The Alternative Economics League Table (TAELT) 2009 Watch

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hamzab
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#361
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
I have not thought about it much yet. But AAB.2.1 (not ABB.2.1) would seem likely.
Hey Paul,

Just a quick question, what are your opinion on University of Surrey? Also, it doesnt score to well in TAELT, comes 35th, but, in papers it is like 20th for Economics?

However, as an aside, even though it isnt considered a Top Uni, how come it has brilliant graduate prospectus for its Eco grads? Ive searched their graduate first destinations, quite a few get into Investment Banking, accountancty, management and even the Bank of England and HMRC as Economists.

So based on all that would you still consider it to be bad for Eco? In my opinion its due to the low grade boundaries, as in ABB-BBB, but Im after your opinion here

Thanks! HamzaB
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Paulwhy
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(Original post by hamzab)
Hey Paul,

Just a quick question, what are your opinion on University of Surrey? Also, it doesnt score to well in TAELT, comes 35th, but, in papers it is like 20th for Economics?

However, as an aside, even though it isnt considered a Top Uni, how come it has brilliant graduate prospectus for its Eco grads? Ive searched their graduate first destinations, quite a few get into Investment Banking, accountancty, management and even the Bank of England and HMRC as Economists.

So based on all that would you still consider it to be bad for Eco? In my opinion its due to the low grade boundaries, as in ABB-BBB, but Im after your opinion here

Thanks! HamzaB
Where did you get the data from on Surrey Economics graduates job prospects?
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abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
Where did you get the data from on Surrey Economics graduates job prospects?
Ive searched their graduate first destinations
:P
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abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
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(Original post by hamzab)
Hey Paul,

Just a quick question, what are your opinion on University of Surrey? Also, it doesnt score to well in TAELT, comes 35th, but, in papers it is like 20th for Economics?

However, as an aside, even though it isnt considered a Top Uni, how come it has brilliant graduate prospectus for its Eco grads? Ive searched their graduate first destinations, quite a few get into Investment Banking, accountancty, management and even the Bank of England and HMRC as Economists.

So based on all that would you still consider it to be bad for Eco? In my opinion its due to the low grade boundaries, as in ABB-BBB, but Im after your opinion here

Thanks! HamzaB
they have a really strong careers department is why people make it
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hamzab
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
Where did you get the data from on Surrey Economics graduates job prospects?
Errr.. 2 - 3 places really.

Firstly, went on their website and checked their "Graduate First Destinations" bit and thats got a list of all the Jobs they go into

Secondly, I asked a few people on here that go to Surrey about Graduate Jobs, they said the same things and that as Surrey do placement year, they got some top placements, e.g GES, JPMorgan and BarCAP summer placement I think

Thirdly, I kinda done some "ringing up" so its kind of the same thing as the first point I made as Im sure the Uni are using the same stats as the ones on the website. Im trying to get through to some Economics lecturers but there always busy so might email
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Paulwhy
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(Original post by hamzab)
Errr.. 2 - 3 places really.

Firstly, went on their website and checked their "Graduate First Destinations" bit and thats got a list of all the Jobs they go into
Do you mean here?
http://www.surrey.ac.uk/undergraduat...economics/jobs
Because they have just listed a few examples. And given that they have maybe 100-150 students per year being able to give a few examples of successes is not significant.

(Original post by hamzab)
Secondly, I asked a few people on here that go to Surrey about Graduate Jobs, they said the same things and that as Surrey do placement year, they got some top placements, e.g GES, JPMorgan and BarCAP summer placement I think
Again there being some good placements may not be that significant.

(Original post by hamzab)
Thirdly, I kinda done some "ringing up" so its kind of the same thing as the first point I made as Im sure the Uni are using the same stats as the ones on the website. Im trying to get through to some Economics lecturers but there always busy so might email
Grad job stats always seem to vary a lot between source, For example with Surrey Times has 83% (10th highest ) but unistats has only 65% with a grad Job (36th). (although unistats has a total of 90% in all jobs/further studies) Looking at the detailed unistats data only 45% of their econ graduates are in the 2 most popular categories for econ graduates at top unis:
Business and finance associate professionals 30%
Business and statistical professionals 15%

So the picture is a little unclear.

http://extras.timesonline.co.uk/tol_...ject=ECONOMICS
http://www.unistats.com
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hamzab
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
Do you mean here?
http://www.surrey.ac.uk/undergraduat...economics/jobs
Because they have just listed a few examples. And given that they have maybe 100-150 students per year being able to give a few examples of successes is not significant.


