Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free

Will North Korea Be Another Iraq/Vietnam? Watch

    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Suetonius)
    The U.S. didn't lose to North Vietnam, let alone to the Soviet Union and Maoist China, the latter of which had actually been co-opted by Nixon in 1972 because of increased tensions between the two communist powers. Up until the U.S. withdrawal in 1973, there were more South Korean troops partaking in ground operations during the Vietnam War - on the side of the Americans - than North Vietnamese. It was only after the U.S. withdrawal that the North Vietnamese army launched a full-fledged invasion of the South. The U.S. was in fact defeated by an indigenous South Vietnamese guerrilla movement, the NLF, which received overwhelming support from the majority of the South Vietnamese population due to America's brutal conduct against Vietnamese civilians stretching back to the end of WWII. North Vietnam was but a sideshow of the Vietnam War.
    Hmm. I was told differently, didn't actually bother following this up and doing my own research...I stand corrected I guess

    But I still maintain that the US is still considerably more powerful than North Korea - although that's not to say North Korea can't do significant damage before the US actually deals with North Korea...
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ss_s95)
    Hmm. I was told differently, didn't actually bother following this up and doing my own research...I stand corrected I guess

    But I still maintain that the US is still considerably more powerful than North Korea - although that's not to say North Korea can't do significant damage before the US actually deals with North Korea...
    Yeah, that's the story you're told by people who want to defend the U.S.' aggressive conduct during that war and who see it as a noble adventure even if it wasn't successful. And yeah I agree about NK.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rooster523)
    Your lack of international politics knowledge is rather amusing. China is NK's ally, why would it invade?

    And to what end would the US invade? To shut them up? North Korea are doing this all purely for propaganda for their own people. If they really were going to launch a nuclear strike, do you think they'd be a massive build up to it? A massive countdown with zero element of surprise?

    Like you said- Iraq was invaded for less, but unlike NK, Iraq posed a plausible threat.
    :lolwut:

    Clearly I know China is NK's ally. But China isn't going to fight against the United States should it invade. The only reason China is propping up the regime is because it provides a buffer to the encroaching power of the United States. It can damned well invade its "ally" (which is really too much to say - maybe "quasi-puppet state" would be more suitable as NK would crumble into the dust should China withdraw all support and aid). China could easily invade and install a new regime - so it is your knowledge and reasoning which is lacking.

    You seem to greatly talk down NK. And yet, SK and the US are taking them seriously, including Japan and whatnot. Otherwise, please do explain the attention, the drills, the increased military presence - even more so, the buildup of Chinese troops massing upon NK's borders.

    Will you still be talking down NK when they actually further advance their nuclear tech? This is why an invasion should occur - it is a now or never situation. As anything else in the future would result in greater devastation and possibly use of nukes.
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rooster523)
    Your lack of international politics knowledge is rather amusing. China is NK's ally, why would it invade?

    And to what end would the US invade? To shut them up? North Korea are doing this all purely for propaganda for their own people. If they really were going to launch a nuclear strike, do you think they'd be a massive build up to it? A massive countdown with zero element of surprise?

    Like you said- Iraq was invaded for less, but unlike NK, Iraq posed a plausible threat.

    The US is out of range. They'd have to hit Guam or Alaska. The tip of Canada is also within range.

    Well I believe, if this does break out, it'll just add on to the list of fallen dictators. I'm sure Kim Jung Il (hope I got that right- or was that his father?) knows that too. He isn't stupid. If he is, his Councillors shouldn't be :P Like you said I think this is for propaganda. I don't see why N.Korea is carrying on with this. It's helping S.Korea improve on its military. S.Korea is economically strong has good relations but lacks in military power. It was its only inferiority to N.Korea. Thanks to these threats S.Korea has excuses for purchasing weaponry from the US and it's doing so. N.Korea would make a big mistake if it acts upon its threats. But throwing them out they can't take them back. It'll be like a dog barking and suddenly turning away with its tail between its legs. It'll look bad- VERY bad. But if it attacks... it'll be worse.
    Let's see what happens.
    ill the Kim family choose pride over its people or will it be the people over pride?

