1 in 4 children sexually abused in Saudi Arabia Watch

Organ
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#21
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#21
I hear there is a big private gay scene in Saudi amongst wealthy Arabs - something to do with locking the girls away until marriage.
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booraad
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#22
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(Original post by there's too much love)
But all you're doing with that link is showing a difference in culture. One of the key things in grooming is sexual abuse, but what counts as sexual abuse isn't something objective.
It will change from person to person, how existentially free a child is, and how existentially free they're perceived to be.

Out of curiosity would you argue that childhood masturbation is wrong and that the child should wait a few years?
I don't argue that childhood masturbation is wrong. I think it's a typical part of development. An adult masturbating or masturbating with a child is not normal or healthy and is inherently exploitative.

Showing children pornography is usually done with a view to later engage in sexual activity with the child. Often child pornography is shown to help encourage the child to think of such activity as 'normal'. It is not normal or healthy. In Islamic culture pornography is not even legal and engaging in sexual activity with anyone other than your spouse is illegal. I suppose there is some form of shame attached to a child being exposed abuse early on and that is why it is hidden. Only when the abuse becomes tangible (i.e. physical in nature), do parents begin to think about contacting the authorities. Even then there is a huge stigma in admitting that your child (especially daughter) is no longer a virgin.
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Diaz89
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#23
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The child molester in America is considered a dangerous criminal while for us he is a man who committed a mistake that does not necessarily entail informing the police!
If this is true, the entire Saudi establishment has serious questions to answer for, though the highlighted statement doesn't really match reality.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...a-1814475.html
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Dirac Delta Function
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#24
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#24
(Original post by Organ)
I hear there is a big private gay scene in Saudi amongst wealthy Arabs - something to do with locking the girls away until marriage.

They do the gay thing in a big way underground there. I have never been propositioned by a man here in the UK - I'm totally straight and don't give off any kind of "gay vibe". Visited Saudi Arabia, I got propositioned a number of times. I'm not sure what it is, I think they think if you come from a western country then you'll do anything.
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Organ
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(Original post by Dirac Delta Function)
They do the gay thing in a big way underground there. I have never been propositioned by a man here in the UK - I'm totally straight and don't give off any kind of "gay vibe". Visited Saudi Arabia, I got propositioned a number of times. I'm not sure what it is, I think they think if you come from a western country then you'll do anything.
That's interesting, are you Iraqi then? What was the situation out of interest - I assume it was in private?
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Dirac Delta Function
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(Original post by Organ)
That's interesting, are you Iraqi then? What was the situation out of interest - I assume it was in private?
Yes, I'm Iraqi.

The situations were not actually all that private. Just having a conversation with a shopkeeper, about where you're from etc, and it turns into something rather unwelcome.
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Organ
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(Original post by Dirac Delta Function)
Yes, I'm Iraqi.

The situations were not actually all that private. Just having a conversation with a shopkeeper, about where you're from etc, and it turns into something rather unwelcome.
I bet that's a bolt from the blue! Any idea why it isn't completely taboo in Saudi to behave like that?
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Dirac Delta Function
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#28
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(Original post by Organ)
I bet that's a bolt from the blue! Any idea why it isn't completely taboo in Saudi to behave like that?

A lot of stuff happens underground. Drinking, extra marital sex, that kind of thing. I think the OP's reports probably stems from the pressure of this over exagerated segregation they have between the sexes. Or perhaps it's not talked about and dealt with openly means it gets a bit out of control; "out of sight, out of mind" type thing.
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User414413
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#29
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I see a dispatches program in the making.
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M1F2R3
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#30
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#30
(Original post by Srxjer)
Unsurprising considering there is no age of consent there.
Is there not :confused:? That's worrying, unless you are this guy http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1eNDIioyx8&sns=em
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pina.Love
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#31
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(Original post by there's too much love)
If I talk in the US to my own child about sex, saying what it is, how the body works, showing educational cartoons on the matter, will that count as molestation?
(Original post by Arekkusu)
"Showing a pornographic picture to a child or talking to him about sex in the US is considered molestation."

:lolwut:
:rofl: lol at the responses.

Obviously talking to your kid about the birds and the bees is completely different from talking dirty to a kid and saying something like "I wana **** you" or "I wana suck your genitals"
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there's too much love
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#32
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(Original post by booraad)
I don't argue that childhood masturbation is wrong. I think it's a typical part of development. An adult masturbating or masturbating with a child is not normal or healthy and is inherently exploitative.

Showing children pornography is usually done with a view to later engage in sexual activity with the child. Often child pornography is shown to help encourage the child to think of such activity as 'normal'. It is not normal or healthy. In Islamic culture pornography is not even legal and engaging in sexual activity with anyone other than your spouse is illegal. I suppose there is some form of shame attached to a child being exposed abuse early on and that is why it is hidden. Only when the abuse becomes tangible (i.e. physical in nature), do parents begin to think about contacting the authorities. Even then there is a huge stigma in admitting that your child (especially daughter) is no longer a virgin.

