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    Hamas terrorists steal food from Gazans


    In recent days, Hamas members seized UN food coupons and prevented Gazan civilians from receiving the aid, in order to try and keep field cell members fed. The Islamist regime refuses to publish most of the names of its members who were killed fighting the IDF, and disposes of their bodies quickly, to avoid harming morale. It has tried to ban Gazan civilians from giving interviews to the foreign press during humanitarian truces
    http://www.jpost.com/Operation-Prote...in-Gaza-369501
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    (Original post by skd1996)
    What is moral about bombing schools where there are innocent people, including children.
    They only bomb civilian buildings if Hamas are hiding weapons inside them.
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    (Original post by TheTechN1304)
    You do realise that the Arabs invaded the land in 635CE, and it was in fact the jews who were 'forced from their homes along with their families'.
    Source please? And no, biblical scriptures are not an acceptable source at all. Please put forward some strong factual evidence to back up those claims.
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    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    thats true, but then you do have to implicitly support terrorist groups and islamist agendas,
    Supporting Gaza =/= Supporting HAMAS.

    which the majority of the civilised world refuses to do.
    Yet, according to your reasoning, "the majority of the civilised world" are actually funding the Islamists.

    America is sending $47 million
    The UK is sending around £10 million
    France pledged around 11 million Euros

    Hell, even Scotland is sending £500,000
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    No one is talking about "setting borders". ?
    setting the borders was part of establishing israel as a state


    (Original post by tsr1269)
    We are talking about the mass immigration, illegal one at that and not to mention the terrorism, which preceded the creation of the State of Israel.

    I put it to you, do you deny that there was mass illegal immigration to Mandatory Palestine and that Jewish groups carried out terrorist atrocities during that period? ?

    i dont know what you are bleating about it being 'illegal' :dontknow: if immigration occurred, it did some involving jews and also arabs in the same way, and while under british control, so if anyone was going to stop it or complain, it should be them - i dont see what your problem is

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    So to clarify and confirm:

    You are saying that there was no terrorism perpetrated by adherents to the Jewish faith prior to the creation of Israel? ?


    difficult to say, if there was id be against it too, but that had nothing to do with the formation of israeli state- which was granted to them by the incumbant ruler ( britain) . the arabs too committed waht youd describe as terrorism and indeed murder of civilians in this time too. the british quickly realised these people could not be trusted to live peacefully in mixed secular societies, andso allowed both to have their own religious staes with iconic holy cities - the arabs Mecca and the jews jerusalem - i think ive repeated this fact to you 10 times now

    again whats your problem here exactly?

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    I'm now questioning your integrity.

    Why did you post that incomprehensible sentence, alluding it to my post, and then respond to it?
    becuase you claimed groups that emigrated to an area then caused problems and demanded their own religious state was what israel have done. i pointed out to you that islamists are doing that all around the globe - so therefore perhaps we should deal with the global islamist problem before the localised palestinian one.

    its not as complex as you are trying to make out.
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    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    thats true, but then you do have to implicitly support terrorist groups and islamist agendas, which the majority of the civilised world refuses to do.
    this is essentially international poltics and trade, nothing to do with compassion. usa sides with israel, bolivia etc side with saudi arabia and other arab states

    if you are trygin to make a humanitarian argument, then you need to ignore politics and look at morality - ie the morality of ignoreing much bigger casualities in iraq at the hands of ISIS - is that showing ' Courage and compassion' or simply towing the islamist agenda?
    Please dont lecture me about it. Blowing up innocent women and children taking shelter in UN schools is not self defence! There were no "terrorist groups" in that school for God's sake! The Israelis are committing mass murder and yet the Western leaders shrugging their shoulders. They even showed their hypocricy to support only Iraqi Christains who fled their homes because of terrorist ISIS. Why on earth didnot show support to others in Gaza, Syria or even to non Christains Iraq who also face danger!
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    (Original post by tsr1269)
    Supporting Gaza =/= Supporting HAMAS.
    im afraid it does seeing as you pointed out, the gazans accepted in the islamists to run gaza in their 'election'

    (Original post by tsr1269)
    Yet, according to your reasoning, "the majority of the civilised world" are actually funding the Islamists.

