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Feminists Vs Islam (women are disrespected in islam?) watch

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    (Original post by AmazingArry;[url="tel:63921409")
    63921409[/url]]1. I've seen grandmas in their 80s on the news beating the crap out the burglar with pots and pans, women lifting cars off their babies and pulling car doors right off to get to their children. How if any men have been able to lift a car that aren't Arnold Schwarzenegger? Really that goes to show women are perfectly able to look after their families themselves.

    2. People don't jump each others bones as soon as they make eye contact. Attraction is natural. If Islam is so against sex outside of marriage, why does it never teach how to deal with attraction and how to learn to resist sexual advances instead of quarantining men and women from each other. The only result of that ends up being child abuse and pedophilia because of that strong desire never being released. It's happened in both Muslim and Christian communities before you start picking on Christians and saying they are bad. All that's saying is that you are as bad as them.

    3. There are still religions today that worship a goddess instead of a god. Islam and Christianity fought to get rid of these religions and labeled them as devil worshippers and witches when all they were really pissed about was the suffix and the pronoun, that in some way females were thought to be superior than men. And in a masochist lead world, they were pissed off. People were also pissed off Queen Mary 1 was the first female to become queen and several communities revolted against her.

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    1. Good for you that you've seen these people. But majority of the time, burglars are dangerous. Doesn't even matter though because it's natural thinking for everyone that men protect the family. Look at human beings all over the world. Fact.

    2. Islam never said that people "jump each other's bones" as soon as they make eye contact. And Islam does say how people should deal with attraction; get married or do some fasting outside of ramadan. Mate how on Earth do child abusers and paedos come outta this? You just made a pretty hefty claim which is completely baseless. (A. Where's your evidence that these crimes are high within religious communities? B. Even if they were extremely high, that's their sin. Doing another sin to stay away from a different sin doesn't make it allowed.)

    3. What on Earth is your point?

    However I must point out that you're trying to point out general issues that you have with the religion when the whole point of this thread is to address feminism and Islam. Ergo, I would normally tell you to get outta here but you're clearly lost.
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    (Original post by AmazingArry)
    2. [snip] The only result of that ends up being child abuse and pedophilia because of that strong desire never being released. It's happened in both Muslim and Christian communities before you start picking on Christians and saying they are bad. All that's saying is that you are as bad as them.
    Do you have any stats or anything for this? Paedophilia is defined as being attracted to children, I fail to see how quarantining women would somehow alter their sexual taste to that sort of huge extent. Child abuse would be plausible I suppose, some guy realises he ain't gonna get any and some under 16 year olds are hella loose, he does some shady biddnizz, but =/= paedophilia because semantics. Gold medal in mental gymnastics tho

    3. There are still religions today that worship a goddess instead of a god. Islam and Christianity fought to get rid of these religions and labeled them as devil worshippers and witches when all they were really pissed about was the suffix and the pronoun, that in some way females were thought to be superior than men. And in a masochist lead world, they were pissed off. People were also pissed off Queen Mary 1 was the first female to become queen and several communities revolted against her.
    Islam and Christianity also fought to get rid of each other quite a bit. Relgious bust-ups are generally a "this God isn't the same as my God, and is therefore the wrong one and I don't like it". The standard Christian and Islamic Gods were male, those Gods therefore constitute as "wrong God" to these people, rather like Christians were inclined to say say Allah's the wrong God because their views were different. I'm not sure how Queen Mary is relevant to Islam. I also have a funny feeling communties revolting against her might've been loosely related to the fact that she executed a lot of people...
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    (Original post by champ_mc99)
    I am familiar with Jesus claiming to be the Son of God in the bible. But Muslims believe the Bible was distorted.
    Well of course Muslims would believe that, Muhammad was hardly going to admit that Jesus was actually God, was he?

    But the Bible being distorted =/= the verses about Jesus claiming divinity being distorted, if that is your assertion then the burden is on you to prove in in regards to those specific verses.

