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The pig that wants to be eaten. watch

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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    Talking pig is still a pig - haraam :hand:
    This interests me though. I'm not all too familiar with Islam, I'll admit. What is it that makes pig haraam in Islam?
    Would the intelligence or the feeling that you would ascribe to it if it was speaking to you have any effect on this? Would it go from being haraam for one reason to being haraam for another (as I know you don't eat other human beings)?
    Curiosity more than anything else, it's another perspective.
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    I will eat it, a pigs a pig,even if it can talk.
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    The title sounds like it would be a meme.
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    On a very collective level human herding of livestock has done wonders for them evolutionary speaking.

    Cows are not gonna go extinct anytime soon because of our tendency to tear down the Amazon rain-forest and cover that land in fat, tasty, grass-guzzling, burger machines
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    This interests me though. I'm not all too familiar with Islam, I'll admit. What is it that makes pig haraam in Islam?
    Would the intelligence or the feeling that you would ascribe to it if it was speaking to you have any effect on this? Would it go from being haraam for one reason to being haraam for another (as I know you don't eat other human beings)?
    Curiosity more than anything else, it's another perspective.
    Loool you're such an SJW



    In middle eastern culture even before Islam existed, pigs were looked down on, why do you think Judaism forbids eating pork and why in the story where Jesus exorcises the man from Gadara the demons go into pigs.
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    (Original post by The Free Radical)
    Loool you're such an SJW



    In middle eastern culture even before Islam existed, pigs were looked down on, why do you think Judaism forbids eating pork and why in the story where Jesus exorcises the man from Gadara the demons go into pigs.
    I'm just trying to look at the thought experiment from different perspectives.

    This pig in this situation isn't just a pig that would have been encountered by those people, it's a different case. How does the pig in this thought experiment change the view from that view - is it altered to put the pig in a more positive light, or negative, or not positive or negative and just different?
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    Please do not troll the support team

    I'm just very interested in philosophy, and I know I don't have any real answers, which is why I like discussions like this. I have an A Level, and a minor at degree level. This was the first thought experiment that got me interested back when I was 11, so I thought I'd bring it to others.

    No, I am not. I don't do it, I don't plan to it. Mine is a simpler reasoning, given that I don't particularly enjoy animal products, and don't get anything from animal products that can't be gotten as easily or easier than from animal products, it doesn't seem worth it to me.But my vegetarianism isn't the debate here, it just helps you to see where I'm coming from.
    I was only joking with you .

    And I think your vegetarianism is up for debate, because it should be veganism
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    No pigs on earth really want to be eaten. That experiment can't be possible in the real world.

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    (Original post by skunkboy)
    No pigs on earth really want to be eaten. That experiment can't be possible in the real world.

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    Pigs on earth also can't communicate to you in human language that they want to be eaten.
    It's a thought experiment - you just think about it.
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    I'd agree with some of the previous comments on here, that it depends on the level of intelligence involved, and whether it actually understood the situation. That said, I still personally wouldn't eat it.

    (Original post by skunkboy)
    No pigs on earth really want to be eaten. That experiment can't be possible in the real world.
    I feel like you're not quite getting the point of a thought experiment.
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    (Original post by Implication)
    Have you read the book of the same name? It's got a bunch of interesting thought experiments etc., great for a light read.

    I think if you're not currently a vegetarian - i.e. you currently eat pigs that presumably don't want to be eaten - this is a fairly straightforward one.

    If you are vegetarian, vegan etc. it's more interesting. If you agree that right and wrong are some functions of suffering and well-being, I guess you've got to think about whether the pig is fully informed about being eaten and fully comprehends - in its 'right mind', whatever that means - what constitutes being eaten.

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    What if the pig also had a hand and just slit it's own throat right in front of you after declaring it wants to be eaten?
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    (Original post by ChickenMadness)
    What if the pig also had a hand and just slit it's own throat right in front of you after declaring it wants to be eaten?
    I'd argue even more on this point - the pig has no idea if I even like pig products, I could even be allergic, it is trying to force my hand rather than any kind of choice beyond its own.
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    This interests me though. I'm not all too familiar with Islam, I'll admit. What is it that makes pig haraam in Islam?
    Would the intelligence or the feeling that you would ascribe to it if it was speaking to you have any effect on this? Would it go from being haraam for one reason to being haraam for another (as I know you don't eat other human beings)?
    Curiosity more than anything else, it's another perspective.
    We simply do not eat pork because the Quran prohibits us:

    "Forbidden to you (for food) are: dead meat, blood, the flesh of swine, and that on which hath been invoked the name of other than Allah.”

