you could just not be a clueless chump altogether.
    Yet your brilliant advice is "confront it and deal with it".....

    Any more brilliant explicit advice?
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    (Original post by ChemistBoy)
    In short - be a clean-cut, middle-class boy-next-door.

    Perhaps more reflective of the girls you are seeking than some universal truth.

    Personally, I think that straying too far away from who you are is just asking for trouble - castles built on sand and all that.
    That's what I got. I'm not middle class and I'm from the 'hood'. I have not much hair anyway and I hate the fashion that's out atm

    Posted from TSR Mobile
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    Once again, you've missed the fundamental point here.

    There is no need to learn to chat up girls, because girls generally do not require chatting up. If you just talk to them like you talk to anyone else you will find they are actually human beings with sexual desires of their own and they would probably actually find you quite attractive if you took five minutes off from objectifying them once in a while.

    PUA is a method for completely clueless chumps to learn to act like marginally less of a clueless chump. If you took good advice instead from people who are actually successful with women and social interactions in general, you could just not be a clueless chump altogether.
    Yeah, the problem with this idea is that doesn't work in reality. Obviously, this is how most guys start out, just talking to girls normally, and they find it doesn't really work, it doesn't distinguish themselves from other guys. It can work with the girls who generally get less attention, but a pretty, sociable girl- most perfectly normal guys find it doesn't work. That's why they turn to PUA material in the first place. I get your fundamental point, it's just not true.

    I don't believe you don't understand this, but a big part of the point of PUA material is that the guys who write them do well with women, and to be fair some of them have proved it on tv. You haven't really given any advice except "be yourself", which isn't helpful, and everyone has already heard anyway. That isn't going to help a guy who is insecure about talking to women, neither is calling him a "clueless chump", which makes you seem nasty and insecure. The advice I'm giving, I know that can work because it has helped me and people I know go from being unsuccessful with women to being successful with them.
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    (Original post by BowzerEdwards)
    That OP is stating the bleeding obvious.

    Don't smell, wear decent clothes, be in decent shape.

    It's hardly rocket science.

    This. I'm just shocked so many people have not said the same. Disgusting effort from you OP.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    No I don't, I've highlighted several times that I'm nothing more than a normal guy.

    I'm genuinely, honestly trying to help. It breaks my heart to see so many clueless kids take this terrible advice from guys that clearly don't have a clue themselves.
    You a page back-

    "Most people don't THINK about what makes them attractive at all, they just are. I certainly never did, its only now I've looked back and asked "why WAS I so successful compared to a lot of my friends" that I've realised the things that confident sociable guys naturally do"

    A lot of people lie on the internet, you could be full of it, but maybe you are just naturally good with women, some people are, well done, but there's no need to be so up yourself to guys who aren't as lucky as you.

    To be clear, when I first started trying to hit on girls, I was basically following your advice, and it DID NOT WORK. So I know, in the way David Hume and the sceptics say the only way we can know things, that your advice is wrong.

    To be fair, some of these PUAs have been on a tv show where they've shown how they can pull women, and there are lots of referrals of people who've seen them succeed, so they clearly do know what they're talking about.

    I didn't read The Game, but I read Mystery Method. It isn't like I put in a huge amount of effort, it took me a couple of hours to read on the internet, some parts I disagreed with (I'm not going to walk around with a load of photos all the time), some I don't think work for me, some seemed more American, but a lot of the basics made sense to me, especially the psychology aspect.
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    (Original post by py0alb)
    Once again, you've missed the fundamental point here.

    There is no need to learn to chat up girls, because girls generally do not require chatting up. If you just talk to them like you talk to anyone else you will find they are actually human beings with sexual desires of their own and they would probably actually find you quite attractive if you took five minutes off from objectifying them once in a while.

    PUA is a method for completely clueless chumps to learn to act like marginally less of a clueless chump. If you took good advice instead from people who are actually successful with women and social interactions in general, you could just not be a clueless chump altogether.
    Funny enough, you seem to be missing the point....

    YOU don't know what YOU do because you never consciously learned it. That doesn't mean that you aren't acting in a particular way that is beneficial to you, and that you can't teach it to others. It simply means that YOU do not understand.
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    (Original post by Mankytoes)
    Yeah, the problem with this idea is that doesn't work in reality. Obviously, this is how most guys start out, just talking to girls normally, and they find it doesn't really work, it doesn't distinguish themselves from other guys. It can work with the girls who generally get less attention, but a pretty, sociable girl- most perfectly normal guys find it doesn't work. That's why they turn to PUA material in the first place. I get your fundamental point, it's just not true.

    I don't believe you don't understand this, but a big part of the point of PUA material is that the guys who write them do well with women, and to be fair some of them have proved it on tv. You haven't really given any advice except "be yourself", which isn't helpful, and everyone has already heard anyway. That isn't going to help a guy who is insecure about talking to women, neither is calling him a "clueless chump", which makes you seem nasty and insecure. The advice I'm giving, I know that can work because it has helped me and people I know go from being unsuccessful with women to being successful with them.
    Agreed
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    This thread is pointless. To quote Richard Feynman, " If you think you understand quantum mechanics, you dont understand quantum mechanics." I think the same goes for relationships.
 
 
 
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