Turn on thread page Beta

A thought on immigrants' countries own immigration watch

    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mactotaur)
    Like I said, if you'd lost everything, wouldn't you seek out the place which will give you the most?
    Yes but they'd stop if we told them that not a single one would be accepted and removed them from Calais.
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mactotaur)
    Like I said, if you'd lost everything, wouldn't you seek out the place which will give you the most?
    Beggars can't be chooser's
    Offline

    14
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by leinad2012)
    Beggars can't be chooser's
    Are you saying you'd settle for second best if you had the choice?
    Offline

    12
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Mactotaur)
    Are you saying you'd settle for second best if you had the choice?
    No but if I had the choice between staying and being in danger or being somewhere safe I'd chose somewhere safe rather than continuing to travel thousands of miles ILLEGALLY in the hope of getting better, praying on Germany's pathetic Nazi guilt saying I'm still unsafe when that is anything but the truth. I'm pleased that Hungary have said they'll be arresting them from next week and I'm glad Cameron has said that we'll only take those from the refugee camps as they'll the real ones in need...
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    Take say Poland for example and the argument from them for their entry into England is 'for a better life'. We are told they make a 'net contribution'.
    Why the quotation marks? It's all true. http://www.migrantsrights.org.uk/blo...-uk-s-gdp-2005 Hate them or love them Polish people do make a contribution. A sizeable one, at that.

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    So my question is if that is the case with immigrants who are seeking a better life then why are these countries (Poland) etc not importing 400,000 people (net) from say Ethiopia YEAR on YEAR? Or never mind Ethiopia ..
    If Ethiopian people wanted to come in, they would. They aren't going to "import" people just because they can. Does England import 400,000 people year on year from Ethiopia? They are not the UK - they do not have a colonial past and don't have any obligation/responsibility to let in immigrants of vastly different cultures. Poland does have immigrants and ethnic minorities of many nationalities such as Vietnamese, German, Ukrainian etc. even from Africa. The number may be small relative to Western countries but it is still there.

    The reason Poland is not attractive to many immigrants is because even for the natives, the life is hard. VERY hard. The minimum wage is a joke. Trying to live off benefits in Poland is just not possible like it is in England, which makes it a less attractive target for immigrants who are trying to find an "easy life". Those who want to live in Poland do so, it's as simple as that. Please stop assuming things about a country you clearly haven't been to, or else you make yourself sound quite ignorant.

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    how about a poorer and more local country like Macedonia, Bosnia & Herzegovina, Kosovo, Moldova etc. I mean they are likely to make a positive net contribution also because they will work like dirt to make a living so why do we not see a country like Poland, a country who features in the world's top 25 for GDP, importing hundreds of thousands of immigrants year on year? I'm not talking about small levels of immigrations but taking all the people from the local european countries I mentioned or even Africans?
    They do let in people from different countries. See my explanation above. First of all, economically Poland is simply not an attractive place for those wanting an "easy" life. Unemployment rate is high. Average citizens struggle to have a standard of life comparable to that in England. Please do not compare Central/Eastern Europe to the West. The life is very different.

    Poland is very monocultural - most people declare themselves to be Catholic. Religion is a big influence on daily lives. (It is not as big for the younger generation, but it's still pretty big). People of other religions are a very, very small minority. Many non-Catholic people would struggle to fit in. Law is much more "conservative" like in the rest of Central/Eastern Europe.

    Also, the language barrier. Have you seen how hard Polish is? It is often said to be in the top 5 hardest languages in the WORLD. (of course, many people speak English). Immigrants are very welcome in Poland - but just like English people expect foreigners to integrate, so do Polish people. For many, this integration is a difficult hurdle, and that's why foreigners in Poland who do learn the language etc. are treated with a LOT of respect. Or so I heard.

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    What are these countries (Poland) etc doing for others using their argument? That argument being that they go to somewhere for a better life etc etc.
    Why should they? I repeat - they do NOT have a colonial past like England's. Those who do want to live in Poland do so and are very welcome there.

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    Because at the end of the day the life of a Moldovan will be better for him in Poland than it is in Moldova.
    Maybe yes, maybe not. How do you know this? Are you Moldavian, or even Polish?