    America is sending $47 million
    The UK is sending around £10 million
    France pledged around 11 million Euros

    Hell, even Scotland is sending £500,000
    this is humanitarian aid - the west has sent money to libya, iraq, afganistan, sudan, pakistan - you see unlike islamic countries the west can send aid without any agenda behind it, if it is to help civilians - and even if they still regard hamas as terrorists ( which they all do)
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    (Original post by TheMoho)
    Somewhere which doesn't require a war and the death of thousands of people to live in. I don't know. Don't ask me.
    So you dont know? You cant even suggest a place, but youre still blabbering on about the fact that you want them to leave.
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    (Original post by Inzamam99)
    Israel started this latest round of hostilities not Hamas.
    Eh no. Peace talks broke down, then three israeli teenagers were kidnapped and murdered, believed to be by two Hamas operatives - it all escalated from there. So, Hamas started it. Or if you prefer to look at it from Operation Protective Edge, that was in response to increased rocket fire from Hamas.
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    (Original post by Fraseer)
    They only bomb civilian buildings if Hamas are hiding weapons inside them.
    So what if there are weapons inside them, there are also innocent civilians inside them too!


    (Original post by Sic semper erat)
    Who cares. They started it. Nothing that's going on in the Middle East, Ukraine, Africa and elsewhere is moral, in fact, other conflicts are 1000 times worse. I despise people who speak of "morality" when their agenda (whether they realize it or not) is 100% political

    You live in a bubble if you think people outside the UK and Scandinavian countries give a crap. Not everyone is surrounded by a left wing government and media alongside a large muslim population that spews pro palestinian garbage and makes society live on emotion rather than facts. Trust me when I say its only the British and the large number of muslims in Europe that are barking over this. Support for Israel in the US is higher than ever (according to polls) and most Americans blame Hamas for this war. Canada is too a big supporter of Israel.
    The view that "they started it" is extremely childish over such a serious matter. Peoples lives are being lost. It doesn't matter who started it, what matters is that innocent civilians are being killed due to the fact that two sides are both fighting purely for political reasons.

    I don't live in a bubble, because I do not think that many people 'give a crap'. I especially agree with your point that the US blame Hamas and support Israel. I have seen some shocking clips of Fox news coverage of the conflict, and it actually angers me to listen to how biased the news reports and "debates" are. In my opinion, Israel should not be getting any outside support. However, one opinion of one girl is not going to even be a minute blip on anything.
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    (Original post by Syrian Guy)
    Please dont lecture me about it. Blowing up innocent women and children taking shelter in UN schools is not self defence! There were no "terrorist groups" in that school for God's sake! !
    but hamas did hide their rockets in various UN schools as the UN stated itself - so that kind of knocks over your argument there. i dont agree with bombing schools by either hamas or israel - but i see that if a terrorist group launches its attacks form behind human shields in gaza, this is almost inevitable. Hamas are fully aware of the consequence of their actions and frankly they dont give two hoots about muslim lives.


    (Original post by Syrian Guy)
    The Israelis are committing mass murder and yet the Western leaders shrugging their shoulders. They even showed their hypocricy to support only Iraqi Christains who fled their homes because of terrorist ISIS well actually west are helping against ISIS ( perhaps not as much as they should) my point wasnt about the west but hypocrite islamists and also pro palestinains to ignore the attrocities caused by ISIS which are much higher numbers than in palestine - any actual answer to this point??

    Why on earth didnot show support to others in Gaza, Syria or even to non Christains Iraq who also face danger!
    becuase both ISIS and Hamas are islamist terrosits, and the world cannot support terrorists or islamists, it must unite against them
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    (Original post by skd1996)
    What is moral about bombing schools where there are innocent people, including children.
    As much as bombing schools is wrong, even the UN admits that Hamas hide their rockets in schools

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...0FV04A20140730

    You can come out with the bleeding heart crap all you want, the truth is that Hamas' actions have deliberately lead to this. You simply can't blame Israel for this.
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    (Original post by Syrian Guy)
    Why dont we say Israel is a cancer to Gazan society? Aren't they the ones who had been killing the Palestinians for a very long time. Aren't they the ones who use Palestians children as human shiel

    I saw the link. It appears that the culprits were prosecuted. Obviously, this is unacceptable by law. They broke the law, they were punished. Who was punished for the death of the three Israeli children? Did they ever catch those responsible?


    Dont you know that:

    1. Gaza was invaded by Israel in 1967 & ever since then Israel is illegally occupying the whole of Gaza strip

    Israelis left Gaza in 2007. Jews were forced out of their homes in the settlements to please Gazans. The result was Hamas got cocky. We all know what happens when these extremists get their way.


    2. Gaza is surrounded on three sides by Israel blocked all these three sides by Israeli army & navy & one side by Egypt where the Egyptian army along with Israeli & UN observers & monitors blocks the entry of any body from Gaza.So Gaza is literally huge prison where not even a bird can enter without Israel’s permission.


