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    (Original post by Bill_Gates)

    I just clicked on your profile and says Islamic society :rolleyes:
    Thanks for letting us know. Makes sense now the kind of nonsense that has emanated from that user
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    (Original post by Pinzgauer)
    We do know about Hamas tactics though.

    Use the civilian population as cover for attacks

    Ya thats true.
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    (Original post by Algorithm69)
    You ever going to make a thread of Hamas' war crimes? The use of human shields? Firing hundreds of rockets per day into Israel? The deliberate targeting of civilians? The call for genocide and the destruction of Israel in Hamas' constitution? The fact that Palestinian children's programmes call for the murder of Jews? The use of Nazi slogans and iconography within Palestine? Any of these give you cause for concern?
    Human shields? Who do you expect to be killed when Israel launches attacks into a civilian area? Oh, guess what? Civilians. Innocent men, women and children. What with Gaza being the most densely populated area on Earth, obviously any attacks are going to end up needlessly killing people. And Hamas may randomly fire rockets in return, but do any of them have any impact when Israel is protected because of the Iron Dome. And what do you expect them to do, not fight back? Israel has placed a crippling trade and economic embargo on Gaza, placed the people under siege, humiliated them daily via military and police checkpoints, controlled their water and electricity, shot their children, bombed their schools, mosques and businesses, illegally seized their lands, destroyed their crops, demolished their homes, threw thousands of them in dungeons and treated them like sub-humans. Oh, they should just let it go without a fight, shouldn't they. And it's not as though Israelis haven't called for the annihilation of Palestine either? People talk about Palestine kids being brainwashed, have you seen some of the stuff Israeli teenagers have been coming out with. It's sick
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    (Original post by Algorithm69)
    Fair-minded people focus on the evils of both sides in the conflict.
    And then they reach the conclusion that what one side has done is far, far worse than what the other side has done
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    (Original post by Pinzgauer)
    So he has been bought out by the Israelis to talk against his own people. What's new about this tactic of Israel's to paint themselves as the justified ones?


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    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    nope, as ive repeated many time to you - its the islamists that are the terrorists, and in israel the jews are fighting them, that is the reality . we can repeat this over and over if you like, just to your inherent hatred of the jews in trying to misquote. whether you like it or not, jews have a homeland in levant and they have every right to defend it from islamists, as the entire globe has the right
    I'm sorry to inform you that your opinion that "Jews are terrorists" is erroneous. Whilst some terrorists may profess a belief in Judaism, it does not mean that Jews, as adherents to the Judeo faith, are all terrorists.

    I trust that you will make the distinction between "Jews are terrorists" and "Some Jews are terrorists"...

    most moral people would be totally against militarily invading other peoples countries in terms of pure morality ( obviously that doesnt apply to you) and less outraged by mass immigration ( though the likes of bnp etc are against it) but again we can again highlight your rather pathetic hypocracy - given you are of muslim background andso an immigrant to the uk, complaining about immigration- hasnt their been huge amount of immigration to allow muslim communities to leave muslim countries to seek better lives in the west - what exactly is your problem ?
    a) Morality - There is something immoral about invading a country to which you are signatory to a peace treaty between your states. There is nothing inherently wrong or immoral about invading another country/people to whom you have no binding peace treaty.

    b) Some erroneous assumptions about me - Please do not presume to know me or of my background.

    but you havent rationalised one singe opinion yet -
    From now on, I will dissect your posts and expose it as worthless and conducive to the discussion.

    currently you say you refuse to recgnise islamist groups like hamas are terrorists ( even though most of the world does),
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.

    you are 'pro military invasion and conquering' and yet complained about israell militarily occupying gaza,
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.

    and your are anti immigration, even though you are an immigrant ( as are many previous generation of palestinians btw) .
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.

    all quite stupid comments youve made frankly
    II agree. It would be "stupid" if I had actually made them. Except I haven't and it'd be hilarious to watch you squirm, scrabble and sweat whilst you go over the last 100 odd pages and try to find something which matches what you think I was trying to say.

    the world has an issue with islamists, becuase the muslim world has failed to deal with its dirty laundry, but islamists play a massive part in palestine, so im happy to discuss here. what do you think hamas are
    Create a new thread.

    ooh burn! :eek:
    I cannot apologise if you can only communicate through emoticons. I suggest you pick up a dictionary and use some words...

    palestine has been hijacked by islamists perhaps a non muslim can argue about it in terms of a humanitarian and settlement issue (not withstanding the israelis rights in that region too) but in general a muslims is highly susceptible to islamist propaganda on this issue hence why you make such ignorant aand unsubstantiated comments as above.
    The use of commas would go a long way to helping a person interpret your incomprehensible opinion.