    TL;DR - The Polish government is unhelpful towards its own native citizens let alone immigrants. There are more "famous", attractive targets - France, Germany, UK which make it easier for immigrants to integrate economically, culturally etc.

    How do I know all of this? My family's from Poland and I visited Poland twice. Also, I do not rely on Daily Mail as a news source.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by The_Internet)
    And what if they aren't? What then? What exactly are you trying to prove? Every country has it's liberals and every country has it's conservatives.
    I'm trying to prove that being anti mass immigration isn't racism in the same way that Polan would never welcome or want to welcome 400,000 Moldovans a year.

    Heck, the irony look at the news today! They are protesting about Islamic immigrants - anyone see some irony there?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by RonnieRJ)
    Well you asked a question yet refuse to accept any other answer than the one wired into your brain.
    And not everyone in France is going to be against immigration. Shall we say, Eastern European countries tend to be welcoming
    really? have you seen the news today? mass protests on the streets in guess what, POLAND and Hungary! Too much irony.
    Offline

    13
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    really? have you seen the news today? mass protests on the streets in guess what, POLAND and Hungary! Too much irony.
    Isolated events, well done
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by mark36)
    Why the quotation marks? It's all true. http://www.migrantsrights.org.uk/blo...-uk-s-gdp-2005 Hate them or love them Polish people do make a contribution. A sizeable one, at that.



    If Ethiopian people wanted to come in, they would. They aren't going to "import" people just because they can. Does England import 400,000 people year on year from Ethiopia? They are not the UK - they do not have a colonial past and don't have any obligation/responsibility to let in immigrants of vastly different cultures. Poland does have immigrants and ethnic minorities of many nationalities such as Vietnamese, German, Ukrainian etc. even from Africa. The number may be small relative to Western countries but it is still there.

    The reason Poland is not attractive to many immigrants is because even for the natives, the life is hard. VERY hard. The minimum wage is a joke. Trying to live off benefits in Poland is just not possible like it is in England, which makes it a less attractive target for immigrants who are trying to find an "easy life". Those who want to live in Poland do so, it's as simple as that. Please stop assuming things about a country you clearly haven't been to, or else you make yourself sound quite ignorant.



    They do let in people from different countries. See my explanation above. First of all, economically Poland is simply not an attractive place for those wanting an "easy" life. Unemployment rate is high. Average citizens struggle to have a standard of life comparable to that in England. Please do not compare Central/Eastern Europe to the West. The life is very different.

    Poland is very monocultural - most people declare themselves to be Catholic. Religion is a big influence on daily lives. (It is not as big for the younger generation, but it's still pretty big). People of other religions are a very, very small minority. Many non-Catholic people would struggle to fit in. Law is much more "conservative" like in the rest of Central/Eastern Europe.

    Also, the language barrier. Have you seen how hard Polish is? It is often said to be in the top 5 hardest languages in the WORLD. (of course, many people speak English). Immigrants are very welcome in Poland - but just like English people expect foreigners to integrate, so do Polish people. For many, this integration is a difficult hurdle, and that's why foreigners in Poland who do learn the language etc. are treated with a LOT of respect. Or so I heard.



    Why should they? I repeat - they do NOT have a colonial past like England's. Those who do want to live in Poland do so and are very welcome there.



    Maybe yes, maybe not. How do you know this? Are you Moldavian, or even Polish?

    TL;DR - The Polish government is unhelpful towards its own native citizens let alone immigrants. There are more "famous", attractive targets - France, Germany, UK which make it easier for immigrants to integrate economically, culturally etc.

    How do I know all of this? My family's from Poland and I visited Poland twice. Also, I do not rely on Daily Mail as a news source.
    There is so much fake bias in this post I don't think I can be bothered. Btw what are your thoughts on the streets protests in POLAND about anti-islam? Welcoming? Ye ye do me a favour.

