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End of university themed parties such as 'Geeks and 'Sluts' and 'Rappers and Slappers Watch

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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    I keep hearing the argument that women have the choice to take part (and men too, but it's the women who are focused on) but I don't really think it's the case. You kind of have three options:
    Go and take part (could result in you feeling disgusted at yourself etc.)
    Go and don't take part (which in the situation of a sports club or whatever will probably lead to you being alienated and was part of the reason I quit the pool team)
    Or don't go (which isn't fun, and can also lead to you being alienated).
    If it's a private event then which endorses an attitude you don't agree with then you have no right to barge in and request it be changed purely so you can be happy. That's like going to a child's play park and ordering it to be demolished to make way for a supermarket you like.

    By removing the genders from the two options given by the title (Angels and Devils was a Carnage theme last year wasn't it? That doesn't promote one gender being more 'sexed up' than the other) it promotes a proper choice where any woman or man can choose which of the two options they want instead of feeling like they're forced into what they're not comfortable with or alienated for not doing it.
    I agree on the option of choice but you're focusing upon the thematics of the costume parties as demeaning rather than encouraging people to have a choice to try the opposite option of wear, eg. a man going a slapper or a woman going as a geek.

    And a lot of people are making the comment that it's only a few women that are bothered, well this doesn't affect the ones that aren't bothered. They can still fancy dress as they like and dress as 'hoes' or whatever, just it'll be called something that doesn't imply that it has to be the women that dress like that and makes the women who are complaining and uncomfortable happy.
    I'm in two minds about that and I can see the reasoning behind it but I still think it's just an excuse for doublespeak.
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    Lads and girls seem to enjoy it just as much?

    And if someone doesn't.. male or female, there are usually plenty of other pubs and clubs without fancy dress that night, you are not FORCED to dress up and go. If women honestly don't like it, don't go, it will be a sausage fest and the bar/club will think twice next time.
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    People find the parties offensive, and there are lots of other themes available that won't offend people.

    If it doesn't offend you, that's fine. It doesn't particularly offend me either. But it's not like having another theme would affect the enjoyment of you or me - but it may make it more enjoyable for somebody else. Would you really be that put out by having to dress as, I dunno, cops and robbers or something, rather than geeks and sluts?
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    (Original post by thunder_chunky)
    Calling it a "lads culture" is pretty one sided. That said I don't think it would make a difference. Whoever is making this decision clearly is biased in one way or another.
    I despise the fact that its called 'Lad's culture. As if girls don't voluntarily dress the way they do.
    Just a bunch of feminists looking to blame men for everything as per usual
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    I find these parties fun and I also don't agree with banning things left right and centre. I see the arguments on the other side though... but I think if people don't like these parties they should not go to them - boycott them effectively. That way they could die out in popularity but without it being enforced on anybody.
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    (Original post by dendodge)
    People find the parties offensive, and there are lots of other themes available that won't offend people.

    If it doesn't offend you, that's fine. It doesn't particularly offend me either. But it's not like having another theme would affect the enjoyment of you or me - but it may make it more enjoyable for somebody else. Would you really be that put out by having to dress as, I dunno, cops and robbers or something, rather than geeks and sluts?
    Sure but these nights wouldn't be popular if females didn't dress up and go. I can see how it can be seen as being stereotypical but if that many females disliked it that they stopped going it would be soon have been changed by owners?
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    (Original post by edithwashere)
    Not one that defines you in a derogatory term as a sex object, though.
    If I find it offensive it becomes derogatory. Same logic can be applied to just about anything.


    :confused: What do you think it implies? "It's one thing for private establishments to hold whatever parties they wish, BUT it's another thing when it's university endorsed." My point was that I think the NUS is right in distancing itself from such events, should people confuse them with endorsing such behaviour and language. Private establishments can do what they like.
    You strongly suggested that private establishments shouldn't be allowed to do what they like in the way you phrased yourself.

    I got turned away from a geeks and sluts party at uni for dressing as a geek. Just sayin'.
    Well I don't agree with that and in that case I would defend the right to dress up as either one. However, if it is a private venue then I wouldn't be so quick to agree in that case as it is a private dress code. It's like going to an S&M club wearing a beach volleyball top and shorts - its just not allowed because it reduces the meaning of the theme.
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    (Original post by Kiss)
    If it's a private event then which endorses an attitude you don't agree with then you have no right to barge in and request it be changed purely so you can be happy. That's like going to a child's play park and ordering it to be demolished to make way for a supermarket you like.
    And it isn't a private event, it's a student union event put on either in one of the student union bars or the student union nightclub. I go to Lancaster and I never objected to the nights put on by Revolution or Elements or even the Carlton when it was still open, just the ones by Sugarhouse as they're supposed to represent students while making some of them feel alienated.

