Why is there atheism? Watch

DanLorenzo
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#21
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#21
(Original post by Kaiser MacCleg)
The most basic answer is that atheism exists because there are those who are unconvinced by theistic explanations of the universe. In my case, my atheism stems from my skepticism; I reject the god claims of theists because I have never been exposed to one which is supported by any empirical evidence, and I will continue to do so until that changes.

To answer your question regarding the nature of existence; well, I don't think it is possible to be absolutely certain that the universe is really "real", in that it exists independently of us or isn't a simulation of some kind, but I don't think you need absolute certainty. Absolute certainty isn't the only kind of knowledge - it is certainly possible to make estimates of the probability of things, based upon evidence and reasoned argument, and on this basis I would consider any view that the universe doesn't exist outside our minds to be unlikely. As limited as our perceptions are, we can now make predictions about how the Earth and the wider universe should operate, given our current understanding, and often, our observations bear out our predictions. We've devised instrumentation for probing the universe in ways that our senses cannot, and they also seem to perceive the universe as a very real place. Of course, all these observations, instruments and results reproduced by other individuals on the other side of the world may also be just a part of this great cosmic fantasy, but if you think your mind is capable of that, then why the hell are you slumming it out in middle Britain?

I think it's helpful, at the end of the day, that we make certain assumptions, as Farm_Ecology suggests. We all make this assumption - that the Universe is real - even the solipsists amongst us. We live our lives by it.
I completely agree with you. I too believe that the universe exists and that my mind and the thoughts it produces are real. What I'm saying is since athiests tend to lean towards this whole 'if I can see it then it's real' notion, its kind of ironic that they favour science over religion when neither can really provide convincing grounds for their existence, and by extension the existence of anything at all. As I said it makes no difference because even if all of this (life in general) was a illusion it doesn't matter because we are confined to our own thoughts and there's nothing we can do about it anyway; therefore we may as well live it as we see fit. Don't get me wrong I'm not even majorly religious but I do believe there is a higher power than humanity. I just can't understand people who are so opposed to such ideas because they rely so heavily on existential evidence when nothing in what we perceive to be reality can be proven, not even the concept of reality itself.
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Farm_Ecology
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#22
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#22
(Original post by DanLorenzo)
I completely agree with you. I too believe that the universe exists and that my mind and the thoughts it produces are real. What I'm saying is since athiests tend to lean towards this whole 'if I can see it then it's real' notion, its kind of ironic that they favour science over religion when neither can really provide convincing grounds for their existence, and by extension the existence of anything at all. As I said it makes no difference because even if all of this (life in general) was a illusion it doesn't matter because we are confined to our own thoughts and there's nothing we can do about it anyway; therefore we may as well live it as we see fit. Don't get me wrong I'm not even majorly religious but I do believe there is a higher power than humanity. I just can't understand people who are so opposed to such ideas because they rely so heavily on existential evidence when nothing in what we perceive to be reality can be proven, not even the concept of reality itself.
Because there are different levels of evidence, which is what we make our decisions on. This could all be an illusion, but as mmmpie said, its a sufficient illusion to be indistinguishable, we can prove that we and the world outside us exists, but there always remains the possibility that it might be wrong. The point being that science can prove certain things convincingly, with different scales than others. Some things are more certain than others, but nothing is absolutely certain. The problem with God or higher powers is that while it may be possible, there is simply no reason to believe in one outside of our own imagination.
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nirvanajon
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#23
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#23
(Original post by GR3YFOXXX)
The question is "why is there religion?"

Religions are tribes .Tribes help people unite for a common cause. Atheism can be a subjective defence against religious manipulation.
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Cringe
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#24
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#24
Its just rebellious behaviour against the truth, like when a kid does everything opposite to what he's told by his parents to break free of control. They're all just big spoiled kids.
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RoyalBlue7
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#25
Well there is one way to prove that God does exist and that the universe was real or not. Try killing yourself if you really want to know.

