Turn on thread page Beta

Sturgeon is kicking Cameron's arse watch

    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    I don't want Scotland to go, but I hate the Tories vastly more than her. I can't believe people are so gullible to believe the media coverage, slavish to their line, that Labour were the party to destroy union and they were the guardians of it. Didn't people follow the whole thing? From when Sturgeon's private mail was leaked saying she''d rather have the Tories-why would that be? Didn't they consider the amount of Tory support in Scotland these days and their motivations for losing the Scots to rule with majorities more easily in England?
    yer going lol
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    (Original post by babybuntin)
    says you who made the comment Salmond would never win Gordon..
    "We were a NO area".. no one wants him here..

    Well he did win and Sturgeon doesn't need to call a referendum.....
    Alas, FPTP means you don't need to secure a majority vote from your constituents to represent them. Just like how the SNP failed to secure 50% of the votes yet won 56 seats.

    I have no idea what you're babbling on about with your statement that Sturgeon "doesn't need to call a referendum".
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Smack)
    Alas, FPTP means you don't need to secure a majority vote from your constituents to represent them. Just like how the SNP failed to secure 50% of the votes yet won 56 seats.

    I have no idea what you're babbling on about with your statement that Sturgeon "doesn't need to call a referendum".
    Just the same as Alex wouldn't win Gordon... LOL

    you've been showing fear for quite some time now... it's only going to get worse for you...
    • TSR Support Team
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    TSR Support Team
    (Original post by babybuntin)
    Just the same as Alex wouldn't win Gordon... LOL

    you've been showing fear for quite some time now... it's only going to get worse for you...
    Have you been stalking me?
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Smack)
    Have you been stalking me?
    aye lol
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    Cameron deserves all he gets in my opinion. He has this country divided. Don't think that Scotland will take another groin kicking because they won't. Even the Northern lands are standing up now and saying they want to separate from England.

    Carry on Cameron with your Strivers vs Shirkers rant and the country will divide and your be blamed for it.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    Lol.

    Sturgeon is the roaring cockroach in the room.

    Loud, but at the end of the food chain.

    I hope Cameron gives her powers to give her tax rises (but not tax cuts) and demands she does not increase expenditure until she matches it with tax revenue. That way we have a very nice exodus of population and businesses from Scotland into England, then we can send Unholyrood a goodbye letter and declare the succession of United Kingdom of England, Wales and Northern Ireland.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    Look how it is already. He didn't want to implement the Smith proposals and now he's saying they will be right away
    Er, of course he did. They were a manifesto commitment for the Conservatives, as well as being committed to as Conservative policy the day they were announced.

    They will not be implemented right away. For the tax powers in particular, they will take several years before they're actually devolved. The legislative timeline, on the other hand, was agreed before the referendum in September 2014.

    they were proposed after the referendum and then they did sod all for ages
    You clearly don't understand how legislation works. The Smith Commission met soon after the referendum, the draft clauses were produced at a fairly break-neck speed for such a significant Bill and were published in January. They are currently undergoing legislative scrutiny and will be consulted on. Significant legislation takes time.

    She can play off that a referendum will happen again if he fobs them off with token powers.
    Not really, considering under the Scotland Act his government have to legislate to hold a referendum, as they did for the 2014 referendum. Nicola Sturgeon cannot call a referendum on independence.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by josh_v)
    Personally I think he should offer them full fiscal autonomy. Let them have it. Scrap the Barnett formula and send them on their way.

    Edit: Not in the way Sturgeon demands it though, over a long time period. Offer it all at once and force her to choose. Also, they can take their share of the debt.
    You do realise having a part of a country dropped into almost overnight recession, sharing your currency and considerable trade links, is not a good thing, yeah?

    "Full" fiscal autonomy would destablise the whole UK.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    True, but if England continues to diverge from Scotland and/or powers are unsatsifactory to the Scots, plus a referendum was blocked can you imagine the Scottish suddenyl becoming pro-union? They would have to allow one eventually and when they did they would suffer in the result.
    No, they wouldn't.

    I think actually if they allowed one very soon and didn't appear trying to block it, it would sort of take the Scots aback. I think they wold vote no, and after two no's it could be very damaging to their morale.
    Yes, but the Conservatives do not want to be seen as undermining the result of the first one and using the Scottish people for party-political purposes. The UK Government have said the referendum result has to be respected: what message would it send to have another one, even if you thought you'd win it again and again?
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    Unfortunately i suspect this stalemate between the SNP and Tories will continue for some time since the Tories are giving in for more power rather than tackling the crux of the issue (the massive N-S perception, a lack of importance in the union). Even if Sturgeon is trusted not to have a referendum in the 2016 manifesto then these powers are still amplifying the legal and cultural divide over time.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Rakas21)
    Even if Sturgeon is trusted not to have a referendum in the 2016 manifesto then these powers are still amplifying the legal and cultural divide over time.
    Spot on. For all the stuff about localism and so on, giving more powers to Holyrood does weaken the UK. Give too much and you don't just have financial problems to deal with, but ones of political culture too - imagine if the UK Budget, for example, was barely relevant to Scotland.

    Politicians may think it helps in the short term, but ultimately it will make it harder to unite the UK culturally, socially and in a civic sense.

    But more than that - to sell the union, it has to be seen to be doing things. Not just to plough some cash to the Scottish Government, who then spend it on nice things, slap the word "Scottish" on the side and see it as a win for them. The UK Government has to be building things in Scotland, clearly helping boost jobs - and some schemes affecting areas like health and education wouldn't go amiss either.