    As we believe the Quran is the direct word of God, we do not necessarily question why we are not supposed to eat pork - Allah orders us to do something so we obey. Due to this, eating pig will always remain forbidden; if one is starving and no other food is available, forbidden foods like pork become permissble, but that is only in a life or death situation.
    Various reasons have been proposed as to why Allah forbade it, but these are all speculative e.g. the meat from pigs is full of various toxins, pigs are unclean and eat their waste etc, but it doesn't matter too much as to why :beard:
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    We simply do not eat pork because the Quran prohibits us:

    "Forbidden to you (for food) are: dead meat, blood, the flesh of swine, and that on which hath been invoked the name of other than Allah.”

    As we believe the Quran is the direct word of God, we do not necessarily question why we are not supposed to eat pork - Allah orders us to do something so we obey. Due to this, eating pig will always remain forbidden; if one is starving and no other food is available, forbidden foods like pork become permissble, but that is only in a life or death situation.
    Various reasons have been proposed as to why Allah forbade it, but these are all speculative e.g. the meat from pigs is full of various toxins, pigs are unclean and eat their waste etc, but it doesn't matter too much as to why :beard:
    Interesting. Thanks for the response.
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    Imagine this. You're wondering what you want to have for your dinner, and a genetically modified or selectively bred pig walks up to you and tells you that you should eat it for dinner. In fact, not only should you, the pig actively wants you to. Do you eat the pig?
    (This is very similar in The Restaurant at the End of the Universe, a part of the Hitchhiker's Guide series - there is is a cow like creature offering the best cuts of steak).

    Two lines of thought come out of this thought experiment as I look at it. The pig wants you to eat it, so really you'd be doing it a disservice by not eating it. Even if you've spent years as a vegetarian for moral reasons, does the pig's attitude of wanting to be eaten override what you think is right concerning if you should eat it's bacon?
    However, as Arthur Dent thought in The Restaurant at the End of the Universe, if the animal is smart enough to be able to communicate that it wants to be eaten, does this somehow put it into a category of 'too intelligent for us to eat' - in other words, what makes this pig then morally different to a human that would allow you to eat that pig, but send a human that wanted to be eaten to see a psychiatrist?

    What would your response be to a pig that wanted to be eaten?
    I love the hitchhiker's. I have always thought it is tantamount to indoctrination, the pig, who wants to be eaten, can express his desire only because he has been bred to be eaten. Just like the suicide bomber who is dying for his indoctrinated belief. I am sure most pigs would object.
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    (Original post by Zamestaneh)
    We simply do not eat pork because the Quran prohibits us:

    "Forbidden to you (for food) are: dead meat, blood, the flesh of swine, and that on which hath been invoked the name of other than Allah.”

    As we believe the Quran is the direct word of God, we do not necessarily question why we are not supposed to eat pork - Allah orders us to do something so we obey. Due to this, eating pig will always remain forbidden; if one is starving and no other food is available, forbidden foods like pork become permissble, but that is only in a life or death situation.
    Various reasons have been proposed as to why Allah forbade it, but these are all speculative e.g. the meat from pigs is full of various toxins, pigs are unclean and eat their waste etc, but it doesn't matter too much as to why :beard:
    Is this from the Koran or from hadith?
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    Pigs on earth also can't communicate to you in human language that they want to be eaten.
    It's a thought experiment - you just think about it.
    lol. But they can talk to people. They use body language. No animals on this planet want to die.
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    I'd eat it before it got chance to say it wanted eating.:yep:

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    (Original post by skunkboy)
    lol. But they can talk to people. They use body language. No animals on this planet want to die.
    Well, some humans do.

    Also, its a thought experiment. Would you believe the pig? Would you think the pig were mentally ill?
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    (Original post by minimarshmallow)
    Well, some humans do.

    Also, its a thought experiment. Would you believe the pig? Would you think the pig were mentally ill?
    The occasions most humans say they want to do, they don't take their own life and are making a cry for help. Why would we assume any different for the pig?
 
 
 
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