Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
x Turn on thread page Beta
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by SamTheMan)
    That's what you think... plus monsieur le français, you live nowhere near London, Paris or Frankfurt.

    Try going to interviews and saying that you just want money. It simply doesn't work like that. I've been to interviews and during breaks I've spoken to managers who are "tired" of seeing arrogant kids who think they're the bomb and will soon be driving a maserati. Litterally what I was told.
    I'll answer to you, since "lukyeh" or whatever it is is too impolite to respect my opinion - "exceptionally stupid" ? You're spectacularly unpleasant. Might I ask, BTW, why do you have to be so aggressive (both of you) ? I don't recall there being any provocation in my short reply to your post.
    You both think I want to work into IB ? You're wrong. I'm too young to be sure of wanting to do smtg so specific, and anyway, I'm far from sure that I'll ever end up in IB, LSE-degree or not. That's one.
    Secondly, I also believe that passion is an essential aspect when "choosing" a job. I have a friend who wants to become a paleontologist despite the long studies/low salary etc. etc. because it's his dream, and I very much respect that. So no, money isn't the only thing that matters to me, and I don't need to be making 100 k with three years' work experience to feel fulfilled.
    Also, sorry but difficult working conditions or not, I still believe that Banking is a profession in which passion is not essential. Greed can get you to become the best trader/banker out there, even if you're a complete ******* - it's unrelated. And don't tell me that all the managers out there despise greed, because if greed did not exist, capitalism wouldn't. Go watch Wall Street, it'll do you good.
    Perhaps the reputation of financiers is completely off the mark, but reputations tend to have some truth to them. Most ppl believe that bankers, and especially traders, in short ppl who work in high finance, are there to make pots of money and work their asses off for 5-10 years and then just retire and have fun with the cash - or use it/invest it wisely, it depends on personality. In any case, go and tell ppl that bankers work mostly because they have a passion for their work, and they'll laugh. I can tell you, because whenever I mention it ppl seem to frown upon the profession, implying that big bucks is the only incentive to work in the field.
    Finally, just because I don't live near the City doesn't mean I know nothing about the subject. The argument sucks anyway ; who's to say that a Spaniard, for example, has no idea about IB just because Madrid isn't a great financial marketplace ? What I don't know I learn from Citigroup Trader or President Ben, not from dismissive ppl like you. And I'm pretty sure citi will wake you up if he reads this - make you get real. Go through this forum a bit, and it's pretty clear that most ppl want to work in IB because of $$$ - whether you like it or not.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Johan C)
    I'll answer to you, since "lukyeh" or whatever it is is too impolite to respect my opinion - "exceptionally stupid" ? You're spectacularly unpleasant. Might I ask, BTW, why do you have to be so aggressive (both of you) ? I don't recall there being any provocation in my short reply to your post.
    You both think I want to work into IB ? You're wrong. I'm too young to be sure of wanting to do smtg so specific, and anyway, I'm far from sure that I'll ever end up in IB, LSE-degree or not. That's one.
    Secondly, I also believe that passion is an essential aspect when "choosing" a job. I have a friend who wants to become a paleontologist despite the long studies/low salary etc. etc. because it's his dream, and I very much respect that. So no, money isn't the only thing that matters to me, and I don't need to be making 100 k with three years' work experience to feel fulfilled.
    Also, sorry but difficult working conditions or not, I still believe that Banking is a profession in which passion is not essential. Greed can get you to become the best trader/banker out there, even if you're a complete ******* - it's unrelated. And don't tell me that all the managers out there despise greed, because if greed did not exist, capitalism wouldn't. Go watch Wall Street, it'll do you good.
    Finally, just because I don't live near the City doesn't mean I know nothing about the subject. The argument sucks anyway ; who's to say that a Spaniard, for example, has no idea about IB just because Madrid isn't a great financial marketplace ? What I don't know I learn from Citigroup Trader or President Ben, not from dismissive ppl like you. And I'm pretty sure citi will wake you up if he reads this - make you get real. Go through this forum a bit, and it's pretty clear that most ppl want to work in IB because of $$$ - whether you like it or not.
    You seem to have taken offence. Apologies.

