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"socialism never took root in america because..." watch

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    why are there so many yanks on TSR?
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    (Original post by defuzion)
    why are there so many yanks on TSR?
    A Yankee is a northerner. I'm sure there are some southerners on TSR as well. Us Yanks could leave and just leave the southerners on TSR if you like.

    Also, policies resembling limited forms of socialism are evident in America and have been for some time: public emergency services, public education, a welfare system, and health policies for children and the elderly.
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    (Original post by poolopis01)
    A Yankee is a northerner. I'm sure there are some southerners on TSR as well. Us Yanks could leave and just leave the southerners on TSR if you like.

    Also, policies resembling limited forms of socialism are evident in America and have been for some time: public emergency services, public education, a welfare system, and health policies for children and the elderly.
    uhm. this is not socialism
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    (Original post by defuzion)
    uhm. this is not socialism
    Uhm. yes it is.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism

    Five seconds worth of reading and you're wrong.
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    (Original post by poolopis01)
    Uhm. yes it is.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism

    Five seconds worth of reading and you're wrong.
    if the workers are in control then, ipso facto, you have socialism. your description is at the most a social liberal welfare regime; vertical redistribution does not imply socialism. dont make yourself look like an idiot; read that page you linked me and educate thyself
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    (Original post by poolopis01)
    A Yankee is a northerner. I'm sure there are some southerners on TSR as well. Us Yanks could leave and just leave the southerners on TSR if you like.
    Perhaps to you, but in Britain (along with almost all Commonwealth countries and many other countries within Europe) the term "Yankee" or "Yank" refers to Northern Americans in general, be it from the North or South.
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    (Original post by contra)
    please tell me you're not being serious.

    people like you argue that america is great because it's democratic and free, but as soon as people realise their freedom to have opposing views to you, you hide behind a meaningless word. I challenge you to give me one reason why socialism is unamerican.
    Because it is un-American to seize something from one person and redistribute it to another. The only justification to do this is "they need it". I don't give a sh** about what anyone needs. I only care about what they deserve. I know they may have rough circumstances. I know life isn't fair. So what, get over it. 90% of the people pushing this idea of what is needed superseding what is deserved are the ones who don't have sh** and therefore are the ones who gain from stealing under the guise of social equality. That kind of puts their objectivity into question doesn't it. I don't care what anyone needs, and I'm offended that they feel entitled to try to seize my stuff.

    By the way I entered the military without a dime to my name and used my service to put myself through school. I then started my own business with a massive loan leveraged against my house and meager savings, and am just now starting to be able to breathe.

    So don't tell me I owe anyone a f***ing thing!
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Because it is un-American to seize something from one person and redistribute it to another. The only justification to do this is "they need it". I don't give a sh** about what anyone needs. I only care about what they deserve. I know they may have rough circumstances. I know life isn't fair. So what, get over it. 90% of the people pushing this idea of what is needed superseding what is deserved are the ones who don't have sh** and therefore are the ones who gain from stealing under the guise of social equality. That kind of puts there objectivity into question doesn't it. I don't care what anyone needs, and I'm offended that they feel entitled to try to seize my stuff.

    By the way I entered the military without a dime to my name and used my service to put myself through school. I then started my own business with a massive loan leveraged against my house and meager savings, and am just now starting to be able to breathe.

    So don't tell me I owe anyone a f***ing thing!
    Best post in this thread so far. With regards the original question, I do mostly agree with the statement.
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    So what is its massive military expenditure?

    Nationalised industry if there was ever any.

    It is not positive socialism, helping people in need - but it represents a socialism of a kind in that it is a society that is funding joint projects together on public goods (defence).

    I personally think the lack of "normal" socialism is due to two reasons, the religiosity of Americans and the nature of America as a political entity.

    Firstly, America as a political entity has always been about the states versus the federal government. This creates a strong atmosphere whereby the "government" i.e. the federal one, is hamstrung and is viewed as violating individual states when it entacts new legalisation (particularly true as America has become more culturally diverse and by that I don't mean more darkies, but rather the cultural difference between a Texan and a New Yorker). This creates a defensive mindset where the federal government is involved.

    The other aspect is the popularity of christanity in America, this creates a moralistic environment that is reinforced by capitalistic statements such as "Everyone has an equal chance and you blew yours" towards the poor. Obviously, this is not in keeping with the original Christian spirit, but that is not what is practised by the white middle class Americans.

    Americans are more concerned by equal opportunities rather than equal outcomes as a result of these two factors. The distinction between the two encapsulates the spirit of capitalism/communism more accurately than any philsophical essay.

    Ignored the OPs suggestion on why as it's clearly *******s.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    I entered the military without a dime to my name
    [/B]

    So? Many people can enter the military without money. At the end of the day it's a job and you get paid for it. You're not meant to be paying to get paid when you're employed by a company or the government. It doesn't make sense

    That's like saying "I entered McDonald's without a dime to my name and I got myself educated as well"
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    "The American Dream" is in quotes because I was speaking of it in terms of a concept. I don't care where you are from, whinging is still whinging and holding yourself and nothing else accountable is a productive mentality to have.
    You are absolutely right!