    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    they just shot a lot of people and took control of gaza - which is the sort of thing you enjoy as you mentioned
    The democratic process should not be undermined. Therefore, HAMAS was well within their jurisdiction to call on the security services in order to prevent an attempted coup by Fatah who had the tacit approval of both Israel and the United States of America.

    Countries, who I feel I should mention, both underline their own achievements as shining beacons of "democracy"...
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    (Original post by Reptilian)
    So he has been bought out by the Israelis to talk against his own people. What's new about this tactic of Israel's to paint themselves as the justified ones?


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Of course.

    Everyone who supports Israel is being paid.
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    Absolutely disgusting if true, i'm sure we will hear soon enough, it can't be too hard to verify. Expect a my account was hacked statement any time now.
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    (Original post by Reptilian)
    So he has been bought out by the Israelis to talk against his own people. What's new about this tactic of Israel's to paint themselves as the justified ones?


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Really? Hamas is a terrorist organisation. And as Yousef said in the video, they wish to destroy Israel. I may not necessarily agree with everything Israel is doing, as Palestine is weak, and to Israel doesn't pose much of a threat. However, I most certainly do not agree with anything Hamas is doing. They are the reason Palestine is as it is, not Israel. They brought this upon themselves by starting the conflict. You can't just overlook all of this and say that Israel is automatically responsible for everything.
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    (Original post by TheTechN1304)
    Really? Hamas is a terrorist organisation. And as Yousef said in the video, they wish to destroy Israel. I may not necessarily agree with everything Israel is doing, as Palestine is weak, and to Israel doesn't pose much of a threat. However, I most certainly do not agree with anything Hamas is doing. They are the reason Palestine is as it is, not Israel. They brought this upon themselves by starting the conflict. You can't just overlook all of this and say that Israel is automatically responsible for everything.
    Let's first define terrorism:

    Terrorism: using violence or means of terror in order to obtain political obiectives.

    Israel has time and time again used violence to get it wants and I'm pretty sure no one disagrees with me that being a Gazan must be terrifying to a level none of us will experience. Therefore, Israel is also a terrorist state but that doesn't matter to you because the word 'terrorist' can only apply to Muslims and its meaning is irrelevant.

    Hamas is classed as a terrorist group because it is against Israel and because the Western big shots like America and the UK support it regardless of its actions. Now tell me why Hamas is a terrorist entity and Israel isn't?

    Oh yeah, maybe because in your mind terrorists can only be brown people who kill white people, right?

    Oh and, one side, some of Hamas, speak of wishing to destroy Israel while the other side, Israel is actively destroying the Palestinian people in Gaza. I think I know which side is more condemnable. Israel has a long history of carrying out false flag operations, I wouldn't be surprised if it was behind at least some of those rocket attacks on Israel.


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    The main question to ask is why Hamas believe what they do. If I lived under a brutal illegal occupation, I sure as hell would detest my occupiers and fight them to the death.
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    (Original post by Reptilian)
    So he has been bought out by the Israelis to talk against his own people. What's new about this tactic of Israel's to paint themselves as the justified ones?


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    I guess he's a modern day white liberal/leftist.
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    (Original post by silent ninja)
    Tenuous link at best. These ultra political Jews (Zionists) are not descendants of those Jews anyway. You forget Jews lived peacefully with Christians and Muslims in Palestine for over 1500 years until 1947 where European white guilt over the war wanted to give Jews a homeland. They just didn't want to give their land so annexed a foreign colony, created war, ethnic cleansing, armed the Zionists with weapons then left. And here we are today. The West continues to arm Israel in subjugation and oppression. Arabs have no rights in this region. Those "Arabs" lived here longer than any other people. These Zionists are foreigners that have come for a piece of land.
    I'm not sure if it's tenuous; every link I can find on the internet describes Hamas as 'Islamist'.