    Firstly, I definately respect your opinion. I certainly don't agree with it, and I certainly think it is very naïve; but it doesn't mean I don't respect it. I entirely disagree with what you say but I will 'defend to death your right to say it'

    Secondly, this is just a discussion. So even if I don't agree with what you have to say, at no point was the debate in any way personal.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    Honestly not sure if by 'both of you' you meant me too? I'm just firing a retort against 'the greater good' considerations being brought into a discussion about IB rather than you or anything you said. Despite all the lip service it's getting, no aspect of the business world, especially finance and even more so IB, has that as a top priority. I imagine.

    It requires passion. Long hours and basically giving up your 'life' to do a job you dont -have- to do requires passion. Be it a passion for making money or for the job itself matters not.

    edit: Greed is most certainly a passion.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by lukyeh)
    You seem to have taken offence. Apologies.

    Firstly, I definately respect your opinion. I certainly don't agree with it, and I certainly think it is very naïve; but it doesn't mean I don't respect it. I entirely disagree with what you say but I will 'defend to death your right to say it'

    Secondly, this is just a discussion. So even if I don't agree with what you have to say, at no point was the debate in any way personal.
    Apologies accepted. It's true I lack an insider's view (hell, I'm only 17 :p:) and, well, perhaps I'm naive. I'm tired and stressed-out too - exam time lol. But don't you agree that there are many ppl in the world of IB who are both greedy and bring in cash for their company ? I mean, I have no idea how recruiters feel about personal motivation, but do you really think that they only recruit ppl who show a true passion ?

    Brabzz - no, I meant lukyeh and SamtheMan. I mostly agree with you.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Johan C)
    I mean, I have no idea how recruiters feel about personal motivation, but do you really think that they only recruit ppl who show a true passion ?

    Yes.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by lukyeh)
    Yes.
    Hmm. Well, I'll revise my assumptions accordingly - you're clearly better informed. In any case I hope no-one categorises me on this forum ; I was making general statements about the profession (be they misled or not) and although I'd love to be affluent later on, I'd never do a job which doesn't interest me just for the money.
    Offline

    13
    (Original post by Ibrahim)
    As a computer fanatic, I view it as a challenging computer game, where I must perform under extreme pressure and to the highest expectations or face the ultimate doom of failure. I am not sure if you guys are with me? lol
    Games can be so challenging, they aren't fun anymore.
    Offline

    13
    With regard to is it about the money

    There are plenty of jobs I would not do just because they would pay very well.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    I'm the first person to deride the state of affairs where the top graduates want to go into IB rather than academia, government, stuff that makes a huge difference to the world, etc. But to say that finance doesn't matter at all is simply wrong. Finance makes a lot of difference, whether for good or bad. Moreover, I think it's possible to make a difference within IB, even if many IBers choose not to. Choosing a career isn't about making a difference, it's about being given the tool to make a difference. Being in IB doesn't mean you make a difference, just like being in any job doesn't. Being in IB gives you the tool to use finance, and if you want to use it to make a difference, you can. Sure, it's easier for a doctor to make a difference, but if a finance project can create 10000 jobs, it can certainly make a difference. It's up to the person whether or not it does though, not the job.

    I want to be in government, so I can make a difference. But being in government is a tool to make a difference, the reason I'll make a difference is because I want to, as others can in difference careers.

    (Original post by lukyeh)
    What precisely do you mean when you say "I like doing something that matters"? :confused:

    If you do like doing something that matters, then presumably, you prefer doing things that matter more...
    How does that follow? Someone like doing something that matters, but not really care about what matters *more*. It's quite easy to disregard all jobs that don't really matter, and then judge on other things which of those left you'd like to do. Sure, some you don't end up picking will matter more, but as long as it matters enough, that could be ok.

    If you like doing that matters, it doesn't necessarily follow you'd choose the thing that matters most. It means it's a factor.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Drogue)


    How does that follow? Someone like doing something that matters, but not really care about what matters *more*. It's quite easy to disregard all jobs that don't really matter, and then judge on other things which of those left you'd like to do. Sure, some you don't end up picking will matter more, but as long as it matters enough, that could be ok.

    If you like doing that matters, it doesn't necessarily follow you'd choose the thing that matters most. It means it's a factor.
    The basis of the argument was inductive. So as to say that given he wants to do something that matters, *presumably*, he'd prefer doing something that matters more.

    I never stated that it was necessarily the case; I merely implied it was probably so.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    But you went on to make judgements from it. I'm saying I wouldn't presume it is so, as there's little basis for doing so.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Drogue)
    But you went on to make judgements from it. I'm saying I wouldn't presume it is so, as there's little basis for doing so.
    It wasn't a judgement; never did I say that it was a good or a bad thing.