    As for the Iraq issue... that is a completely different story. Literally. I don't think Sadam was right either. I don't like him. In fact I hate him. I have personal reasons for this. But I don't think the US acted accordingly.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Suetonius)
    The U.S. didn't lose to North Vietnam, let alone to the Soviet Union and Maoist China, the latter of which had actually been co-opted by Nixon in 1972 because of increased tensions between the two communist powers. Up until the U.S. withdrawal in 1973, there were more South Korean troops partaking in ground operations during the Vietnam War - on the side of the Americans - than North Vietnamese. It was only after the U.S. withdrawal that the North Vietnamese army launched a full-fledged invasion of the South. The U.S. was in fact defeated by an indigenous South Vietnamese guerrilla movement, the NLF - with some logistical and military backing from the North - which received overwhelming support from the majority of the South Vietnamese population; largely due to America's brutal conduct against Vietnamese civilians stretching back to the end of WWII. North Vietnam was but a sideshow of the Vietnam War. The USSR and China weren't even that.

    Edit. Indeed, the U.S.' false belief that the North was the driving force behind the insurgency is one of the reasons for the American defeat. They invested billions of dollars and more bombs than were dropped on Japan during WWII on the aerial bombing of North Vietnam, and in spite of that bombing the insurgency still didn't cease but in fact got stronger. It diverted their attention from the real problem which was that a superpower was wiping out a whole rural civilization in the South with its incessant attacks on villages and the deaths and displacement of millions of civilians.
    Where did you derive this interpretation from, and why were you reading about the Vietnam War? Asking out of mere academic curiosity.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    Wow we're comparing north Korea to Iraq to Vietnam erm... Those wars were, will and are completely different scenarios outcomes and tactics.
    Offline

    2
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Member731)
    I'm sure Kim Jung Il (hope I got that right- or was that his father?).
    Yep, that was poppa Kim Current leader is Kim Jong-un.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by HumanSupremacist)
    :lolwut:

    Clearly I know China is NK's ally. But China isn't going to fight against the United States should it invade. The only reason China is propping up the regime is because it provides a buffer to the encroaching power of the United States. It can damned well invade its "ally" (which is really too much to say - maybe "quasi-puppet state" would be more suitable as NK would crumble into the dust should China withdraw all support and aid). China could easily invade and install a new regime - so it is your knowledge and reasoning which is lacking.

    You seem to greatly talk down NK. And yet, SK and the US are taking them seriously, including Japan and whatnot. Otherwise, please do explain the attention, the drills, the increased military presence - even more so, the buildup of Chinese troops massing upon NK's borders.

    Will you still be talking down NK when they actually further advance their nuclear tech? This is why an invasion should occur - it is a now or never situation. As anything else in the future would result in greater devastation and possibly use of nukes.
    Yes, I know why China is NK's ally and I know it CAN invade, I'm just saying it won't. Using NK as a buffer to US power and then intentionally removing that buffer seems somewhat counter-intuitive no? So for you to say my knowledge is lacking, seeing as you've only interpreted information, is rather amusing.

    And how do I explain the military drills?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17175175 - 2012 'North Korea warning as US and S Korea begin joint drill'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14541988 - 2011 'North Korea fury at South Korea-US military exercise'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11855162 - 2010 'South Korea-US military exercises stoke tensions'

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/10/wo...orea.html?_r=0 - 2009 'U.S. and S. Korea Start Military Maneuvers, Angering North'


    My point is that every single year the US and SK do military drills together and every single year, NK get all arsey about it. The difference is, this time NK have decided they really really don't like it and are trying to put a stop to it- by threatening violence.

    And as for the increased military presence- better safe than sorry.