    While the meddling of European colonial powers certainly had a part to play, you're exaggerating their importance. From the late 1930s the British actively restricted jewish immigration into Palestine, and did everything within their power to suppress the inter-communal tensions between the Arabs and zionists. Far from simply being given land, the Zionists created the foundations for a state by purchasing land legally from the resident arab population, and by building institutions, through their own independent efforts, to administer the area. The war of 1948, rather than being created by the west, was unilaterally declared against Israel by the arab states. While it's true that western support for Israel has been an extremely crucial factor in the establishment and survival of the Israeli state, it's hardly appropriate to represent the arab-Israeli conflict upon the whole as the outcome of western manipulation.

    Also, it's not even clear if there was ever a systematic campaign of ethnic cleansing employed in Palestine; most statements claiming that there was originate in Arab propaganda.

    For the record, I completely agree that the Palestinians deserve more rights than they're currently afforded by the Israeli government. But I think an ideal scenario of peaceful coexistence cannot be achieved so long as Hamas remains the dominant authority in Gaza.
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    (Original post by Reptilian)
    Let's first define terrorism:

    Terrorism: using violence or means of terror in order to obtain political obiectives.

    Israel has time and time again used violence to get it wants and I'm pretty sure no one disagrees with me that being a Gazan must be terrifying to a level none of us will experience. Therefore, Israel is also a terrorist state but that doesn't matter to you because the word 'terrorist' can only apply to Muslims and its meaning is irrelevant.

    Hamas is classed as a terrorist group because it is against Israel and because the Western big shots like America and the UK support it regardless of its actions. Now tell me why Hamas is a terrorist entity and Israel isn't?

    Oh yeah, maybe because in your mind terrorists can only be brown people who kill white people, right?

    Oh and, one side, some of Hamas, speak of wishing to destroy Israel while the other side, Israel is actively destroying the Palestinian people in Gaza. I think I know which side is more condemnable. Israel has a long history of carrying out false flag operations, I wouldn't be surprised if it was behind at least some of those rocket attacks on Israel.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Israel gave Gaza back to the Palestinians in 2005 as a sign of peace. What then happens? They are backstabbed and still attacked anyway. Hamas has said it will not stop until Israel is destroyed. They do not care about their own people. Their aim is the destruction of the jewish people and Israel, and if their people die, they don't care. Hamas are the ones who went and broke a ceasefire, let me remind you. They do not want peace. They want war. Israel acts in self defence. I agree, it's bad that Palestinian civilians die, but at the end of the day, that is the fault of Hamas and Palestine. They could stop the war and stop their people dying, but instead they are hell bent on destroying a country that's actually quite strong, and we all know that they will never be strong enough to destroy Israel. It's all pointless, really. They allow their people to die for nothing. That's not Israel's fault.

    You seem very quick to judge Israel, call them terrorists (when they're acting in self defence), yet you're blind to the fact that Palestine wants war, Palestine started the conflict, and Palestine wants to eradicate Israel. What do you suggest Israel do? Put all their weapons down and ask for peace? Because even if they did, the Palestinian terrorists you're so quick to defend would take the opportunity to blast Israel to the high heavens.
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    I'm sorry to inform you that your opinion that "Jews are terrorists" is erroneous. Whilst some terrorists may profess a belief in Judaism, it does not mean that Jews, as adherents to the Judeo faith, are all terrorists.

    I trust that you will make the distinction between "Jews are terrorists" and "Some Jews are terrorists"...
    yawn, your childish pedantry is becoming tedious, either change the record or find someone else to bore. again, its islamists that produce the terrorists and irrationality and attitude to sacrifice everyday muslims like sheep. the jews largely do not, israel are jsut defending themselves form islamists. at least you are now admitting that

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    a) Morality - There is something immoral about invading a country to which you are signatory to a peace treaty between your states. There is nothing inherently wrong or immoral about invading another country/people to whom you have no binding peace treaty.
    USA has no "non-invasion treaty" with saudi arabia, palestine, jordan, pakistan UAE etc - so i assume youd welcome them to bomb the crap out of those places and then militarily invade and take over - survival of the fittest i presume is the argument you are trying to propose.

    equally israel has no such treaty with gaza, so again you are staing your approval fro them to fully invade gaza and indeed the WB. thnaks again for confirming - your mentality is knocking over your own arguments

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    b) Some erroneous assumptions about me - Please do not presume to know me or of my background.

    your background and personal views are quite obvious here


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    From now on, I will dissect your posts and expose it as worthless and conducive to the discussion.
    i think youve already tried and failed in this. i didnt have to do any 'dissecting' your flawed arguements and lurid morality re invasions are there for all to see,