I'm a little confused,if it's okay for a child to masturbate, and you show a child porn without engaging in sexual practises with them, or if they say "please could you do x to me whilst I do y" how that is abuse...

...I mean obviously there are grey areas, bad things can happen, but that's no reason to label every case where an adult gives a child the means to engage in exploring their sexuality as 'abuse'.
If we're talking about forcing someone into doing something I can see where you're coming from, but if something is (both internally and externally) coercion free why do we have to label sexual exploration in such a negative light?

There's this whole issue of "innocence" and "sex is dirty" that we ingrain into each other in our, and other, societies. Sex is not seen as 'innocent', and if you want to think like that then fair enough, but why are you imposing that onto situations where you're not involved, why do we have to look at sex, or at the very least young people exploring their sexuality, in a negative manner?
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booraad
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(Original post by there's too much love)
I'm a little confused,if it's okay for a child to masturbate, and you show a child porn without engaging in sexual practises with them, or if they say "please could you do x to me whilst I do y" how that is abuse...

...I mean obviously there are grey areas, bad things can happen, but that's no reason to label every case where an adult gives a child the means to engage in exploring their sexuality as 'abuse'.
If we're talking about forcing someone into doing something I can see where you're coming from, but if something is (both internally and externally) coercion free why do we have to label sexual exploration in such a negative light?

There's this whole issue of "innocence" and "sex is dirty" that we ingrain into each other in our, and other, societies. Sex is not seen as 'innocent', and if you want to think like that then fair enough, but why are you imposing that onto situations where you're not involved, why do we have to look at sex, or at the very least young people exploring their sexuality, in a negative manner?

OK - let me clarify my position. A child masturbating does not involve exploitation. When an adult exposes a child to sexual activity in order to gain pleasure and to prime a child for further sexual activity - this is exploitation. A child cannot give 'consent' as he/she does not realise that the relationship is inherently exploitative.

Child masturbating - normal
Children masturbating - normal
Child + adult masturbating - not normal or healthy
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there's too much love
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(Original post by booraad)
OK - let me clarify my position. A child masturbating does not involve exploitation. When an adult exposes a child to sexual activity in order to gain pleasure and to prime a child for further sexual activity - this is exploitation. A child cannot give 'consent' as he/she does not realise that the relationship is inherently exploitative.

Child masturbating - normal
Children masturbating - normal
Child + adult masturbating - not normal or healthy
So because the last option there isn't normal it isn't healthy?

I mean something not being healthy I guess I get, because that can be neutral, and not necessarily unhealthy, but the way you're putting it makes it sound negative.

Why we should just do what's normal is beyond me...or did you not mean to imply that?

And the child could have things explained to them. True, some may not understand, but does that mean we should stop those who do understand?
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booraad
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(Original post by there's too much love)
So because the last option there isn't normal it isn't healthy?

I mean something not being healthy I guess I get, because that can be neutral, and not necessarily unhealthy, but the way you're putting it makes it sound negative.

Why we should just do what's normal is beyond me...or did you not mean to imply that?

And the child could have things explained to them. True, some may not understand, but does that mean we should stop those who do understand?
The reason why it is not considered normal for an adult to masturbate with a child is because it not considered healthy for the child to be exploited.
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there's too much love
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(Original post by booraad)
The reason why it is not considered normal for an adult to masturbate with a child is because it not considered healthy for the child to be exploited.
But it's not necessarily exploitative...

It being normal or not has nothing to do with the scenario.
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basketofsnakes
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#37
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lol muslims
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booraad
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#38
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(Original post by there's too much love)
But it's not necessarily exploitative...

It being normal or not has nothing to do with the scenario.
I believe that an adult encouraging a child to engage in mutual sexual activity is inherently exploitative. The law says so too for a reason. Children cannot provide consent. Thus, this type of behaviour - aka 'sexual abuse' in the UK is not 'normal'. Parents do not normally molest their children.
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Magic_007
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(Original post by Dirac Delta Function)
A lot of stuff happens underground. Drinking, extra marital sex, that kind of thing. I think the OP's reports probably stems from the pressure of this over exagerated segregation they have between the sexes. Or perhaps it's not talked about and dealt with openly means it gets a bit out of control; "out of sight, out of mind" type thing.

This, it's like an open secret, everyone knows it, but nobody does anything, for instance, there is a brothel near a mosque in some city in an 'Islamic state', in daytime it is a shopping centre where your ordinary Muslims walk by shopping and late at night....:unsure:
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basketofsnakes
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#40
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It ain't abuse if Muhammad gives approval. Just sayin'.
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