    When Muslims say this, what they're really saying of course, is "the bits of the Bible that don't agree with the Qur'an have been distorted, but the bits that do haven't".
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Haha what are you talking about they don't exist?
    The things that have been mentioned in the Quran 1400 years ago that have only been able to be proven miracles now due to the recent scientific advancements are miracles.
    I do understand that there are obviously Muslims who leave their religion but the reason it's secret has nothing to do with Islam. It is forbidden in Islam to force the religion on someone so all these pressures are social pressures and can't be linked to Islam. A reason that people leave Islam is due to relating cultural/social pressures to the practice of Islam and being ill informed and not educated enough.
    And Islam IS the fasted growing religion. Just because u notice a lot of agnostics around you, you can't assume that the fastest growing religion are them without studies.
    You are very used to stereotyping and generalising which is a very bad thing and I have also met people who have lost their faith due to generalising too much and judging the religion on the people which is wrong!
    There has been no scientific errors in the Quran, I would like you to provide me evidence please from a reliable source. Multiple reliable sources would be helpful. The contradictions you will find are most probably due to ill interpretation and the quotation taken out of context and not understanding it.
    Thanks
    I meant exactly what I said: they're not real. Whenever I asked for even one so-called "scientific miracle", all I ever got was contrived nonsense. Do you know that there are Christians who claim the same about the Bible?

    For starters, how on Earth did Muhammad split the moon? Such a thing would be impossible without a terrible impact on the Earth's debris and the planet's population. Moreover there was astronomers all over the world even back in Muhammad's time and even tribes that worshipped the moon, how did they not notice this split? Why is there no record of this ever happening from non-Islamic sources?

    The most reliable source I can use is the Quran, and it mentions things that we know to be untrue now that science has advanced. It claims that there are seven heaven above one another when that isn't the case. There are billions of stars and galaxies, the universe is simply too vast for us to comprehend. The universe does not consist of seven layers.
    See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another. Quran 71:15
    According to the Quran it took longer (or just as long depending on your interpretation) to create the Earth than the universe and they were created in a period of six days. This is simply impossible.
    Say: Is it that ye deny Him Who created the earth in two Days? And do ye join equals with Him? He is the Lord of (all) the Worlds.
    He set on the (earth), mountains standing firm, high above it, and bestowed blessings on the earth, and measure therein all things to give them nourishment in due proportion, in four Days, in accordance with (the needs of) those who seek (Sustenance). Moreover He comprehended in His design the sky, and it had been (as) smoke: He said to it and to the earth: "Come ye together, willingly or unwillingly." They said: "We do come (together), in willing obedience."

    So He completed them as seven firmaments in two Days, and He assigned to each heaven its duty and command. And We adorned the lower heaven with lights, and (provided it) with guard. Such is the Decree of (Him) the Exalted in Might, Full of Knowledge. Quran 41:9
    And there are many, many more. I am not stereotyping and judging Islam by its adherents. I clung to the religion for so long and took consolation in the claim that "Islam is perfect, Muslims are not". I judged the religion entirely by what the scriptures say. Islam is the fastest growing religion, sure but Atheism and Agnosticism are not considered to be religions. If you check out the PEW stats you will see that when it comes to conversions or switching religions, those who are "unaffiliated" have the highest growth percentage.
    http://www.pewforum.org/2015/04/02/r...ons-2010-2050/

    It was also confirmed the the speed at which Islam grows is mainly due to high birthrates so that's not very impressive in itself. If the reason for this growth was conversion then you would be onto something.
    http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...ligious-group/
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    (Original post by WBZ144)
    I meant exactly what I said: they're not real. Whenever I asked for even one so-called "scientific miracle", all I ever got was contrived nonsense. Do you know that there are Christians who claim the same about the Bible?

    For starters, how on Earth did Muhammad split the moon? Such a thing would be impossible without a terrible impact on the Earth's debris and the planet's population. Moreover there was astronomers all over the world even back in Muhammad's time and even tribes that worshipped the moon, how did they not notice this split? Why is there no record of this ever happening from non-Islamic sources?

    The most reliable source I can use is the Quran, and it mentions things that we know to be untrue now that science has advanced. It claims that there are seven heaven above one another when that isn't the case. There are billions of stars and galaxies, the universe is simply too vast for us to comprehend. The universe does not consist of seven layers.


    According to the Quran it took longer (or just as long depending on your interpretation) to create the Earth than the universe and they were created in a period of six days. This is simply impossible.


