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    going on like Nacho put in a Roberto Carlos performance :rofl:

    allow it.
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    (Original post by barneystin)
    going on like Nacho put in a Roberto Carlos performance :rofl:

    allow it.
    Nacho doesn't have the quality to be Arsenals first choice.. Ever. But I don't understand why there's so much hate for him? He's not a bad player, he does what he's required to do and what more do you expect from a 2nd LB?

    Nacho is a blessing considering we had man like Santos before lol

    Also - Gibbs is injured ffs
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    (Original post by SHOO)
    Nacho doesn't have the quality to be Arsenals first choice.. Ever. But I don't understand why there's so much hate for him? He's not a bad player, he does what he's required to do and what more do you expect from a 2nd LB?

    Nacho is a blessing considering we had man like Santos before lol

    Also - Gibbs is injured ffs
    im just saying the praise he was getting was a bit unwarranted.

    he was competent yesterday. do people really get praise for being competent? congratulations on doing what you were supposed to do?

    There's no hate there, but im not gunna praise him for being competent. if and when he puts in a performance like Zabaleta then he should get praise; but just for going out there and doing what you're supposed to? No.
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    (Original post by barneystin)
    im just saying the praise he was getting was a bit unwarranted.

    he was competent yesterday. do people really get praise for being competent? congratulations on doing what you were supposed to do?

    There's no hate there, but im not gunna praise him for being competent. if and when he puts in a performance like Zabaleta then he should get praise; but just for going out there and doing what you're supposed to? No.
    Nah I wasn't referring to any hatred from you, and I wasn't referring to yesterday's performance.

    Just in general, he gets a bit too much hate than be deserves

    We need to address the LB position though, Gibbs is too injury prone
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    (Original post by SHOO)
    Nacho doesn't have the quality to be Arsenals first choice.. Ever. But I don't understand why there's so much hate for him? He's not a bad player, he does what he's required to do and what more do you expect from a 2nd LB?

    Nacho is a blessing considering we had man like Santos before lol

    Also - Gibbs is injured ffs
    He was as bad as santos last season
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    (Original post by baconbutty)
    He was as bad as santos last season
    Nah that's pushing it. I watched every single game & trust me, compare that to santos' performances and no.. No where near as bad.

    Santos' form resembles Silvestre's when he was at Arsenal
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    (Original post by SHOO)
    Nah that's pushing it. I watched every single game & trust me, compare that to santos' performances and no.. No where near as bad.

    Santos' form resembles Silvestre's when he was at Arsenal
    Santos' was highlighted by the fact the defence and midfield were awful. Santos was good going forward as well they're both terrible defensively though
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    (Original post by baconbutty)
    Santos' was highlighted by the fact the defence and midfield were awful. Santos was good going forward as well they're both terrible defensively though
    I can remember a few goals being merely Santos' fault. Either being out of position (he was way too slow & unhealthy to track back when he pushed up) or just trying to skill his way out of trouble. Nacho is faster and compared to Santos he's more disciplined as a LB.

    Nacho is suited much better to the PL compared to Santos was..

    Not saying Nacho is a really good LB, just saying he's better than how Santos was for Arsenal
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    Nah i love GQ Ramsey chaps
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    http://matchstory.co.uk/2014fixtures/

    Interesting perspective on the fixture list.
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    (Original post by Thugnificent.)
    Nah i love GQ Ramsey chaps
    What about Jack? Because it appears all those that were on Aaron's back and now worship the ground he walks on have moved onto Jack (who was better then Aaron yesterday, he just stole the headlines because he got the goal)

    It's quite ridiculous, it's the first game of the season and you have numpties on twitter like Leon Knight, a terrible footballer may I am screaming about how Jack should be sold. We all know what JW10 is capable so I find it hard to know why so many are having conniptions about him now.


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    (Original post by Peggles_*)
    What about Jack? Because it appears all those that were on Aaron's back and now worship the ground he walks on have moved onto Jack (who was better then Aaron yesterday, he just stole the headlines because he got the goal)

    It's quite ridiculous, it's the first game of the season and you have numpties on twitter like Leon Knight, a terrible footballer may I am screaming about how Jack should be sold. We all know what JW10 is capable so I find it hard to know why so many are having conniptions about him now.


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    Impatient and clueless fans.

    I had an arguement on here a while ago about this - in terms of potential, Jack has always been so much more promising than Ramsey but for some reason people can't stand him any more.

    Same people that wanted Ramsey sold season before last and now are willing to bend over for him.

    When Wilshere's form improves (because his ability is there no doubt) then the same people will probably want Ox out LOL and the viscous cycle shall continue
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    (Original post by SHOO)
    Impatient and clueless fans.

    I had an arguement on here a while ago about this - in terms of potential, Jack has always been so much more promising than Ramsey but for some reason people can't stand him any more.

    Same people that wanted Ramsey sold season before last and now are willing to bend over for him.