    Edit- forgot to add that in 1994 NK threatened to 'turn Seoul into a sea of fire'
    and in 2002 stated it would 'mercilessly wipe out its enemies'
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by British-Student)
    Yep, that was poppa Kim Current leader is Kim Jong-un.
    Thanks!
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by HumanSupremacist)
    You underestimate North Korea. Sure, if the US nukes them to oblivion, they will stand no chance - but will the US nuke them, especially with the close proximity of South Korea, its ally, which will undoubtedly be affected by the aftermath of nukes dropping on NK.
    Just carpet bomb them then
    Offline

    4
    ReputationRep:
    Why is this even a question? Us need to just bomb them and kill them all and im not trolling, why let someone give you threats and possibly attack you? Before it gets to that stage cut the source out completely.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rooster523)
    Yes, I know why China is NK's ally and I know it CAN invade, I'm just saying it won't. Using NK as a buffer to US power and then intentionally removing that buffer seems somewhat counter-intuitive no? So for you to say my knowledge is lacking, seeing as you've only interpreted information, is rather amusing.

    And how do I explain the military drills?

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17175175 - 2012 'North Korea warning as US and S Korea begin joint drill'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14541988 - 2011 'North Korea fury at South Korea-US military exercise'

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-11855162 - 2010 'South Korea-US military exercises stoke tensions'

    http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/10/wo...orea.html?_r=0 - 2009 'U.S. and S. Korea Start Military Maneuvers, Angering North'


    My point is that every single year the US and SK do military drills together and every single year, NK get all arsey about it. The difference is, this time NK have decided they really really don't like it and are trying to put a stop to it- by threatening violence.

    And as for the increased military presence- better safe than sorry.

    Edit- forgot to add that in 1994 NK threatened to 'turn Seoul into a sea of fire'
    and in 2002 stated it would 'mercilessly wipe out its enemies'
    Ah, but it needn't just remove the buffer. What it would do is invade/take out Kim and generals and then install a less belligerent and more influenced (by China) regime. That's the whole point of invading/taking out Kim and others - in order to further solidify the buffer, thereby placating the US, who will then back off when it sees that NK is no longer wishing to attack its interests.
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by `Jts)
    The USA lost to Vietnam for crying out loud. If it was just the USA, then the USA would lose. But, if the USA had their allies fight with them, they'd win for sure.

    However, I think North Korea would attempt to nuke the USA first and then USA would nuke them.
    Do you understand why they lost?
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    As everyone has said, this situation is different to Iraq/Vietnam. NK don't have the help of Soviets and PRC. You have to remember theres South Korea that has a military atleast 50 years ahead of the north. Without the north using nukes, the south could easily take them on. The US is just a reassurance in the case that the North fire nukes. Also the North Koreans hate Japan too, with US bases in Japan its possible that an attack would be large in Japan. With SK, Japan and USA, I don't think NK stands a chance. However it would be impossible to capture/unify North Korea imo. The citizens are brainwashed and would probably refuse to surrender and fight to the end like the Japanese in WW2.

    That said NK is all talk, they know the US can destory them at will with press of 1 button.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by `Jts)
    The USA lost to Vietnam for crying out loud. If it was just the USA, then the USA would lose. But, if the USA had their allies fight with them, they'd win for sure.

    However, I think North Korea would attempt to nuke the USA first and then USA would nuke them.
    You may want to do a little bit of research on your claim about the Vietnam war. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War If. And it's a big if that war was declared on North Korea, it will be short, sharp and quick. And hopefully the big mess from Iraq would never materialise. (Getting rid of any Ba'ath Party members from key positions.)
    Offline

    0
    ReputationRep:
    Well theyve already been there and the US once again had their asses handed to them...
    As that rule goes you cant win the war without the will of the people and the fact that the people of DPRK are brain washed drones kind of renders it impossible... you can decapitate their leadership but its more than likely it will simply send it into a failed state. Although id be interested to see exactly how it played out so long as britain didnt get dragged into the ensuing cluster ****.
 
 
 
Reply
Submit reply
TSR Support Team

We have a brilliant team of more than 60 Support Team members looking after discussions on The Student Room, helping to make it a fun, safe and useful place to hang out.

Updated: April 15, 2013
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • Poll
    Would you like to hibernate through the winter months?
    Useful resources
  • See more of what you like on The Student Room

    You can personalise what you see on TSR. Tell us a little about yourself to get started.

  • The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

    Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

    Quick reply
    Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.