    And there are many, many more. I am not stereotyping and judging Islam by its adherents. I clung to the religion for so long and took consultation in the claim that "Islam is perfect, Muslims are not". I judged the religion entirely by what the scriptures say. Islam is the fastest growing religion, sure but Atheism and Agnosticism are not considered to be religions. If you check out the PEW stats you will see that when it comes to conversions or switching religions, those who are "unaffiliated" have the highest growth percentage.
    http://www.pewforum.org/2015/04/02/r...ons-2010-2050/

    It was also confirmed the the speed at which Islam grows is mainly due to high birthrates so that's not very impressive in itself. If the reason for this growth was conversion then you would be onto something.
    http://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank...ligious-group/
    There are scientific proofs and nothing has been proved wrong.
    It doesn't suggest that outside of earth there lies seven heavens on top of each other; why do you assume it is saying heaven is within this universe?
    I think where you are wrong is the fact you assume everything that God does follows the laws of this reality. God doesn't follow the laws of physics, for you to suggest that it's impossible to create the earth longer than universe or something along those lines; yes it is impossible for us, creating a earth is impossible for us, creating life is impossible to us but that is only limited to us and Allah has no limitations.
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    There are scientific proofs and nothing has been proved wrong.
    It doesn't suggest that outside of earth there lies seven heavens on top of each other; why do you assume it is saying heaven is within this universe?
    I think where you are wrong is the fact you assume everything that God does follows the laws of this reality. God doesn't follow the laws of physics, for you to suggest that it's impossible to create the earth longer than universe or something along those lines; yes it is impossible for us, creating a earth is impossible for us, creating life is impossible to us but that is only limited to us and Allah has no limitations.
    So where are these seven heavens if they are not outside of the Earth? Why is there no evidence of them existing? And why does the Quran mention their creation in relation with the Earth and the stars?

    Those who claim that there are scientific miracles are the ones who need to prove that these miracles exist in the Quran. The burden of proof is not on sceptics and non-believers to show that they don't.

    It's very convenient to insist that there are scientific miracles, but when something in the Quran contradicts science it is chalked up to God doing as he pleases,
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    (Original post by WBZ144)
    So where are these seven heavens if they are not outside of the Earth? Why is there no evidence of them existing? And why does the Quran mention their creation in relation with the Earth and the stars?

    Those who claim that there are scientific miracles are the ones who need to prove that these miracles exist in the Quran. The burden of proof is not on sceptics and non-believers to show that they don't.

    It's very convenient to insist that there are scientific miracles, but when something in the Quran contradicts science it is chalked up to God doing as he pleases,
    No I think u misunderstand, some of the miracles of the Quran are to do which the scientific facts which were mentioned in the Quran 1400years ago and have only now been discovered true as there have been scientific advancements. The miracle is, how were all these hundreds of scientific mentions correct 1400 years ago if there was no proof, you can't claim it to be chance as every single one is proved correct and there was no civilisation in this time to have all correct beliefs. For example: some may believed the earth to be round but the moon to be its own source of light and or some may think the earth is flat but orbited around the sun, there wasn't a single civilisations with all correct beliefs but the revelation of the Quran at that time came about and provided all these "theories" which have all since been proven correct.
    That's what we mean by the scientific miracles.
    So the point of allah doing as he pleases isn't anything to do with it.

    And some of the best scientists and theorists in the world believe in several universes (Steven hawkwings) there is no proof of these and no way to travel to another. The evidence isn't there but it is still a scientific theory believed by many.
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    The Quran contains no scientific miracles at all, it's full of scientific inaccuracies. Funny how no non-Muslim scientists are convinced by Quranic "science". Even Muslim apologists have started to abandon the scientific narrative claiming it's an intellectual embarrassment for Muslims.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    The Quran contains no scientific miracles at all, it's full of scientific inaccuracies. Funny how no non-Muslim scientists are convinced by Quranic "science". Even Muslim apologists have started to abandon the scientific narrative claiming it's an intellectual embarrassment for Muslims.
    Provide the inaccuracies. Who says i'm not a scientist xD. People do PhDs in the science within the quran you know?
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Provide the inaccuracies. Who says i'm not a scientist xD. People do PhDs in the science within the quran you know?
    Yes you can do a BA in Islamic Science, which is what, I think, Dr Yasir Qadhi did... notice its BA not Bsc though.

    People do PhDs in all sorts of things... whats your point?

    http://www.online-phd-programs.org/b...-paper-topics/


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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Provide the inaccuracies. Who says i'm not a scientist xD. People do PhDs in the science within the quran you know?
    WBZ144 has already highlighted some and you haven't addressed them. What's the point in even asking for evidence when we both know that you'll just say they aren't there.
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    WBZ144 has already highlighted some and you haven't addressed them. What's the point in even asking for evidence when we both know that you'll just say they aren't there.
    Which? What scientific inaccuracies? Saying heaven is above earth?
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Which? What scientific inaccuracies? Saying heaven is above earth?
    She mentioned the seven layers point.