    When Wilshere's form improves (because his ability is there no doubt) then the same people will probably want Ox out LOL and the viscous cycle shall continue
    the thing about wilshere is that he cant ****ing stay on his feet. he was down in 24 seconds against Palace from a tackle from Chamakh. He deserves 12 balance and strength on Fifa. Shame because his ball control, and agility should be 80+.

    Unless he learns to stay on his feet, how good can he actually be. It's like imagine having the best legal mind in the world but being dumb (unable to speak that is), it's gunna make you ineffective, despite having great ability.
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    (Original post by SHOO)
    Impatient and clueless fans.

    I had an arguement on here a while ago about this - in terms of potential, Jack has always been so much more promising than Ramsey but for some reason people can't stand him any more.
    Have to disagree, that was only the case after Ramsey got the injury for me.
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    (Original post by barneystin)
    the thing about wilshere is that he cant ****ing stay on his feet. he was down in 24 seconds against Palace from a tackle from Chamakh. He deserves 12 balance and strength on Fifa. Shame because his ball control, and agility should be 80+.

    Unless he learns to stay on his feet, how good can he actually be. It's like imagine having the best legal mind in the world but being dumb (unable to speak that is), it's gunna make you ineffective, despite having great ability.
    The is due to the way he plays. He released the ball at the last minute and when you have a big lump like Chamakh steaming in, someone of Jack's physique is liking to end up on the floor. If you want to stop Jack being on the floor, then you are going to have to change his game. That won't happen.

    A lot of the time Jack ends up on the floor it is because he has been fouled, teams still have that Big Sam/Pulis attitude of "they don't like it up em" which we don't. They will rough up the littlest one who in this case happens to be JW.


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    (Original post by Deshi)
    Have to disagree, that was only the case after Ramsey got the injury for me.
    Internally it was close. Jack was around the team in 09/10 and so was Aaron but Jack was the one who was sent out on loan whereas Aaron was deemed ready for the 1st team.


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    (Original post by Peggles_*)
    The is due to the way he plays. He released the ball at the last minute and when you have a big lump like Chamakh steaming in, someone of Jack's physique is liking to end up on the floor.

    A lot of the time Jack ends up on the floor it is because he has been fouled, teams still have that Big Sam/Pulis attitude of "they don't like it up em" which we don't. They will rough up the littlest one who in this case happens to be JW.


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    yes but that is the premier league. no, actually that is life. there is no need to play fair. it's a dog eat dog world, and if it means you have to play rough to get yours, people will do it. even if Chamakh didn't do it, there would be 100 people lining up to kick Wilshere for thousands of pounds a week, as it adds to their game when they have limited technical ability. in fact we have one on our very team- Flamini. there is no award for playing nice. there's no nice guys medal. there's win, lose or draw, and the implications have million pound implications on where a team finishes in the league.

    being little is no excuse for rolling around the floor grabbing your ankles for a good 10 minutes of every game. you dont see cazorla doing that. you dont see david silva doing that. you dont even see valbuena doing that.

    The bit in bold. so all you're saying is that wilshere will be perpetually ineffective, as I am saying.
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    Jack was ok tbh. I don't think anyone really stood out yesterday you have to remember it was a parked palace side who hardly put any consistent pressure on.
    Obviously Monreal would look ok but his cracks will start to appear once we're under more pressure and honestly I'm worried that we'd be using him for our CL qualifier game next week.
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    (Original post by Peggles_*)
    Internally it was close. Jack was around the team in 09/10 and so was Aaron but Jack was the one who was sent out on loan whereas Aaron was deemed ready for the 1st team.


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    Yeah think Ramsey was a marginally better prospect when he first came, nothing much in it though.

    Still waiting for Wilshere to replicate the ability he showed in the Barca game in 10/11 I think.
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    (Original post by barneystin)
    yes but that is the premier league. no, actually that is life. there is no need to play fair. it's a dog eat dog world, and if it means you have to play rough to get yours, people will do it. even if Chamakh didn't do it, there would be 100 people lining up to kick Wilshere for thousands of pounds a week, as it adds to their game when they have limited technical ability. in fact we have one on our very team- Flamini. there is no award for playing nice. there's no nice guys medal. there's win, lose or draw, and the implications have million pound implications on where a team finishes in the league.

    being little is no excuse for rolling around the floor grabbing your ankles for a good 10 minutes of every game. you dont see cazorla doing that. you dont see david silva doing that. you dont even see valbuena doing that.

    The bit in bold. so all you're saying is that wilshere will be perpetually ineffective, as I am saying.
    Personally, I think Jack needs a minder, like how Gretzky had one. He was the smallest and best technically but they rarely got near him without being slapped about a bit. Jack needs Someone who will look after him on the pitch whilst terrorising the opposition if they got near him. He had that at Bolton when he went on loan and some of their fans go as far as saying he helped they stay up.

    When Jack is on the floor, more often than not, he's actually been fouled, nothing wrong with that. Cazorla rarely gets clattered because him game is different to Jack. JW carries the ball almost overrunning it, it makes him more susceptible to being tackled and caught. Santi is much more calculated and more often than not, by the time a lump gets near him, the ball is long gone.

    All this new Jack hate is just unnecessary, first game of the season ffs.


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