    3. Gaza has no sea port or airport or even a train station.

    4. Gaza residents cannot leave Gaza as they don’t even have passports. Plus there are Israeli checkpoints in every place. Also no one from any country can enter Gaza without Israel’s permission which is impossible to get , forget about ordinary man even the top politicians of powerful countries had been denied entry in Gaza by Israel. Gaza is a place which is totally cutoff from the rest of the world.

    So were other places/ countries with undetermined state status in the past. You need to have diplomatic relations with countries to be able to enter/ exit.


    5. Each and every daily use commodities comes through these Israeli check points. Even the milk, wheat medicines all items come through these Israeli check points. Israel charge taxes on all the items witch goes through these check points

    That's because they have to make sure they're not smuggling in weapons or bombs to aid the Hamas cause. C'mon, even ambulances have been used for storing bombs, for instance! They're shooting themselves in the foot by acting this way.

    Also, why does everyone insist that Gaza has always been this impoverished ****hole?







    6. Gaza is like a big jail. It is entire country under seize. Even inside Gaza Israel have several check posts at important junctions. The Israeli army harasses and humiliates Gaza citizens every day as the Gaza citizens cross these check posts.

    I need a reliable source backing this up. Since 2007, there have been NO ISRAELIS in Gaza. Yes, there is a blockade, but Gaza is not occupied by Israelis. They didn't want any. Heck, if they saw one, no matter how peaceful, they'd probably shoot him on the spot.


    7. The UN has urged Israel numerous times to remove this illegal seizure of Gaza but Israel never listen to UN . More then 50 resolutions have been passed by UN against Israel but with USA always on its side so Israel just doesn’t care.

    Also, the UN is slowly turning into the new League of Nations. But really, that's a topic for another discussion. The UN can only condemn, but that's the extent of its 'powers'. It also condemned the placement of rockets in UN schools in Gaza, for instance. That doesn't mean that this didn't occur a second, and then a third time in the space of the two weeks after the condemnation.

    This is in relation to this conflict, by the way. The thing is, when you place your weapons in civilian places such as UN schools, you're effectively using human shields. That's what human shields are- hoping no one will bomb the place because it's civilian. It's a dangerous game.



    8. The food and essentials are always in short supply in Gaza as Israel delays, discourages and harass its imports in Gaza. Shops don’t have enough rations, hospitals don’t have enough and essential medicines. Power is in short supply, petrol and gas is in shortage too. The inflation is highest in the world in Gaza as a result of it. The poverty is rising at the highest rate also. The Gaza children’s are among the worst malnutrition children now

    See above.

    Not to mention, the acting government Hamas, receives millions in foreign aid from countries such as the UAE, Qatar and Saudi.

    Only recently, Sheikh Khalifa sent 25 million US dollars in aid to Gaza.

    Not to mention all of their 'private donors'.

    Also, I recently saw a TV segment, something I'm sure you've heard of, of Top Hamas Leaders stealing funds.

    Maybe if Hamas stopped digging tunnels and stealing money, Gaza might have less malnourished kids, this is just a thought.

    9. There are no specialized doctors or equipments to treat the serious injury or disease in any hospitals. Every now and then Israeli army bomb Gaza and the innocent civilians get hurt during bombing. These wounded civilians plead and beg in the check points to let them out for treatment but they kind Israeli army never let them. So the wounds which could have been treated become more severe and often the wounded becomes handicapped for the rest of their lives.

    The Israeli never let them? Source, please? Also, technically the Israeli shouldn't have to let them, the Gazans wanted all the Israeli out, why should the Israeli welcome the Gazans in? Can't have your cake and eat it, Gaza.


    10. Once a thriving society and rich people now have become beggars & prisoners in their own country.Can you imagine the trauma the humiliation the harassment the pain in the hearts of these people who have been invaded and made prisoners and slaves in their own country?

    ​When was Gaza a thriving society? Under the Ottomans?

    They have been struggling for their independence since almost 50 years now. With each passing day Israel is constructing new settlements for its Israeli citizens in their land. With each passing day their hope of independence, a hope to live a normal life like any other human is fading away. Every night they sleep in pain and every morning they wake up with sorrows.

    You're confusing Gaza with the West Bank. The settlements is not something I agree with, either.

    In the pretext of peace talks Israel actually is delaying their independence to capture more and more of their land everyday by constructing new Israeli homes and settlements.