Again there being some good placements may not be that significant.



Grad job stats always seem to vary a lot between source, For example with Surrey Times has 83% (10th highest ) but unistats has only 65% with a grad Job (36th). (although unistats has a total of 90% in all jobs/further studies) Looking at the detailed unistats data only 45% of their econ graduates are in the 2 most popular categories for econ graduates at top unis:
Business and finance associate professionals 30%
Business and statistical professionals 15%

So the picture is a little unclear.

http://extras.timesonline.co.uk/tol_...ject=ECONOMICS
http://www.unistats.com
Your right, theres always fluctuations between different sources, but what would you trust?

Although 65% isnt that bad for a Uni ranked in the late 20s/early 30s Is it? And the Times has it at tenth for Economics as you said

But what would you rate better out of City/Queen Mary/Surrey/Reading. I prefer City and Surrey more as they offer the placement year, which, in my opinion, boosts employment by a lot, but I may be wrong so please tell me

Nevertheless, I plan do to a masters anyway, which should help in terms of employability, but while im on that topic, how comes you done a Diploma? I thought to do MSc Econ you need a quantative degree? I HAVE to do the Diploma first as even If I get a 1.1 I know the maths will be beyond me at top level institutions so Im simply wanting to make my life a bit easier, even it means another year and more money. Luckily, Financially Im not that bad, Ill be around 10K more in debt (I hope to make around 16 - 20k in a placement year so Ill have to fork out 10k for a Masters which is around 30k, expensive!)

Cheers Paul

EDIT: The First Destinations for Uni of Surrey is this page, it shows the full details of all of their graduates and where they go:

http://www2.surrey.ac.uk/undergradua...WNEXT07_v2.pdf
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Paulwhy
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#368
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Updated Liverpool entry to reflect preference for AS-level Maths grade b
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rnshan
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#369
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Avg salary is 26K - isn't that not so good ? :o:
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abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
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(Original post by rnshan)
Avg salary is 26K - isn't that not so good ? :o:
that's higher than average for grad jobs ...
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rnshan
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(Original post by abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz)
that's higher than average for grad jobs ...
Wrongly or rightly - I thought Economist earned more then that. Hmm I need to bring down my expectations.
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abcdefghijklmnopqrstuvwxyz
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(Original post by rnshan)
Wrongly or rightly - I thought Economist earned more then that. Hmm I need to bring down my expectations.
average UK grad is around the 21 area. Economists have an average of 25 i think and upwards to 30 in IB. So yea, lower your expectations unless you're going to a good uni
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hamzab
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Average is 28k which is by no means low.

What are you guys aiming for? 35K straight after graduating???
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.ACS.
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There's nothing wrong with £25k to £30k just after graduating. It's far more than most would get. Especially if you're talking just after a bachelors.
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Paulwhy
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(Original post by hamzab)
Your right, theres always fluctuations between different sources, but what would you trust?
EDIT: The First Destinations for Uni of Surrey is this page, it shows the full details of all of their graduates and where they go:

http://www2.surrey.ac.uk/undergradua...WNEXT07_v2.pdf
Great detailed data. Not an expert on what the official grad job classification is. But I think atleast 3 jobs are not grad jobs (Somerfield, Chef and Telephone Interviewer). Need to add in the further study people. So that makes 32-3+5=34. Which is 34/53= 64%. So I think unistats (65%) rather than Times (83%) is a better reflection of grads job situation.

(Original post by hamzab)
Although 65% isnt that bad for a Uni ranked in the late 20s/early 30s Is it? And the Times has it at tenth for Economics as you said

But what would you rate better out of City/Queen Mary/Surrey/Reading. I prefer City and Surrey more as they offer the placement year, which, in my opinion, boosts employment by a lot, but I may be wrong so please tell me
I can see that a year of experience could be a boast (c.f. summer placements) when you are a at a mid-table uni. But one point of caution is will there be 1 year placements out there for you to find in the current financial climate?