    I agree on the option of choice but you're focusing upon the thematics of the costume parties as demeaning rather than encouraging people to have a choice to try the opposite option of wear, eg. a man going a slapper or a woman going as a geek.
    It's not a real choice though is it? There is an implied choice, but if you don't go as the one that matches up with your gender stereotype then you're made to feel alienated or as someone else pointed out you could even be refused entry.

    I'm in two minds about that and I can see the reasoning behind it but I still think it's just an excuse for doublespeak.
    I don't understand how you think it's doublespeak. It removes all gender stereotypes, therefore it works to help + protect men and women even though it's only the women who have formally complained so far (or at least they're the only ones we've heard about). It doesn't affect those who don't complain because they can still choose to dress in the same way they did before but it represents those that were opposed to it.
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    (Original post by Kiss)
    No it wasn't, you said it yourself:

    "It's one thing for private establishments to hold whatever parties they wish...."

    Now what does that imply?
    It implies that it's alright for private establishments to hold whatever parties they wish.
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    Why the sports team hate?
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    (Original post by gozatron)
    Why the sports team hate?
    Because the majority of them are gob****es. The people on the teams are the main reasons I didn't join the football and rugby teams at uni.

    Hazing and very camp drinking games is not my idea of fun.


    This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
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    (Original post by Kiss)
    Well it presupposes that only men can be 'geeks', 'pimps' or 'rappers' and can't be sluts or hoes. You're looking at it from a solitary angle that only affects women. I agree that it can be construed as offensive and can demean women but since you're so inclined to a one sided perspective I'm afraid I'll have to agree to disagree, though coming from you I'm not so surprised since you don't give two ****s about how sexism affects men as well.
    The gender division in these categories is obvious. If a man dresses as a slut or a hoe on one of these nights, he would be deliberately subverting these categories, and it is more a choice for him to do that. I don't believe many men would do this because most people would be bound by the gender categories set out so just as women feel bound to be sluts and hoes, men would feel bound to be geeks and pimps.

    The 'pimps and hoes' category is also an offensive way of looking at sex workers and their abusers. It's laughing at a situation where many women are forced into prostitution and are kept by people who want to exploit them. It's then getting students to act out that power relation according to their gender as if it doesn't really happen to people.
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    (Original post by gozatron)
    Why the sports team hate?
    I think a lot of the time it's the sports teams that make people feel alienated if they don't take part. I know it's part of the reason I quit the pool team.
    It's not all of them and and it's not only them, but there is a big culture, especially within football/rugby and from my experience very heavily in bar sports. I was accused of not being 'dedicated enough' to bar sports by the men's darts captain (and I didn't play darts) because I missed two out of six socials in one term (one because I didn't like the nightclub they picked - my fault - and one because I didn't like the theme of the SU nightclub that were supposed to be representing me!)
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    (Original post by ArtGoblin)
    The gender division in these categories is obvious. If a man dresses as a slut or a hoe on one of these nights, he would be deliberately subverting these categories, and it is more a choice for him to do that. I don't believe many men would do this because most people would be bound by the gender categories set out so just as women feel bound to be sluts and hoes, men would feel bound to be geeks and pimps.

    The 'pimps and hoes' category is also an offensive way of looking at sex workers and their abusers. It's laughing at a situation where many women are forced into prostitution and are kept by people who want to exploit them. It's then getting students to act out that power relation according to their gender as if it doesn't really happen to people.
    That last paragraph is utterly ridiculous. Do you really think that is what people think? Or is it an excuse for the girls who want to, to dress in sexy clothes and an excuse for the lads to wear elaborate costumes or suits on a night out.

    It's just a bit of fun from both sides and the students attending don't need moralising on their behalf.


    This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
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    (Original post by ArtGoblin)
    Yes, many do. Local nightclubs also often have 'NUS' nights where you have to be a student to enter.