Posted from TSR Mobile
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Farm_Ecology
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#26
(Original post by StUdEnTIGCSE)
Well there is one way to prove that God does exist and that the universe was real or not. Try killing yourself if you really want to know.
A god could still exist even if there is no afterlife.
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nirvanajon
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#27
(Original post by Cringe)
Its just rebellious behaviour against the truth, like when a kid does everything opposite to what he's told by his parents to break free of control. They're all just big spoiled kids.

What is the truth? If you were born in Pakistan the truth would be Islam. If you were born in Saltlake city the truth would be Jehovah.

Truth is a reflection of our conditioning as human beings. In 1000 years truth will have a whole new paradigm.
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nirvanajon
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#28
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#28
(Original post by StUdEnTIGCSE)
Well there is one way to prove that God does exist and that the universe was real or not. Try killing yourself if you really want to know.

Posted from TSR Mobile

Which God?
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Martyn*
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#29
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#29
The existence of my bicep is real because anyone can touch it.
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Linnerzx
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#30
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#30
(Original post by Farid Jalil)
What do you believe in then?
...
...
...
Nothing
My agnostic friend was talking to me about religion, and when she went to visit a church and how blown away she was by everybody's faith. Like she was so inspired by how SURE everyone was of something, and how that gave them direction. She was going through a difficult time in her life, and said she was thinking maybe about becoming more religious, or spritual perhaps.

She asked me if I had ever felt like that when I was feeling the same way, and I said no. I might not believe in a God, and I might not be able to obtain strength through prayer or religion, but I have myself.

So to answer to you, I believe in myself. I don't care how cheesy it sounds. I don't need some big guy in the sky to solve my problems. I am my problem, and I am my solution. I believe in myself to pull myself out of any sh*tty situation.

Then my friend replied: Now THAT'S inspirational.

:rolleyes:
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tazarooni89
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#31
(Original post by Linnerzx)
So to answer to you, I believe in myself. I don't care how cheesy it sounds. I don't need some big guy in the sky to solve my problems. I am my problem, and I am my solution. I believe in myself to pull myself out of any sh*tty situation.
I don't quite understand. You don't believe that there are things beyond your influence or control which may determine your circumstances, or which may cause you to go into or out of a problematic situation?
It sounds all nice and cheesy on the face of it. I'm just not sure what it actually means.
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ConanAndrews
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#32
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#32
I see all the comments in which people post, saying not everyone is as gullible to believe in religion. Yous should realize that Atheism is a form of Religion.

"Religion is an organized collection of belief systems, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values".
-From good old Wikipedia

I think Atheism falls in line with that explanation?...just goes to show that Atheists don't even know what they follow or what they believe in.

Gullible? Ha! I did laugh quite hard at that. :lol:
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Linnerzx
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#33
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#33
(Original post by tazarooni89)
I don't quite understand. You don't believe that there are things beyond your influence or control which may determine your circumstances, or which may cause you to go into or out of a problematic situation?
It sounds all nice and cheesy on the face of it. I'm just not sure what it actually means.
There are obviously things beyond my control which determine my circumstances. But I don't think it is a higher power.
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CJKay
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#34
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#34
(Original post by Farid Jalil)
It's for the people who don't like to be with the main stream of religion, that's what I think anyways haha!!

It's funny when atheists say what they believe in even though everyone knows they believe in nothing..

There are million of things that exist but we don't know about them and need to find them, so we still need to find God!!

This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
I think I just dropped... all... of my IQ points.

(Original post by ConanAndrews)
I see all the comments in which people post, saying not everyone is as gullible to believe in religion. Yous should realize that Atheism is a form of Religion.

"Religion is an organized collection of belief systems, cultural systems, and world views that relate humanity to spirituality and, sometimes, to moral values".
-From good old Wikipedia

I think Atheism falls in line with that explanation?...just goes to show that Atheists don't even know what they follow or what they believe in.