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.
    I have not claimed, nor stated this.
    unless you are admitting to be a complete hypocrite, those are exactly the principles you claimed


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    II agree. It would be "stupid" if I had actually made them. Except I haven't and it'd be hilarious to watch you squirm, scrabble and sweat whilst you go over the last 100 odd pages and try to find something which matches what you think I was trying to say.
    you stated you are pro -conquest, anti immigration and also ignore the fact hamas are regarded as terrorists - so i dont have to find anything , its there for everyone to see in your previous 3 replies to me, thanks


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    Create a new thread.
    no



    (Original post by tsr1269)
    I cannot apologise if you can only communicate through emoticons. I suggest you pick up a dictionary and use some words...
    im more interested in focussing on points.


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    The democratic process should not be undermined. Therefore, HAMAS was well within their jurisdiction to call on the security services in order to prevent an attempted coup by Fatah who had the tacit approval of both Israel and the United States of America.
    Fatah were also part of the government so hamas had no ultimate authority to do it , they relied on their islamsit resources to overthrow the rest of the government by force (which was expected to happen by most onlookers- islamists are predictable in their use of intimidation and violence) Islamists only use 'democracy' when it suits them. but democracy is not inherently islamic anyway - for centuries muslim populations have ben ruled by (often quite brutal) military dictatorships they had no control over- be it the caliphs , the arabs , the ottomans, the mongols, - why not the israelis now - whats the difference?

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    Countries, who I feel I should mention, both underline their own achievements as shining beacons of "democracy"...
    ok .... :dontknow:
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    (Original post by King Kebab)
    The main question to ask is why Hamas believe what they do. .
    Because they're an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood which was founded some 3 decades before Israel's reestablishment.

    They have the same ideology as the other Islamic gangs roaming the middle east. They can't all be poor, oppressed victims. :rolleyes:
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    (Original post by Sic semper erat)
    x
    Ah, GrapeLeaves is it? I just saw your post glorifying the levelling of an entire Palestinian district, live inhabitants and all. 'Beautiful,' you called it. 'Like a movie'. And then you have the gall to call out others for 'terrorism'. You're one of those sick *******s who stand at hilltops in Sderot and cheer every time a bomb is dropped. You're exactly the damaged sort of person that the IDF would cherish amongst their ranks.
    Palestine and Palestinians existed back then, whether you like that or not. They were Arabs who subscribed to varying beliefs. They existed back then, just as Lebanese and Jordanians and Syrians exist today (from the Sham), just like Qataris and Emiratis and Saudis and Kuwaitis exist today ('Gulf' Arabs), just like Algerians, Moroccans and Tunisians (from North Africa) exist today. And Palestine was not a swampland either, no matter how much you would like to believe your colonial comrades' racist, derogatory and offensive claims affirming otherwise. And Israel has no cultural right to hummus, kunafah, falafel, or indeed the land it currently stands on.
    Yes, Arabs blame the West for their sorry state today, and rightly. Their governments are oppressive puppet governments instated by the West for the benefit of the West; if the governments go against the West the countries are reduced to shambles as we have seen in Afghanistan and Iraq. Arabs, like Israelis, are brainwashed from the cradle to value nationalism above all, and they are not free to think for themselves; they can only break away from the constraints of their stifling society with much difficulty, and most of them die never having been so fortunate as to do even that. They are neither here nor there, i.e. neither 'terrorists' nor 'whites'. They try so hard to be 'human', like the 'whites'. They are to be pitied and helped, not derided. Very much like Israelis. The current world order is to the advantage of the West. Only a deluded, uneducated person would think otherwise.

    Your post consists of the propaganda you are so fond of, the propaganda you think equals an education. Won't bother attempting to knock sense into your head.
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    I have some magic beans for sale :rolleyes: please PM me if you believe this
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    (Original post by Pinzgauer)
    Because they're an offshoot of the Muslim Brotherhood which was founded some 3 decades before Israel's reestablishment.

    They have the same ideology as the other Islamic gangs roaming the middle east. They can't all be poor, oppressed victims. :rolleyes:
    If my land was occupied and I was forced from my home along with my family decades ago I would be aggrieved and would fight back. Zionism is the evil and I don't blame anyone for feeling aggrieved with the situation.
 
 
 
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