    The US is a federal state with strong states rights. Yet it has significant federal schemes like the No Child Left Behind programme, touching on states' competences but also providing a popular, centrally administered top-up. We should be doing that.
    Offline

    4
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    Look how it is already. He didn't want to implement the Smith proposals and now he's saying they will be right away, and she wants more, after saying they were a starting point, which is fair IMO because they were proposed after the referendum and then they did sod all for ages. She can play off that a referendum will happen again if he fobs them off with token powers. She has him over a barrel then there is Farage and his backbenchers over Europe. This is going to be a stressful term for him.
    This is in a way a good thing, Sturgeon and the rest of her haggis munching can **** off back over the border. Lets get rid of the Scottish ****s as best as we can. Hopefully we'll give them another ****ing referendum and they'll **** off completely.
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    Hilarious
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by illegaltobepoor)
    Cameron deserves all he gets in my opinion. He has this country divided. Don't think that Scotland will take another groin kicking because they won't. Even the Northern lands are standing up now and saying they want to separate from England.

    Carry on Cameron with your Strivers vs Shirkers rant and the country will divide and your be blamed for it.
    The one factor is with all of these 'lets break away' people is they seem to have been unable to cost it.

    The SNP made their economic policy up, the peole in the north of England like to blame others .

    What you really have is people calling for access to the national cr sit card and wanting somebody else to pay.
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by illegaltobepoor)
    Cameron deserves all he gets in my opinion. He has this country divided. Don't think that Scotland will take another groin kicking because they won't. Even the Northern lands are standing up now and saying they want to separate from England.

    Carry on Cameron with your Strivers vs Shirkers rant and the country will divide and your be blamed for it.
    He does.... The more mistakes he makes the better...

    The unionists Tory voters in Scotland will have you believe they got the government they wanted, they got half what they wanted.. They live in the bubble of the SNP now who do everything in their power to protect Scotland against the effect of any Tory cuts while Tory voters here will sit back watching the south being hit and paying for everything while they still get to enjoy it for free.

    So ideally if your a Tory voter in Scotland you'll be sitting in glee while the rest of the country start to suffer.. That wont last for long though, because they are now being taken on the road to independence and don't realise it. LOL.. or maybe they do and that's why they have a dose of the trots.

    SNP took the brunt of that dreadful bedroom tax of from the Scottish electorate who were hit by it , although there are some loops holes where certain people still have to pay it, but the amount of people affected diminished.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by babybuntin)
    He does.... The more mistakes he makes the better...

    The unionists Tory voters in Scotland will have you believe they got the government they wanted, they got half what they wanted.. They live in the bubble of the SNP now who do everything in their power to protect Scotland against the effect of any Tory cuts while Tory voters here will sit back watching the south being hit and paying for everything while they still get to enjoy it for free.

    So ideally if your a Tory voter in Scotland you'll be sitting in glee while the rest of the country start to suffer.. That wont last for long though, because they are now being taken on the road to independence and don't realise it. LOL.. or maybe they do and that's why they have a dose of the trots.

    SNP took the brunt of that dreadful bedroom tax of from the Scottish electorate who were hit by it , although there are some loops holes where certain people still have to pay it, but the amount of people affected diminished.
    The SNP have had access to significant power already in holyrood for quite some time yet have failed to use it.

    Instead they've continued to benefit middle class families instead of the poorest.

    You've completely ignored such undeniable facts as NHS Scotland has fallen behind NHS England in in finding and care as well.

    You've ignored the fact that the bedroom tax was a s popular in Scotland as it was unpopular and.
    Offline

    19
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by babybuntin)
    So ideally if your a Tory voter in Scotland you'll be sitting in glee while the rest of the country start to suffer..
    Um, except for the fact that employment and economic growth is faster in other parts of the country. On the latest figures, Scotland is lagging behind.

    That wont last for long though, because they are now being taken on the road to independence and don't realise it.
    If they don't realise something, I sincerely doubt that you do.
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Smack)
    I don't know why pro-union politicians seem to come off so meekly to the nats. Sturgeon can threaten another referendum if she doesn't get her way, but she still has to win said referendum. I suppose Sturgeon needs to act quickly before Sturgeon-mania begins to wear off and she comes under the same amount of scrutiny that is normal for a political party.
    This is also the impression I am getting. They need to keep the levels of hysteria up and the attention focussed on them because people forgetting about them or losing interest in the Scottish constitutional question is more dangerous to them than losing an argument or a vote.

    I do not really understand why he went to Edinburgh to meet with Sturgeon. This makes it look like Sturgeon is giving him orders, when in fact he can implement the Smith Commission's recommendations without any regard to the devolved government or the MPs of a minor third party. Cameron should absolutely try to appeal to ordinarily Scottish voters, many of whom vote SNP, but not to the SNP as a party. Sturgeon cannot be defeated head-on but she can be sidelined.
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    l'll expose the Scottish Tory voters for what they really are.. They are enjoying the awards of the SNP while the south suffer all the cuts. They suck up the freebies under the SNP umbrella.
    in the meantime Labour are dead because they lied. it's quite simple.
 
 
 

1,025

students online now

800,000+

Exam discussions

Find your exam discussion here

Poll
Should universities take a stronger line on drugs?
Useful resources

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.