    And as for your GDP link..are you serious? A migrant rights blog that word for word says it argues that it has doen such and such and then you say the dailymail is dodgy? I'll have whatever you're smoking/

    But ye, too much falseness in your post with a delusional idea that Poland would welcome mass immigration.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by RonnieRJ)
    Isolated events, well done
    It's ok, feeling silly in a situation whereby the person you are arguing with actually has foresight and the other party is clouded by their political correctness, is normal and fine.
    Offline

    13
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    It's ok, feeling silly in a situation whereby the person you are arguing with actually has foresight and the other party is clouded by their political correctness, is normal and fine.
    Trust me I do not feel silly, how sad are you to think I would be.
    Protests by some people does not mean that the government and THE WHOLE POPULATION is against it. But no it's ok generalise the country just to try prove me wrong aw xx
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by RonnieRJ)
    Trust me I do not feel silly, how sad are you to think I would be.
    Protests by some people does not mean that the government and THE WHOLE POPULATION is against it. But no it's ok generalise the country just to try prove me wrong aw xx
    Whenever someone says the 'generalise' bull****, you've lost. Everyone generalises, you included. There's a thread on the chat forum saying why are black men so cool with lots of people agreeing - guess what sweety - that is generalising.

    You say 'protests by some people' ... errr this was thousands of people protesting after a migrant wave of people. You think those thosands are the only people thinking this? Keep drinking that political correctness cocktail and watch when you rue your mistaken opinions in years to come.
    Offline

    13
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    Whenever someone says the 'generalise' bull****, you've lost. Everyone generalises, you included. There's a thread on the chat forum saying why are black men so cool with lots of people agreeing - guess what sweety - that is generalising.

    You say 'protests by some people' ... errr this was thousands of people protesting after a migrant wave of people. You think those thosands are the only people thinking this? Keep drinking that political correctness cocktail and watch when you rue your mistaken opinions in years to come.
    Ok... Lmao and how does this thread relate to me? Did I generalise? Nah mate I'm not that ignorant

    And aw cute, 5000 "radical right-wingers" protested, but population of Poland=38.53mln. That's 0.01% of the country protesting. Aren't you cute thinking everyone's as much of a **** as that 0.01%?
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by RonnieRJ)
    Ok... Lmao and how does this thread relate to me? Did I generalise? Nah mate I'm not that ignorant

    And aw cute, 5000 "radical right-wingers" protested, but population of Poland=38.53mln. That's 0.01% of the country protesting. Aren't you cute thinking everyone's as much of a **** as that 0.01%?
    But why are you assuming it is just them? Wait till Poland gets more immigration and the truth will come out about their people ... similar to how UKIP has grown in England to 4 million voters in the recent election.

    The fact that you use a protest to claim that it is literally 0.01% of Poles against immigration is laughable and makes you look a little dim.

    This thread has so much irony I'm not surprised that the politically correct mass are not replying!
    Offline

    13
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    But why are you assuming it is just them? Wait till Poland gets more immigration and the truth will come out about their people ... similar to how UKIP has grown in England to 4 million voters in the recent election.

    The fact that you use a protest to claim that it is literally 0.01% of Poles against immigration is laughable and makes you look a little dim.
    I'm assuming it is just them because even if people have some sort of negative opinion, they don't voice them and they get on with their lives like normal people.
    And haha aw ignorance at its finest, you're using that 0.01% of Polands population that protested as proof that eastern EU countries are not welcoming
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    #politicalcorrectness
    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    I'm trying to prove that being anti mass immigration isn't racism in the same way that Polan would never welcome or want to welcome 400,000 Moldovans a year.

    Heck, the irony look at the news today! They are protesting about Islamic immigrants - anyone see some irony there?
    No not necessarily but from your posts you seem to be one...

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    really? have you seen the news today? mass protests on the streets in guess what, POLAND and Hungary! Too much irony.
    I dont think yoy understand what the word irony means

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    #politicalcorrectness
    Sure if you say so
    Offline

    1
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    I don't believe that for one minute.


    Also, welcoming? Says who? You think France are welcoming immigrants with all their recent terrorism and migrant problems? I think you'll find growing resentment in many EU countries.
    Its posturing, Polish people are among the most racist in the world, they'd go crazy if they had to deal with immigration the scale of the UK
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    9
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Normies Out)
    Its posturing, Polish people are among the most racist in the world, they'd go crazy if they had to deal with immigration the scale of the UK
    Exactly. Trying to suggest that Poles would welcome it is laughable.