    But to the point, would you mind providing a scientific miracle that was not known previously and could not have been known by any other means. I believe you also mentioned so-called science being confirmed recently. Would you mind providing the peer-reviewed journals proving this?
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    (Original post by Plantagenet Crown)
    She mentioned the seven layers point.

    But to the point, would you mind providing a scientific miracle that was not known previously and could not have been known by any other means. I believe you also mentioned so-called science being confirmed recently. Would you mind providing the peer-reviewed journals proving this?
    Yeah, she said seven layers thinking there were seven layers outside of earth but within this universe. I already cleared that one.

    Have you read my other messages about the civilisations which believed in certain theories.
    I said recent scientific advancements have lead to a discovery of a theory which was in the quran. Big bang for example. I'm pretty sure you don't need to read a peer-reviewed journal on the theory of big bang right?
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Yeah, she said seven layers thinking there were seven layers outside of earth but within this universe. I already cleared that one.
    I don't follow, what are these supposed 7 layers in reference to exactly?

    Have you read my other messages about the civilisations which believed in certain theories.
    I said recent scientific advancements have lead to a discovery of a theory which was in the quran. Big bang for example. I'm pretty sure you don't need to read a peer-reviewed journal on the theory of big bang right?
    Iirc the Quran was not the first to say the universe was expanding and I've seen people on here before say that the expansion bit wasn't actually added until Hubble's discovery. Isn't there also the word "steadily" in there, too? Which is wrong because the expansion isn't steady.

    And as Chemting said, why did Muslims not mention it was in the Quran until AFTER it was discovered by the kuffar?
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    Have you read my other messages about the civilisations which believed in certain theories.
    I said recent scientific advancements have lead to a discovery of a theory which was in the quran. Big bang for example. I'm pretty sure you don't need to read a peer-reviewed journal on the theory of big bang right?
    Big bang is not in the Quran... if it was, why couldn't Muslim scholars and astronomers propose it before Kafirs worked it out? Unless its confirmation bias and, for the case of expanding universe, changing the meaning of the word to fit the conclusion...

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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    No I think u misunderstand, some of the miracles of the Quran are to do which the scientific facts which were mentioned in the Quran 1400years ago and have only now been discovered true as there have been scientific advancements. The miracle is, how were all these hundreds of scientific mentions correct 1400 years ago if there was no proof, you can't claim it to be chance as every single one is proved correct and there was no civilisation in this time to have all correct beliefs. For example: some may believed the earth to be round but the moon to be its own source of light and or some may think the earth is flat but orbited around the sun, there wasn't a single civilisations with all correct beliefs but the revelation of the Quran at that time came about and provided all these "theories" which have all since been proven correct.
    That's what we mean by the scientific miracles.
    So the point of allah doing as he pleases isn't anything to do with it.

    And some of the best scientists and theorists in the world believe in several universes (Steven hawkwings) there is no proof of these and no way to travel to another. The evidence isn't there but it is still a scientific theory believed by many.
    I don't think that it's by chance or coincidence because I have yet to come across a real scientific fact in the Quran that could not have been known 1400 years ago. I have not found verses that describe the universe in a way that is supported by science.
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    (Original post by WBZ144)
    I don't think that it's by chance or coincidence because I have yet to come across a real scientific fact in the Quran that could not have been known 1400 years ago. I have not found verses that describe the universe in a way that is supported by science.
    I linked a video on a previous comment, watch it.
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    (Original post by chemting)
    Big bang is not in the Quran... if it was, why couldn't Muslim scholars and astronomers propose it before Kafirs worked it out? Unless its confirmation bias and, for the case of expanding universe, changing the meaning of the word to fit the conclusion...

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    It was and we all believed in it before the publication of non-Muslims however we had no empirical evidence so we were relying on faith and faith doesn't score too well in scientific journals I don't think.
    No meanings can be changed, how can it be changes there is tafseer which is the meaning and that isn't changed.

    Also aside from that, even if there are things in the Quran which aren't understood yet but when modern scientific evidence suggests a theory which fits the guidelines then that could allow us to understand the reference. Why were the words there in the first place which could provide this meaning? It's not like the words can be interpreted to suggest that the sun was made after Earth or the Big Bang happened and we only applied the modern evidence because that would be impossible.
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    (Original post by Squishy•)
    I linked a video on a previous comment, watch it.
    Oh boy, not Zakir Naik

    I have a feeling I know what he's going to say and have refuted these arguments previously. Will get back to you once I can stomach sitting through that video....
 
 
 
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