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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    Again, optional.

    You dont have to give birth.

    (Original post by rosee92)
    When people decide not to have children it's rarely because of fearing the pain of childbirth. Plus the possible complications that can arise from having children (y'know like, dying) sorta outweigh being kicked in the gonads.

    Reminds me of a private health provider I heard of that wouldn't pay out for maternity care because it was "self inflicted", having children is a biological imperative, it's an anthropological inevitability.

    If you're having the problems with girls that you mentioned in your OP, you should look for less high maintenance girlfriends. No one I know expects their boyfriend to be rich/gorgeous/stoic all at once. I feel guilty when my boyfriend pays for dinner!

    It's an anthropological inevitability, as this person has just pointed out. Women are made to carry on genetics.
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    (Original post by Octohedral)
    I completely agree - the second line is why women fought for equality in the first place. It's human nature to want more than a comfortable life as a housewife.

    I guess the OP is saying that women have the choice, and men don't.
    Tbh this is also why i didnt bring up child birth, because I knew I would get **** for it by angry women on TSR.
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    This sort of discussion will be better in society.
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    (Original post by Octohedral)
    I completely agree - the second line is why women fought for equality in the first place. It's human nature to want more than a comfortable life as a housewife.

    I guess the OP is saying that women have the choice, and men don't.
    Yeh there's no hostility towards housewives like there is to stay at home dads apart from radical feminists perhaps.

    Someone has to raise the kids!
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    bull****. women will always have it harder.

    for one we are like top of the food chain. womens only natural predator is men.

    how many times have have you been in a situation where you based any part of your decision making on the possibility of it ending in rape? not you doing the rape obviously.

    you have to get used to 'new' ****. i mean it must take a while to get to love those things with all the varieties of condition and hygiene they knock about in.

    periods, dont even get me started.

    once again that power to physically intimidate someone, no level of intelligence or reason can reason with fear when it takes over.

    basically in any lawless enviroment your just getting raped or enslaved.

    aint nobody got time for that.
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    (Original post by rosee92)
    Reminds me of a private health provider I heard of that wouldn't pay out for maternity care because it was "self inflicted", having children is a biological imperative, it's an anthropological inevitability.
    There are so many families out there where they have adopted children. Take Brad Pitts/Angelina Joli.

    So your argument is folly.

    Having children is a choice, not a 'biological imperative',
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    (Original post by pinkbullets)
    I think you've been aiming for girls with massively high expectations. I don't expect my boyfriend to provide for me,
    I expect from myself to be able to provide for a lass if needs be, without her being dependent on me or expecting it, of course.

    (Original post by pinkbullets)
    I don't expect my boyfriend to look like a pin up
    Nor will your boyfriend expect you to look like a pin up, presumably. The same pressures are existent and for males it seems to becoming an increasing problem. Each sex seemingly reacts to the pressures in a similar manner even though it's expected that males shouldn't be too bothered, it goes back to keeping their feelings to themselves.

    (Original post by pinkbullets)
    and I find it very very unhealthy when he bottles up his emotions
    It is unhealthy, but who are guys supposed to go to with emotional issues? Being emotionally open with your partner, especially if you have a lot on your chest all the time, risks jeopardising the relationship. Women say they want a sensitive man, but by that all they mean is they want someone who will listen to their own issues and act as a source of reasoning and stability. An emotionally open male is not that source of stability.

    (Original post by pinkbullets)
    I just want him to be happy: I don't care if he has a massively successful career (it's his life not mine).
    This goes back to him wanting to be able to provide for you if needs be, but also that he will often have too much pride to accept the same thing in return from his girlfriend. He will also be heckled by his peers if he is not as successful as his partner :lol:

    I feel most of all that guys are increasingly losing oportunities in which they can extrapolate a sense of 'masculinity'.
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    (Original post by consumed by stuff)
    bull****. women will always have it harder.

    for one we are like top of the food chain. womens only natural predator is men.

    how many times have have you been in a situation where you based any part of your decision making on the possibility of it ending in rape? not you doing the rape obviously.

    you have to get used to 'new' ****. i mean it must take a while to get to love those things with all the varieties of condition and hygiene they knock about in.

    periods, dont even get me started.

    once again that power to physically intimidate someone, no level of intelligence or reason can reason with fear when it takes over.

    basically in any lawless enviroment your just getting raped or enslaved.

    aint nobody got time for that.
    I can see your point.

    But this doesn't stop some women dressing like skets on a saturday night, does it? It's like they are inviting unwanted attention.

    And women love cocks.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    We are expected:

    - to be successful, independent and able to provide for a woman (if in a r.ship). Every girl I have been with, eventually expects me to pay for everything.
    - With pin up boys like Ronaldo etc, the pressure on men to look good is a bigger deal now then in the past. So that they have a heads up in the dating game. A LOT of women on the other hand, can get sex much more easily then men.
    - Acquire status, respect from our peers otherwise are considered weak.
    - Not meant o show weakness/emotions to anyone. As a result men bottle things up more easily.