    NO SETTLEMENTS in Gaza. Gaza has no Israelis since 2007.


    The Palestinians know this and they are watching it helplessly. Just like a goat watch the lion eats its children but can do nothing. They are shedding tears of blood. With Israeli soldiers harassing them , cursing them, abusing them mocking them, hurting them , killing them everyday in their very own land, all Palestinians can do is watch and cry.

    What suggestions do you have now? The western paid media is making & broadcasting news in such a manner that one should feel as if Gaza residence are the one who are occupying Israel and Israel is fighting for the freedom of its citizen. So that people can only curse and blame Gaza residents. Can you try to feel their misery and helplessness? We can not even imagine spending even one day in the jail called Gaza and they are living there everyday..... Wake up man! Stand up for them for the sake of humanity.
    You know, I don't agree with a lot of what is going on in Israel and Palestine. But, as I read in an article recently, when you've raised two generations to hate each other, you will have awful atrocities.

    The way to peace is not extreme islam, neither is it extreme zionism. While we have Hamas in Gaza, there will never be peace. Terrorism will escalate, Israel will respond to this.

    I don't know that there can ever be peace, I don't know if a two state solution would work, simply because if it could have worked it would have worked under the partition plan. With my knowledge of the conflict, there will never be peace between these two groups. Ever.

    But again, Hamas is not the answer. It can't achieve much. Why do you think Hamas fires rockets into Israel when they will likely be intercepted by the Iron Dome and won't do much harm? It feels like they're trying to provoke Israel, and Israel is responding. But it's stupid. Hamas is playing with Palestinian blood, like it's nothing to them.

    There need to be calm, rational people on both sides. Not terrorists, not extremists, and not Hamas which calls for the destruction of Israel. How can Israel ever negotiate with a government that calls for its destruction through means of jihad?
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    (Original post by Sic semper erat)
    Who cares. They started it. Nothing that's going on in the Middle East, Ukraine, Africa and elsewhere is moral, in fact, other conflicts are 1000 times worse. I despise people who speak of "morality" when their agenda (whether they realize it or not) is 100% political

    You live in a bubble if you think people outside the UK and Scandinavian countries give a crap. Not everyone is surrounded by a left wing government and media alongside a large muslim population that spews pro palestinian garbage and makes society live on emotion rather than facts. Trust me when I say its only the British and the large number of muslims in Europe that are barking over this. Support for Israel in the US is higher than ever (according to polls) and most Americans blame Hamas for this war. Canada is too a big supporter of Israel.
    You mean the people that illegitimately took over Palestinians' land and have been oppressing them and denying them basic freedoms ever since, started it. Try and be factually correct sweetheart
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    (Original post by skd1996)
    So what if there are weapons inside them, there are also innocent civilians inside them too!




    The view that "they started it" is extremely childish over such a serious matter. Peoples lives are being lost. It doesn't matter who started it, what matters is that innocent civilians are being killed due to the fact that two sides are both fighting purely for political reasons.

    I don't live in a bubble, because I do not think that many people 'give a crap'. I especially agree with your point that the US blame Hamas and support Israel. I have seen some shocking clips of Fox news coverage of the conflict, and it actually angers me to listen to how biased the news reports and "debates" are. In my opinion, Israel should not be getting any outside support. However, one opinion of one girl is not going to even be a minute blip on anything.
    and what do you suppose are the purpose of these rockets? To take life obviously. :dunce:
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    (Original post by Reptilian)
    Let's first define terrorism:

    Terrorism: using violence or means of terror in order to obtain political obiectives.

    Israel has time and time again used violence to get it wants and I'm pretty sure no one disagrees with me that being a Gazan must be terrifying to a level none of us will experience. Therefore, Israel is also a terrorist state but that doesn't matter to you because the word 'terrorist' can only apply to Muslims and its meaning is irrelevant.

    Hamas is classed as a terrorist group because it is against Israel and because the Western big shots like America and the UK support it regardless of its actions. Now tell me why Hamas is a terrorist entity and Israel isn't?

    Oh yeah, maybe because in your mind terrorists can only be brown people who kill white people, right?

    Oh and, one side, some of Hamas, speak of wishing to destroy Israel while the other side, Israel is actively destroying the Palestinian people in Gaza. I think I know which side is more condemnable. Israel has a long history of carrying out false flag operations, I wouldn't be surprised if it was behind at least some of those rocket attacks on Israel.