    I just pointed out it that if he prefers doing things that matter more, then other professions were perhaps more suited to his goals.

    It works the other way as well I guess - there is little basis to assuming the opposite.

    Still, I think it is more cogent to make the assumption that he prefers doing things that matter more - simply because its human nature to want more and more and more....... Admittedly a point open to debate, but that's where I stand on it.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    I didn't mean a judgement as in good or bad, I meant you took your presumption and made a judgement that he'd prefer something that matters more, which was unfounded.

    As I have shown, it's quite easy for someone to want to do something that matters, but not really mind whether it matters amazingly or just a bit. Indeed, most people don't want the stress of a job that matters so immensely, that could mean life or death for many people. Everyone has an optimum level of how much something matters, which for some may be amazingly high, but for most people will be a job that matters but isn't amazingly stressful.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Whenever i tell people i want to go into finance, especially women, they cant understand why. They say there is more to life than millions and are really interested in my writing (i write screenplays for fun). In some way i agree. I would rather be worth £1m (yes money does matter to a basic degree) at forty and have created some beautiful music or art/literature with a cult following , than be worth £10m and have really not created or contributed anything to humanity.
    But for me he gamble is that making 1m in an artistic career is very, very difficult. I dont trust my talent enough.

    As for making a difference....

    Investment banks have destroyed third world economies in partnerships with western governments for hundreds of years and continue to do so. There is a very good book about this; 'confessions of an economic hitman' have a look.
    So any pathetic argument about overall helping these countries is really unforgivable.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    I'm sure there are billions of people would would be happy to be worth millions fullstop. Nevermind a million form having done this and ten million from having done that.

    In all fairness, IBs don't really destroy the third world. They arrange debt and stuff on behalf of others and that's about as far as they're involved. I havn't read the book (and i genuinely don't care to either), but blaming the state of the third world on globalisation/capitalisation/IB's is pushing it a bit.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bluefuture)
    Whenever i tell people i want to go into finance, especially women, they cant understand why. They say there is more to life than millions and are really interested in my writing (i write screenplays for fun). In some way i agree. I would rather be worth £1m (yes money does matter to a basic degree) at forty and have created some beautiful music or art/literature with a cult following , than be worth £10m and have really not created or contributed anything to humanity.
    But for me he gamble is that making 1m in an artistic career is very, very difficult. I dont trust my talent enough.

    As for making a difference....

    Investment banks have destroyed third world economies in partnerships with western governments for hundreds of years and continue to do so. There is a very good book about this; 'confessions of an economic hitman' have a look.
    So any pathetic argument about overall helping these countries is really unforgivable.
    1. These same women who you talk about now will want to be financially secure in the future rather than piss poor married to a penniless artist/musician/whatever. I wouldn't make any opinions based on what this particular demographic has to say at this point in their lives.

    2. If you want to make that kind of outlandish claim on a forum such as this in particular I want specific examples showing colloboration between the two institutions you have mentioned which directly shows that they have intentionally conspired to destroy third world economies. Of course not just one example because you go on to claim that this is a practice that has occured for hundreds of years so a pletora of examples satisfying the above conditions please.

    3. Before you go on to say read this book it provides the examples you asked for, firstly I nor anyone else is going to go rushing to read this book simply because you deem it worthy. Secondly why should we trust this particular book over any other source, any one information source is going to contain an element of personal bias. I'm sure there are plenty are books extolling the virtues of the capitalist system and the role i-b's play in it.

    Finally with your attitiude why are you even considering going into finance.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    I pity you...

    believe me, if you think financial services companies are innocent and strive to make humanity a better place you live in a parallel universe.
    they are about one thing, and one thing only......making money. Even you would admit to this. they will sell and buy anything to please the shareholders.

    'i dont care to read this book' just shows how you are unwilling to even consider it, and shows how the capitalistic greed and false expectations of the benefits of material gain have entirely corrupted any shred of humanity left in you.

    i guarantee you a woman would prefer to marry an interesting, culturally aware, creative person (with enough money to survive) than some boring, souless city geek. who she only sees 3 hours a night and is impotent due to the stress and with nothing but a big wallet, ego and an LSE degree lol.
    infact the penniless artist is the one she will have an affair with.

    At least if i work in finance i will have the GUTS to admit to this.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bluefuture)
    I pity you...

    believe me, if you think financial services companies are innocent and strive to make humanity a better place you live in a parallel universe.
    they are about one thing, and one thing only......making money. Even you would admit to this. they will sell and buy anything to please the shareholders.