    Failing any of the 3 (not so much point 2), the man is normally treated as a loser.

    Do you agree that men have it harder then women?

    Discuss.
    Lol have you seen the Heat/Bulls score, 18-4.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    Well you dont have to have children at all. World is over populated anyway.

    Or can adopt.

    It's totally, optional., whereas for many of the things I have listed for men its a requirement.
    You ridiculous man, most of the things you quoted are also optional.

    You don't need status or anything one of the things you listed to survive, you just feel you need to do it to get women so it is often in fact self-imposed. You don't even need a woman, you just want one.

    None of the things you listed are a requirement for anything, especially given the amount of friends I have that have gone/are going out with complete deadbeats.

    Lessons:

    - expectation and requirement are not the same thing.
    - double standards are extremely irritating
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    (Original post by Mockery)
    It is unhealthy, but who are guys supposed to go to with emotional issues? Being emotionally open with your partner, especially if you have a lot on your chest all the time, risks jeopardising the relationship. Women say they want a sensitive man, but by that all they mean is they want someone who will listen to their own issues and act as a source of reasoning and stability. An emotionally open male is not that source of stability.
    .
    I found this to be the case in my last relationship. Everytime I would moan she would brand it as annoying, and told me to man up, but when she did, it was "ok".
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    Swings and roundabouts -- there are many pros and cons of each. Fortunately most are societal and, with hopeful thinking, are possible to be equalised.

    However, sexism exists to a massive extent and women still have a long way to go. Even just look at how differently young and baby boys and girls are treated. No logic whatsoever, yet have very significant consequences on girls' motor skill development, and boys' ability to show emotion.

    A young sibling of mine is a very talented rugby player and since coming to secondary school is not permitted to play -- just because she is a girl. Where's the fairness in that?

    Yes, men do have pressure to succeed, but women have to struggle to be allowed to.
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    (Original post by Nerd2)
    Lol have you seen the Heat/Bulls score, 18-4.
    Nah, not betting atm.

    This **** is more fun.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    Nah, not betting atm.

    This **** is more fun.
    lol fair enough
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    (Original post by Nomes89)
    You ridiculous man, most of the things you quoted are also optional.

    You don't need status or anything one of the things you listed to survive, you just feel you need to do it to get women so it is often in fact self-imposed. You don't even need a woman, you just want one.

    None of the things you listed are a requirement for anything, especially given the amount of friends I have that have gone/are going out with complete deadbeats.

    Lessons:

    - expectation and requirement are not the same thing.
    - double standards are extremely irritating
    To be honest, I am more concerned about my career these days, but thanks for telling me that I am desperate for a woman.

    How old are you?
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    (Original post by Nerd2)
    lol fair enough
    ****s sake point spread is too high now.

    CAnt bet on the heat.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    There are so many families out there where they have adopted children. Take Brad Pitts/Angelina Joli.

    So your argument is folly.

    Having children is a choice, not a 'biological imperative',
    If it wasn't we wouldn't have been given the tools to do it or the hormones that encourage the urge to have children (this is more the case in women, to do with estrogen production.

    All mammals are programmed to mate because their species need to survive. If they didn't have this urge then the world would be run by frogs and birds and insects who lay eggs. Humans and all other mammals would've died out thousands of years ago because we'd have said "nah I'll just play with these rocks instead of mating."

    It may also be easier to "choose" in western society, but what about women in Africa who don't have access to contraception and get forced into sex by their husbands and cannot help but have endless children, of which several will die in infancy.


    I still think your overall argument is focused on a very narrow part of society, like the MIC or TOWIE set who expect guys to be like that.
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    (Original post by Leonie_Kavanagh)
    It's an anthropological inevitability, as this person has just pointed out. Women are made to carry on genetics.
    Childbirth is still optional though.
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    There's stuff about being a man that sucks and stuff about being a woman that sucks. There's no real way of comparing the two, and trying to decide who has it "worse" is ridiculous. There's no objective measure of suffering. Rather than having a ridiculous, swooning argument along these lines: "but vagina people have it so awful" "no but penis people have it worse" "well vaginas have children come out of them" "well penises hurt when you punch them" "well if you weren't - " "if you didn't - " "MY SUFFERING IS MORE VALID THAN YOUR SUFFERING"...how about we say that both gender's issues are valid, worth talking about, and worth fixing?

    Seriously. Silly discussion. It's like asking whether cancer patients or AIDs patients have it worse. Although hopefully none of you think being a man or a woman is as bad as either cancer or AIDs.
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    (Original post by fat_hobbit)
    I found this to be the case in my last relationship. Everytime I would moan she would brand it as annoying, and told me to man up, but when she did, it was "ok".
    to think most of the **** you put up with all so she would have sex with you. thats like tthe only major power women have over men, withholding sex. you can only use it with certain men or they just get the **** outta there.
 
 
 
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