    The study was an in-depth qualitative one so it is unlikely to be representative of the female student population. However, if it was a large scale quantitative study the data wouldn't have been as rich and as interesting as it is, so it's a trade off they had to made. Although 40 women isn't a lot, it is still enough to show what is going on inside universities, and I think most of us who go to/went to university recently will recognise the culture they are talking about.
    ah, i see. Although i do believe you are right in saying it wouldn't be as rich or interesting, i still believe that its wrong to draw any conclusions on THIS study. i'm not discounting their experiences, however consider how many universities there are, consider how many people, women in these universities. Where did they get these women? how did they pick these women out? Is perhaps Chloe Warden biased in her views? who knows and imo until they carry out plenty of studies i'll take her conclusions with a pinch of salt.

    furthermore 'Pimps and Hoes' themed nights are plain dumb and rude, however i hardly believe it glamorises the whole thing. It's made in light humor(if that makes sense) i believe everyone knows that being a pimp and a pimp's hoe sucks ass.

    also, about nightclubs, so i don't get it, does that mean that some unis have built in nightclubs?
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    People overreact about these parties.

    I don't generally feel comfortable dressing like a "slut" so I just normally choose the other option and everyone finds it hilarious.
    Who says girls can't go as a geek or a rapper? no one.
    It's girl's who chose what they wear and what they feel comfortable in.
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    The problem I have with stories like this is that they always focus on the problems for the women. Yes, the women may be groped. But it's like those rape adverts that always seem to be on spotify and you sometimes see on TSR. They're all geared towards the male being the abuser, and that's just not accurate. It's not encompassing the full story. I'm sure men have to deal with women's groping and the like as well from time to time.

    I'm not saying that what men can do to women isn't unacceptable, but I think the daily mail especially needs to look at both sides of it. And these parties are only supposed to be fun. Sure, they probably do get out of hand sometimes, but as long as there's adequate security, I don't see what the huge fuss is about.
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    In my opinion I think it's all a massive overreaction. I sometimes choose not to dress up (because I'm a bit lazy) but have never once felt 'alienated' and when I do I've never felt degraded, it's all a bit of fun.

    in a less opinionated comment, where do you draw the line of what is offensive? Do you ban all types of fancy dress...? Now don't get me wrong I think it'll be quite hard to find someone offended by a smurf but there is probably one person out there.. Should that go as well?! No. Obviously not. People shouldn't be so easily pressured into doing something, if you don't want to, don't. If you do great! Why does it really matter...
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    (Original post by Mess.)
    That last paragraph is utterly ridiculous. Do you really think that is what people think? Or is it an excuse for the girls who want to, to dress in sexy clothes and an excuse for the lads to wear elaborate costumes or suits on a night out.

    It's just a bit of fun from both sides and the students attending don't need moralising on their behalf.


    This was posted from The Student Room's iPhone/iPad App
    I wouldn't take part for that reason. I don't think many people care about sex workers and how they came to be in that situation, so they don't care if their costume is offensive about that particular group. However, I think it is an issue that needs drawing attention to, so I would question anyone who thought it was funny about why they were doing it.

    The way I see student politics is making an tiny ideal society within the small community we have while at university. There are certain things that are banned at university that would never be banned in the outside world e.g. bottled water, Nestle products. It's a way of testing what we want from the world and how to make it achievable. If we take this view, it does not seem unreasonable to stop dressing up nights demeaning women and laughing at vulnerable groups. Women have to experience being objectified every day - I don't see why their university - which is supposed to be about providing the best opportunities for everyone - should add to that.
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    (Original post by ArtGoblin)
    I wouldn't take part for that reason. I don't think many people care about sex workers and how they came to be in that situation, so they don't care if their costume is offensive about that particular group. However, I think it is an issue that needs drawing attention to, so I would question anyone who thought it was funny about why they were doing it.
    If we're going super pedantic and super offended by things, the 'Geeks' aspect of it offends people who were bullied in high school or picked upon for being intelligent. You have to take things with a pinch of salt, otherwise you get into ridiculous proportions of what is offensive. Someone could find my display picture offensive because it demeans the struggling ecology of frogs in the Amazon rainforest which is getting cut down, and thus my picture must be banned.


    The way I see student politics is making an tiny ideal society within the small community we have while at university. There are certain things that are banned at university that would never be banned in the outside world e.g. bottled water, Nestle products. It's a way of testing what we want from the world and how to make it achievable. If we take this view, it does not seem unreasonable to stop dressing up nights demeaning women and laughing at vulnerable groups. Women have to experience being objectified every day - I don't see why their university - which is supposed to be about providing the best opportunities for everyone - should add to that.
    You have bottled water and nestle products banned from your university? :confused:

    What if women they want to go to parties like that? You're ignoring their choice as much as you're ignoring your own hypocrisy.
 
 
 
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