    Just wish more of the top percent had this attitude... oh wait, they actually CAN just make everybody else pay for their mistakes xP (and the bank bailouts was SOCIALISM)
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    (Original post by de_monies)
    So? Many people can enter the military without money. At the end of the day it's a job and you get paid for it. You're not meant to be paying to get paid when you're employed by a company or the government. It doesn't make sense

    That's like saying "I entered McDonald's without a dime to my name and I got myself educated as well"
    You are right. I never said it wasn't a job. My point is that nothing was handed to me. I don't come from a pedigree, and I don't know what a silver spoon tastes like. I had to use the military to pay for my education. I have struggled to get what little I have, and I still struggle.
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    ...because Americans aren't as stupid as everyone thought.
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    (Original post by Disastor)
    You are absolutely right!

    Just wish more of the top percent had this attitude... oh wait, they actually CAN just make everybody else pay for their mistakes xP (and the bank bailouts was SOCIALISM)
    And you are absolutely right about the bailouts. The problem is that social policies mostly affect guys who are struggling like me. Last I checked, I didn't receive any billions in bailout money.
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    (Original post by Foghorn Leghorn)
    Because the 'american dream' says the lower class can one day, if they work hard enough, be as rich as the fat cat bosses that control them and as a result the lower classes are against high taxation and socialism as they feel it will deprive them of their well earned fortune when they finally get it. This is of course without actually realising that the 'american dream' is a fallacy created by the upper class to blind their labouring poor from the truth that is an adapted system of socialism will benefit them more now whilst they're poor and will increase social mobility and perhaps give them a better chance of making the dream come true. And if it doesn't work out, at least their poor lives wont be as much as a stuggle as it is in the current state of economic/soicial mobility in america.

    Ahh the american dream :daydreaming:................................ what a ****in' load of ****e! :pierre:

    So in a sense yes I agree. :holmes:
    I have lived the American Dream pal, and im British. It is real. There is nothing wrong with wanting to better yourself in society...socialism does not work. Have you seen the state Europe is in?

    I dont understand why the British have such a problem with wanting to be the very best you can be and achieve something of your life. Its as if you are all happy to have an average job, average car, average house and just sit in your local pub and moan about America. Get over yourselves ffs.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    Because it is un-American to seize something from one person and redistribute it to another. The only justification to do this is "they need it". I don't give a sh** about what anyone needs. I only care about what they deserve. I know they may have rough circumstances. I know life isn't fair. So what, get over it. 90% of the people pushing this idea of what is needed superseding what is deserved are the ones who don't have sh** and therefore are the ones who gain from stealing under the guise of social equality. That kind of puts their objectivity into question doesn't it. I don't care what anyone needs, and I'm offended that they feel entitled to try to seize my stuff.

    By the way I entered the military without a dime to my name and used my service to put myself through school. I then started my own business with a massive loan leveraged against my house and meager savings, and am just now starting to be able to breathe.

    So don't tell me I owe anyone a f***ing thing!
    Britain and many other societies do not hold the belief that the individual possesses property but that it is to be shared amongst the whole society as the collective is often more stable than the individual. Individualism is effectively hedonism at work which I believe America would find un-American.


    (Original post by TheImperialist)
    I have lived the American Dream pal, and im British. It is real. There is nothing wrong with wanting to better yourself in society...socialism does not work. Have you seen the state Europe is in?

    I dont understand why the British have such a problem with wanting to be the very best you can be and achieve something of your life. Its as if you are all happy to have an average job, average car, average house and just sit in your local pub and moan about America. Get over yourselves ffs.
    What's wrong with being average, it is you here who is setting values, believing that the richer people are of greater value than those who posses less material wealth. But yes you can go ahead and achieve whatever you wish to do, because I cannot see the meaning in achieving when there is nothing to achieve.
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    (Original post by RyanT)
    Americans are more concerned by equal opportunities rather than equal outcomes as a result of these two factors. The distinction between the two encapsulates the spirit of capitalism/communism more accurately than any philsophical essay.
    Aside from fueling my own over-inflated ego, this is why I even bother with the mostly pointless TSR. I like this quote so much that I wish it were mine.
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    (Original post by ckingalt)
    And you are absolutely right about the bailouts. The problem is that social policies mostly affect guys who are struggling like me. Last I checked, I didn't receive any billions in bailout money.
    It just proves that "capitalists" aren't true capitalists... only capitalist when times are good, they become socialist when the profits eventually have to fall
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    (Original post by TheImperialist)
    I have lived the American Dream pal, and im British. It is real. There is nothing wrong with wanting to better yourself in society...socialism does not work. Have you seen the state Europe is in?

    I dont understand why the British have such a problem with wanting to be the very best you can be and achieve something of your life. Its as if you are all happy to have an average job, average car, average house and just sit in your local pub and moan about America. Get over yourselves ffs.
    oh yeah, that terrible state it's in because of poor bank regulation. If only they weren't so socialist they would have regulated those banks better, right?... oh wait.
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    Because socialism doesn't work.
 
 
 
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