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What effect will an EU referendum have on Ukip? watch

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    (Original post by Feels)
    He wants a break.
    Then he should reconsider his chosen profession.
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    Then he should reconsider his chosen profession.
    Why? its post-election , the losers aren't doing anything.
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    Then he should reconsider his chosen profession.
    He'll be back. Don;'t worry about that.
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    (Original post by Feels)
    Why? its post-election , the losers aren't doing anything.
    UKIP should be doing a lot. Principally, they should be considering what is the point of their continued existence when their supposed raison d'etre - leaving the EU - is going to be decided three years before the next general election.

    If they run again, they need to stop being an anti-EU party. In that case, they need to consider what other sort of party they want to be or could be successful as.

    If they want to remain an anti-EU party, they have to forget about contesting elections and start preparing now to win the referendum for the Outies. And if they want to do that, they need to seriously consider whether the vast majority of their membership - probably including many of their candidates and officers - is actually an asset or a liability to that campaign, because right now I suspect the party on net is a liability.

    It certainly looks like UKIP is a vanity project for Farage and that he does not really care about leaving the EU; at least, it is no longer his primary concern. That's OK if his vanity leads him to get us out of the EU but it is not OK if he is just tired and wants a break but is not willing to give up his power to someone who can do what needs to be done.
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    UKIP should be doing a lot. Principally, they should be considering what is the point of their continued existence when their supposed raison d'etre - leaving the EU - is going to be decided three years before the next general election.

    If they run again, they need to stop being an anti-EU party.

    If they want to remain an anti-EU party, they have to forget about contesting elections and start preparing now to win the referendum for the Outies. And if they want to do that, they need to seriously consider whether the vast majority of their membership - probably including many of their candidates and officers - is actually an asset or a liability, because right now I suspect the party as a whole is a liability.

    It certainly looks like UKIP is a vanity project for Farage and that he does not really care about leaving the EU; at least, it is no longer his primary concern.
    With the Conservatives running this referendum we won't leave, everybody knows that, its just a formality because Cameron promised it.

    But lets just assume the referndum is done fairly and we vote to stay in, we'll still have millions of people who wanted to leave, UKIP represents that viewpoint, UKIP principle is for Britain to be a self-governing nation with full sovereignty, while we're in the EU this is impossible so they will always, always oppose it. They're not just a one issue party either, look at their manifesto, they have a lot of libertarian policies which don't have a voice in British politics.

    That comment about Farage just proves you haven't done your research and are just talking out your arse, Farage was a founding member of UKIP in 1993, he has worked tirelessly for decades from since they were a complete nothing party, growing them until getting the third largest share of the vote in the general election, its not a vanity project, its his life's work.
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    (Original post by Feels)
    With the Conservatives running this referendum we won't leave, everybody knows that, its just a formality because Cameron promised it.

    But lets just assume the referndum is done fairly and we vote to stay in, we'll still have millions of people who wanted to leave, UKIP represents that viewpoint, UKIP principle is for Britain to be a self-governing nation with full sovereignty, while we're in the EU this is impossible so they will always, always oppose it. They're not just a one issue party either, look at their manifesto, they have a lot of libertarian policies which don't have a voice in British politics.

    That comment about Farage just proves you haven't done your research and are just talking out your arse, Farage was a founding member of UKIP in 1993, he has worked tirelessly for decades from since they were a complete nothing party, growing them until getting the third largest share of the vote in the general election, its not a vanity project, its his life's work.
    ukip should keep quiet until after 2017.
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    (Original post by WillNegForReps)
    ukip should keep quiet until after 2017.
    They probably will .
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    (Original post by Feels)
    They probably will .
    we can only pray. for this country's sake
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    (Original post by WillNegForReps)
    we can only pray. for this country's sake
    UKIP aren't the problem, look at who is in government.
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    (Original post by Feels)
    With the Conservatives running this referendum we won't leave, everybody knows that, its just a formality because Cameron promised it.

    But lets just assume the referndum is done fairly and we vote to stay in, we'll still have millions of people who wanted to leave, UKIP represents that viewpoint, UKIP principle is for Britain to be a self-governing nation with full sovereignty, while we're in the EU this is impossible so they will always, always oppose it.
    Then UKIP is finished because the average person is not going to buy UKIP campaigning for a referendum, getting one, losing, and then saying no no we want to have another go, until we get it right. People for whom the EU is a top issue will not give up but those people are far too few to win an election, or they would not have needed to form a new party.

    They're not just a one issue party either, look at their manifesto, they have a lot of libertarian policies which don't have a voice in British politics.
    Turning UKIP into a libertarian party is a fine idea from my perspective. One problem: it has spent the last five years turning itself from a libertarian party into a non-libertarian party in order to pick up votes from the anti-immigration working class. UKIP has already rejected this strategy because they want to win seats rather than be a pressure group.

    That comment about Farage just proves you haven't done your research and are just talking out your arse, Farage was a founding member of UKIP in 1993, he has worked tirelessly for decades from since they were a complete nothing party, growing them until getting the third largest share of the vote in the general election, its not a vanity project, its his life's work.
    I don't doubt that Farage would, if he could choose costlessly, leave the EU. However his life's work has not been leaving the EU, his life's work has been building UKIP. If he is forced to choose between them, especially when any credit for leaving will be assigned by history to David Cameron, I am not so sure he is going to choose leaving the EU.

    I think there's a good chance he is going to make decisions that are not optimal for winning the referendum but which place UKIP in a better position to continue as a mainstream nationalist party indefinitely, like Marine Le Pen's Front National.
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    Then UKIP is finished because the average person is not going to buy UKIP campaigning for a referendum, getting one, losing, and then saying no no we want to have another go, until we get it right. People for whom the EU is a top issue will not give up but those people are far too few to win an election, or they would not have needed to form a new party.


    Turning UKIP into a libertarian party is a fine idea from my perspective. One problem: it has spent the last five years turning itself from a libertarian party into a non-libertarian party in order to pick up votes from the anti-immigration working class. UKIP has already rejected this strategy because they want to win seats rather than be a pressure group.


    I don't doubt that Farage would, if he could choose costlessly, leave the EU. However his life's work has not been leaving the EU, his life's work has been building UKIP. If he is forced to choose between them, especially when any credit for leaving will be assigned by history to David Cameron, I am not so sure he is going to choose leaving the EU.

    I think there's a good chance he is going to make decisions that are not optimal for winning the referendum but which place UKIP in a better position to continue as a mainstream nationalist party indefinitely, like Marine Le Pen's Front National.
    UKIP policy isn't an EU referndum, if they were in government as a majority they would simply leave outright, a referndum is the next best thing , read about what UKIP actually wants and not what the media says.
 
 
 

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