What do you think about people who claim that Labour and the Tories are no different? Watch

Poll: What do you think?
I agree with those who claim that there isn't much difference between the two (38)
55.88%
People who claim that the two are practically the same are ignorant (29)
42.65%
Don't know (1)
1.47%
spaztasticmania
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#21
Report 9 years ago
#21
(Original post by JW92)
People who claim that there is much difference between the two are ignorant.



This is in 2003, the parties have only become more homogenised in the past 6 years.
That's hardly an accurate representation of... Anything
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fletcheroo
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#22
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#22
It's just the trivial details of the application of the same economic model, they are very similiar.
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HappinessHappening
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#23
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#23
(Original post by Bagration)
Wait, since when? I always remember you as really statist.
Really? I might have been quite statist a long time ago, but today I'm a libertarian through and through; I just can't decide between left or right wing libertarianism. If I had to choose, I'd probably pick something along the lines of Proudhon's mutualism. Perhaps when I've written in support of socialist ideas you've assumed they were of the state variety? :dontknow:
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EnthusiasticEnthusiast
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#24
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#24
There isn't much difference between 'New Labour' and the Tories.
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Antonia87
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#25
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#25
(Original post by JW92)
People who claim that there is much difference between the two are ignorant.
No, I dont think so. Do you think the Conservatives would have allowed the devolved assemblies to formulate in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales giving them limited powers of self-government? Do you think the Conseratives would have signed the Social Chapter, implementing the Minimum Wage? Because they certainly opposed it initially. Do you think the Conservatives would have ever supported electoral reform and introduced the Single Transferable Vote System/Supplementary Vote/Additional Member System? Do you think they would have abolished hereditary peers in the House of Lords?

There are, in fact, numerous significant diffferences between the two parties.
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Olivia_Lightbulb
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#26
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#26
The Conservatives and Labour have become increasingly indistinguishable in recent years, both drifting towards the populist centre ground. It's not necessarily a bad thing, but I do wish Labour would drift further to the left hand side of the political spectrum.
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Bagration
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#27
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#27
(Original post by Antonia87)
No, I dont think so. Do you think the Conservatives would have allowed the devolved assemblies to formulate in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales giving them limited powers of self-government? Do you think the Conseratives would have signed the Social Chapter, implementing the Minimum Wage? Because they certainly opposed it initially. Do you think the Conservatives would have ever supported electoral reform and introduced the Single Transferable Vote System/Supplementary Vote/Additional Member System? Do you think they would have abolished hereditary peers in the House of Lords?

There are, in fact, numerous significant diffferences between the two parties.
I also doubt that the Tories would have introduced security legislation nearly so draconian as Labour's.
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Simon117
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#28
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#28
(Original post by Antonia87)
No, I dont think so. Do you think the Conservatives would have allowed the devolved assemblies to formulate in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales giving them limited powers of self-government? Do you think the Conseratives would have signed the Social Chapter, implementing the Minimum Wage? Because they certainly opposed it initially. Do you think the Conservatives would have ever supported electoral reform and introduced the Single Transferable Vote System/Supplementary Vote/Additional Member System? Do you think they would have abolished hereditary peers in the House of Lords?

There are, in fact, numerous significant diffferences between the two parties.
This is fair. However, I'm sure if I could be bothered to do a little research I could rattle off a list of similiarities. In reality, they are both centre parties courting the votes of people in marginal seats hence the similiarities. But I agree, they do lean in different directions in numerous policy areas.

As such, I didn't answer the poll as neither option really represented my view.
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JW92
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#29
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#29
(Original post by Antonia87)
No, I dont think so. Do you think the Conservatives would have allowed the devolved assemblies to formulate in Northern Ireland, Scotland and Wales giving them limited powers of self-government? Do you think the Conseratives would have signed the Social Chapter, implementing the Minimum Wage? Because they certainly opposed it initially. Do you think the Conservatives would have ever supported electoral reform and introduced the Single Transferable Vote System/Supplementary Vote/Additional Member System? Do you think they would have abolished hereditary peers in the House of Lords?

There are, in fact, numerous significant diffferences between the two parties.
None of those things have particularly affected my life - and it's not like the Tories are going to reverse those policies, anyway.
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Collingwood
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#30
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#30
I think if the other party and its supporters suddenly disappeared, either would become a lot more radical than they presently are, but I don't think they intend to implement fundamentally different values in the coming term.
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Antonia87
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#31
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#31
(Original post by JW92)
None of those things have particularly affected my life - and it's not like the Tories are going to reverse those policies, anyway.
Well, thats not really the point is it? And even if it was, they have certainly affected the lives of others.
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billydisco
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#32
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#32
(Original post by rajandkwameali)
there are a lot of similarities, especially in the economy, public services, education, etc.

And also in terms of general ideology. There may have been some economic similarities in the post-war consensus days, but back then Labour and the Tories had distinct ideologies. Labour were a democratic socialist party looking out for the working classes, while the Conservatives were a party leaning towards centre-right policies.

IMO, it is this similarity in ideology which makes people think there is little difference between the two major parties. Both of them are neo-Thatcherite in the end.
wtf?
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billydisco
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#33
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#33
Its quite simple, Labour are a party for the weak. They bring the rest of the country down to raise the level of the scum up.

Thanks to Labour, there is so much scum that the tories have to pretend they are more left-wing than they are, just to get the uneducated plebs to vote for them. Tories still have the same core values!
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billydisco
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#34
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#34
(Original post by Simon117)
This is fair. However, I'm sure if I could be bothered to do a little research I could rattle off a list of similiarities. In reality, they are both centre parties courting the votes of people in marginal seats hence the similiarities. But I agree, they do lean in different directions in numerous policy areas.

As such, I didn't answer the poll as neither option really represented my view.
Labour lie towards centre to try and get middle class votes, tories lie towards centre to try and get scum votes.

Labour is still left and Tory is still right!
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Moe Lester
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#35
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#35
(Original post by billydisco)
Labour lie towards centre to try and get middle class votes, tories lie towards centre to try and get scum votes.

Labour is still left and Tory is still right!
Explain.
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billydisco
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#36
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#36
(Original post by Moe Lester)
Explain.
They are both left and right respectively, but lie to gain centre-ground votes!

Do you actually think the majority of the Tory party doesn't have a say on grammar schools? Its not brought up incase it frightens fringe-voters away!
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JW92
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#37
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#37
(Original post by Antonia87)
Well, thats not really the point is it? And even if it was, they have certainly affected the lives of others.
The fact that even the most radical of New Labour's policies haven't affected most people's lives, and the fact that the Tories condone all of these policies anyway, goes to show that ideologically, socially and economically the parties are very similar.
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billydisco
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#38
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#38
Haha who ned repped me saying this:

"The working class (two thirds of the population) are not scum."

How the hell do you work out 66% of the population are the working class?

Normal distribution!

Im talking about the bottom 15%!
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tehjonny
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#39
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#39
(Original post by billydisco)
Labour lie towards centre to try and get middle class votes, tories lie towards centre to try and get scum votes.

Labour is still left and Tory is still right!
Labour have carried on putting people on Incapacity Benefit to mask the unemployment figures (in Calton, Glasgow 44% of people are on Incap). They implemented these 'medical checks' (no such thing) to shove unhealthy people off benefits and onto the scrap-heap. They DOUBLED the income tax of the poorest in a stroke.

Labour aren't leftwing by a long way. Not that I care, all I want to see is them carry on as they have done until May. Then I can live in the confidence that I will never have to suffer a Labour government again in my lifetime.

Nice.
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L i b
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#40
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#40
I think they're well thick.
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