(Original post by hamzab)
Nevertheless, I plan do to a masters anyway, which should help in terms of employability, but while im on that topic, how comes you done a Diploma? I thought to do MSc Econ you need a quantative degree? I HAVE to do the Diploma first as even If I get a 1.1 I know the maths will be beyond me at top level institutions so Im simply wanting to make my life a bit easier, even it means another year and more money. Luckily, Financially Im not that bad, Ill be around 10K more in debt (I hope to make around 16 - 20k in a placement year so Ill have to fork out 10k for a Masters which is around 30k, expensive!)
I did a diploma as I had done maths not econ at undergraduate. So did diploma to get econ experience. I know what you mean about mid uni prep not being the greatest for an msc at a top uni. But the gain from doing another year doing a diploma is probably not worth the cost (about 15K = 6K course cost + 9K living costs).
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hamzab
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
Great detailed data. Not an expert on what the official grad job classification is. But I think atleast 3 jobs are not grad jobs (Somerfield, Chef and Telephone Interviewer). Need to add in the further study people. So that makes 32-3+5=34. Which is 34/53= 64%. So I think unistats (65%) rather than Times (83%) is a better reflection of grads job situation.
Yes your right, UniStats seems better in determining overall percentage, but when you take into account only 52% got a First or Upper second class honours degree, it actually is quite good, but then again I could be wrong.


(Original post by Paulwhy)
I can see that a year of experience could be a boast (c.f. summer placements) when you are a at a mid-table uni. But one point of caution is will there be 1 year placements out there for you to find in the current financial climate?
I reckon there should be, Im currently in first year 6th form, so in about 3 years time, the market should have picked up again, I forsee it to be in around 12 - 18 months time If we go by Economics teachers' prediciton. But then again, he could be wrong. How long do you think it should be when the Markets start to see some "boom" again?


(Original post by Paulwhy)
I did a diploma as I had done maths not econ at undergraduate. So did diploma to get econ experience. I know what you mean about mid uni prep not being the greatest for an msc at a top uni. But the gain from doing another year doing a diploma is probably not worth the cost (about 15K = 6K course cost + 9K living costs).
I think Im going to be needing to a Diploma/MSc anyway, as I hopefully want to be an Economist. I know you dont always need it, but In my opinion, everyone is getting a bachelors these days, so you need to sort of "distingush yourself" from others by doing a masters. After an Economist I might have a little stint at Banking and Consultancy positions, but after that, I want to go in to teaching/lecturing so PHD is a must, so either I do the MSc then with PHD or get it done earlier whilst Im still young and not bald :p:

Also, may I ask how you worked out 9K living costs? Your right in the course costs for Warwick i think but Ill now tell you the LSE costs

UoL/LSE Diploma Economics - 4K
LSE MSc Economics 18K
Living costs (will be at home in London (yes I know still living with parents but I simply cant afford it) so wont be that high, Im taking into consideration the travel costs) - 3K

So all in all 25K, I hopefully will make around anywhere between 16 - 25K in my placement year and I will put that away till masters

However, i could also do the UoL/LSE diploma and do the MSc Econ at UCL which is slightly easier to get into then LSE (In terms of less competition per place) and much cheaper, at around 10K! But it is my understaning that the main problems are financial and learning differences, luckily enough, financial isnt that bad and the Diploma seems a good option first, as Id rather spend 4K first rather then going straight into a MSc Econ and realising its to hard and thus failing

However, just a quick question. If I did the Masters at Warwick, would there be a massive difference in Job Prospects to LSE/UCL. Im asking as Ive always wanted to go to Warwick, it was my first Uni experience, I went there for 4 years from years to 8 - 11 doing a NAGTY course there
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Paulwhy
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Added in a health warning for 2010 applicants.
Firstly a 'warning' for applicants looking to use TAELT 2009 to make econ application decisions for the 2009/2010 cycle. The data here at the moment will need updating before then. This will reflect:
i)Unis changing their typical offers. Although some unis have announced 2010 typical offers many have not. Further even when the official typical offers first appear on UCAS Course Search 2010 in the summer they may not be the
same as the typical offers that admissions tutors use when Autumn comes round. So please please both check UCAS and uni websites and re-check TAELT before applying.
ii)Information gained from Results Day. This will reflect both clearing and Adjustment. i.e. there may be movements between groups.

So if you are a 2010 applicant please use TAELT 2009 and also please re-check the admissions situation before applying.
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richard1991
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9) Bath AAB M** E**p 441
Just to let you know PaulWhy, Bath upping their typical offer to AAA/AAB in 2010.
http://www.bath.ac.uk/prospectus/und.../course/HUG-D1
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Paulwhy
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(Original post by richard1991)
Just to let you know PaulWhy, Bath upping their typical offer to AAA/AAB in 2010.
http://www.bath.ac.uk/prospectus/und.../course/HUG-D1
updated:
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henrykravis
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(Original post by Paulwhy)
Yes, I also like it.

Adding in the Tariff points shows the kind of applicants who are getting the offers.
e.g. Edinburgh BBB used to send out one message
Now Edinburgh BBB M*p 442 sends out another.

hey paul.are you paul youdell? :P
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