    'i dont care to read this book' just shows how you are unwilling to even consider it, and shows how the capitalistic greed and false expectations of the benefits of material gain have entirely corrupted any shred of humanity left in you.

    i guarantee you a woman would prefer to marry an interesting, culturally aware, creative person (with enough money to survive) than some boring, souless city geek. who she only sees 3 hours a night and is impotent due to the stress and with nothing but a big wallet, ego and an LSE degree lol.
    infact the penniless artist is the one she will have an affair with.

    At least if i work in finance i will have the GUTS to admit to this.
    Lol tsk tsk so personal no need to get riled so easily, highly emotional people do not succeed in business.

    1. I didn't mention innocence anywhere did I, I stated that they didn't systematically conspire along with other "Western Governments" to screw over the third world. You failed to show how this clearly took place nstead relying on hyperbolic rhetoric.

    2. Ah yes the mythical shareholders, now I wonder why it's automatically assumed that this is a bad thing. I mean it's not like lots of institutional investors (pension funds etc) are significant investors in these ib's is it...

    3. I said I would hardly rush off to read a book just because you deem it suitable. This is not the same as refuting or refusing to consider the argument out of hand, indeed it seems that it is you on the basis of this book who seems to be dismissing alternative vews out of hand.

    4. Lol what a fantastic stereotype, often tends to be the recourse of those less successful. There are plenty of people who work in the city who have very interesting and varied lives, Ben will tell you more about UBS poster child the guy who flies out to Hawaii to go surfing all through the year despite working in M&A etc

    Lastly the guts to admit to what exactly, that you despise the industry you want to work in, hate everyone in it and everything they stand for? Yeah tell me how you get on with that lol.
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by bluefuture)
    I pity you...

    believe me, if you think financial services companies are innocent and strive to make humanity a better place you live in a parallel universe.
    they are about one thing, and one thing only......making money. Even you would admit to this. they will sell and buy anything to please the shareholders.

    'i dont care to read this book' just shows how you are unwilling to even consider it, and shows how the capitalistic greed and false expectations of the benefits of material gain have entirely corrupted any shred of humanity left in you.

    i guarantee you a woman would prefer to marry an interesting, culturally aware, creative person (with enough money to survive) than some boring, souless city geek. who she only sees 3 hours a night and is impotent due to the stress and with nothing but a big wallet, ego and an LSE degree lol.
    infact the penniless artist is the one she will have an affair with.

    At least if i work in finance i will have the GUTS to admit to this.
    Dude, WTF you doing in this forum?

    NOTHING in the business (nevermind finance) world revolves around ethics, even more so any ethics that are not 'business ethics'. I think it's a case of 'accept that and fit in'.

    As for the book thing, for every book like the one you mention, there's another claiming the exact reverse is true. Globalisation, capitalism and 'exploitation' might be the only reason some countries have the infrastructure they have - or the Romans had, for that matter. But that's a debate for the D&D forum...

    Lol, as for the woman thing, money IS an asset. You can be interesting and work in finance...they're far from mutually exclusive. Women need security, something being skint can't buy...hence you only get a short term affair. The banker then hits 30, retires with her to Hawai and you lose her!
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by brabzzz)
    Dude, WTF you doing in this forum?

    NOTHING in the business (nevermind finance) world revolves around ethics, even more so any ethics that are not 'business ethics'. I think it's a case of 'accept that and fit in'.

    As for the book thing, for every book like the one you mention, there's another claiming the exact reverse is true. Globalisation, capitalism and 'exploitation' might be the only reason some countries have the infrastructure they have - or the Romans had, for that matter. But that's a debate for the D&D forum...

    Lol, as for the woman thing, money IS an asset. You can be interesting and work in finance...they're far from mutually exclusive. Women need security, something being skint can't buy...hence you only get a short term affair. The banker then hits 30, retires with her to Hawai and you lose her!
    Indeed he's being a bit masochistic posting here lol.
 
 
 
Poll
Do you agree with the proposed ban on plastic straws and cotton buds?
Useful resources

Articles:

Guide to investment bankingGuide to consultancy

Featured recruiter profiles:

Deutsche Bank logo

Deutsche Bank is recruiting

"Thrive in an international banking environment"

Quick link:

Unanswered investment banking and consultancy threads

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.