Gullible? Ha! I did laugh quite hard at that. :lol:
A definition from the slightly more reliable Oxford dictionary:
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods: ideas about the relationship between science and religion
  • a particular system of faith and worship: the world’s great religions
  • a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion: consumerism is the new religion


Atheism is neither of those things. Atheism is an absence of theism (and theism is neither a religion).
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tazarooni89
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#35
(Original post by Linnerzx)
There are obviously things beyond my control which determine my circumstances. But I don't think it is a higher power.
So what does "I believe in myself, I am my problem and my solution" actually mean?
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Dima-Blackburn
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#36
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#36
(Original post by tazarooni89)
So what does "I believe in myself, I am my problem and my solution" actually mean?
I think she means that she's on her own.

It was poorly phrased, but I think that's what she meant. Though I could be wrong...
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ConanAndrews
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(Original post by CJKay)
I think I just dropped... all... of my IQ points.



A definition from the slightly more reliable Oxford dictionary:
the belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods: ideas about the relationship between science and religion
  • a particular system of faith and worship: the world’s great religions
  • a pursuit or interest followed with great devotion: consumerism is the new religion
Atheism is neither of those things. Atheism is an absence of theism (and theism is neither a religion).

It's still a belief none the less as people follow it, If it's a belief it can be a religion, for example. You would some of the less educated (it would seem), creating their own "Atheist Church", which proves my point, some people who follow Atheism, don't even know what they are following, they just want to be different to annoy people.


http://firstchurchofatheism.com/
That would be one out of millions of examples.
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Linnerzx
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(Original post by tazarooni89)
So what does "I believe in myself, I am my problem and my solution" actually mean?
...

Right, I will try my best, at 2am, to try and explain something which I thought was pretty self explanatory.

By 'I am my problem' I don't mean that anything that ever happens to me ever that is bad (or good) is completely because of my own doing. It is mostly going to be a result of external factors (NOT god). I choose to be affected by it, and to what extent. That is the problem. I then find it in myself to get over it and figure out what is best to deal with this problem. That is the solution. I might need the help of my friends or family, but for the most part I will deal with my own problems because I feel I am strong enough to pretty much deal with anything that comes my way.

Of course, some religious people can still have a similar way of thinking, I'm not saying that as soon as the **** hits the fan they just pray to god and think all their questions are answered.

My argument is simply that I disagree with people who say that atheists lack faith, and "don't believe in anything". I have faith in myself. That's all I need.
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Dima-Blackburn
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#39
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(Original post by ConanAndrews)
It's still a belief none the less as people follow it, If it's a belief it can be a religion, for example. You would some of the less educated (it would seem), creating their own "Atheist Church", which proves my point, some people who follow Atheism, don't even know what they are following, they just want to be different to annoy people.
:facepalm: But he's just shown that neither theism nor atheism qualify as religions, so why do you keep insisting that atheism is a religion? If there was a term for the non-belief in Santa Claus, would that also qualify as religion to you? I'm sure most people on Earth don't believe that the Moon has a core that consists of cheese. Does that mean most people are religious in this case as well?
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CJKay
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(Original post by ConanAndrews)
It's still a belief none the less as people follow it, If it's a belief it can be a religion, for example. You would some of the less educated (it would seem), creating their own "Atheist Church", which proves my point, some people who follow Atheism, don't even know what they are following, they just want to be different to annoy people.


http://firstchurchofatheism.com/
That would be one out of millions of examples.
No, atheism is not a religion. That "Church of Atheism" literally exists to provide faith-neutral services such as marriage because it was previously not available as explained here. There is literally nothing to follow in atheism. You become ordained solely to provide those services to others. In atheism, you "follow" wtf you want, because that's pretty much what it is: "you were born this way, live out the way you thought you might instead of what some nonexistent supernatural entity says".
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