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    Jews aren't any more or less white than Palestinians. They are both semitic
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    (Original post by yo radical one)
    As much as bombing schools is wrong even the UN admits that Hamas hide their rockets in schools

    http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/...0FV04A20140730

    You can come out with the bleeding heart crap all you want, the truth is that Hamas' actions have deliberately lead to this
    It's not bleeding heart crap. People are dying. Innocent lives are being lost. And it is not just the actions of Hamas, it is also the actions of Israel.

    There is a massive difference between the bombing of Gaza and the bombing of Israel, and a lot of people seem to forget this. Israel has support from the US, it has a giant army, is more developed and receives military equipment as aid. It can afford domes and shelters to protect it's civilians.
    Gaza is a small strip of land. It's lacking many resources, including an army or military equipment due to the blockade that Israel put on it. Therefore, it cannot protect itself from Israeli attacks, it only has Hamas (which yes, is a terror organisation) It does not have iron domes or shelters, and Israel know this- yet continue to bomb schools and residential areas?

    Hamas are a terror organisation. However aren't Israel doing the same thing? They are using violence and intimidation to reach their political goals. This is also terrorism. Yet no-one is preventing it.
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    (Original post by Sic semper erat)
    That's your version of history. Real history shows this as a regional Arab-Israeli conflict (some of the wars were in a sense part of the Cold War), rather than a narrow Israeli-Palestinian thats something very recent.


    Seems Jews and Palestinians were coexisting in peace and freedom, then Israel came along. Such is life when you have the backing of Western hotshot nations
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    (Original post by skd1996)
    It's not bleeding heart crap. People are dying. Innocent lives are being lost. And it is not just the actions of Hamas, it is also the actions of Israel.

    There is a massive difference between the bombing of Gaza and the bombing of Israel, and a lot of people seem to forget this. Israel has support from the US, it has a giant army, is more developed and receives military equipment as aid. It can afford domes and shelters to protect it's civilians.
    Gaza is a small strip of land. It's lacking many resources, including an army or military equipment due to the blockade that Israel put on it. Therefore, it cannot protect itself from Israeli attacks, it only has Hamas (which yes, is a terror organisation) It does not have iron domes or shelters, and Israel know this- yet continue to bomb schools and residential areas?

    Hamas are a terror organisation. However aren't Israel doing the same thing? They are using violence and intimidation to reach their political goals. This is also terrorism. Yet no-one is preventing it.
    Israel's goal is to disarm Hamas, which is a perfectly legitimate goal since as you say they are a terrorist organisation

    This is exactly why it is bleeding heart crap, you think that because Israel is stronger, it should have no right to defend itself. If an old person tried to attack an MMA fighter, I would say the MMA fighter should still be within his rights to smash that old biddie up
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    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    setting the borders was part of establishing israel as a state
    Which only came about as a result of mass illegal immigration and terrorism, no?

    i dont know what you are bleating about it being 'illegal' :dontknow: if immigration occurred, it did some involving jews and also arabs in the same way, and while under british control, so if anyone was going to stop it or complain, it should be them - i dont see what your problem is
    Do you consider "illegal immigration" to be illegal or legal?

    difficult to say, if there was id be against it too, but that had nothing to do with the formation of israeli state- which was granted to them by the incumbant ruler ( britain) . the arabs too committed waht youd describe as terrorism and indeed murder of civilians in this time too. the british quickly realised these people could not be trusted to live peacefully in mixed secular societies, andso allowed both to have their own religious staes with iconic holy cities - the arabs Mecca and the jews jerusalem - i think ive repeated this fact to you 10 times now

    again whats your problem here exactly?
    Without resorting to whataboutery, can you clarify and confirm if there was terrorist attacks perpetrated by members of the Jewish faith prior to the creation of the State of Israel?

    becuase you claimed groups that emigrated to an area then caused problems and demanded their own religious state was what israel have done. i pointed out to you that islamists are doing that all around the globe - so therefore perhaps we should deal with the global islamist problem before the localised palestinian one.

    its not as complex as you are trying to make out.
    Why did you try and make it seem as if I had posted what you had in fact posted?

    (Original post by Meenglishnogood)
    im afraid it does seeing as you pointed out, the gazans accepted in the islamists to run gaza in their 'election'
    Do you not understand the concept of a democracy?

    this is humanitarian aid - the west has sent money to libya, iraq, afganistan, sudan, pakistan - you see unlike islamic countries the west can send aid without any agenda behind it, if it is to help civilians - and even if they still regard hamas as terrorists ( which they all do)
    According to your reasoning, the "majority of the civilized world" are actually funding HAMAS.
 
 
 
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