    Actually the foresight of this thread completely owned the people who responded in here. I highlighted the exact truth.
    Offline

    5
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Normies Out)
    Its posturing, Polish people are among the most racist in the world, they'd go crazy if they had to deal with immigration the scale of the UK
    The irony is strong with this one. Replace "Polish people" with "black people/Asian people/any other racial group" and you'd get about a million posts stating why this statement is so wrong. Like in ANY population there are racists, and there are good people. Why would you generalise an entire nationality? As a person of Polish origin with friends of many different nationalities that I go out with on a regular basis and NEVER seen them as inferior/different to me, I find this statement extremely insulting. Or is it okay to insinuate things about the Poles just because they're white...? Unless you've travelled around every nation in the world or find some actual statistics to back this up, this is just a load of bull.

    UK colonised lots of countries. The country itself was built on immigration. You have a burden of history, just like Germany will forever have burden of the Nazis and Adolf Hitler, or Russia with Stalin. Every country has a dark past, even Poland. It's perfectly rational for England to want to control immigration. However, have you heard of Poland colonising Somalia?

    (Original post by VergeofInsanity)
    There is so much fake bias in this post I don't think I can be bothered. Btw what are your thoughts on the streets protests in POLAND about anti-islam? Welcoming? Ye ye do me a favour.

    And as for your GDP link..are you serious? A migrant rights blog that word for word says it argues that it has doen such and such and then you say the dailymail is dodgy? I'll have whatever you're smoking/

    But ye, too much falseness in your post with a delusional idea that Poland would welcome mass immigration.
    Care to explain what you mean by "fake bias"? I may be slightly biased as I'm Polish, but I only speak from experience and from truth. I provided a statistic to prove my point, where is yours? I can't say whether your opinions are correct or not because they're your opinions. But you clearly haven't been to Poland or else you wouldn't be writing these posts, full of ignorance.

    And you "can't be bothered" to reply? I wonder why?

    Migrant watch is just the first site that came up in my anonymous search engine (not google) to avoid bias. Don't like MIgrant watch? Fine: http://www.theguardian.com/commentis...sible-minority.

    DailyMail isn't necessarily dodgy. I just said I don't rely on it as a news source and seek out to educate myself without biases clouding my judgement.

    My thoughts on the street protests in Poland about anti-islam? Jan Sobieski didn't fight the Ottoman Empire for Poland to become a Muslim country. http://www.thenagain.info/WebChron/E...ennaSiege.html At the Battle of Vienna he stopped the entire EUROPE from becoming Islamic. This includes the UK. Before you ask whether being anti-Islam is racist... It's a RELIGION, not a RACE. Just as people can dislike Christianity people can dislike Islam as a concept. That does not mean it's okay to hate on the believers or the people. Respect towards others is a priority, no matter their gender, religion, sexuality or status.

    In fact there is an ethnic Muslim minority in Poland descended from ancestors of the Tatars. They're treated with as much respect as ethnic Catholic Poles.

    Have you even read my other post? The country is 95% CATHOLIC. As I said before minorities of different religions are expected to integrate. English people expect others to integrate as well which is fair enough. Most people (rightly so) believe that Muslims would just clash too much with Catholics. Just because they crossed the Mediterranean does not mean they deserve some sort of love or applause.

    This is not a topic about refugee crisis so I'm not going to dwell too much on it, but I repeat - Poland has been invaded many times by Muslims. Most people just don't want our ancestors to turn in their graves.

    History/cultural differences aside people aren't necessarily angry at the Muslims themselves - if Poland was rich like America or England, people definitely wouldn't mind. People are angry because the government is helping people that aren't even related to our country (some of them from Al-Quaeda and ISIS) and get free food, accommodation etc. all of a sudden just because they heard Europe is rich and Angela Merkel told them to accept refugees or else. Meanwhile, thousands of Polish families struggle to SURVIVE. (Not even a joke or an exaggeration.)

    Also, Poland is welcoming towards refugees as a general rule with its reception of 50 000 refugess from Chechen, , Vietnam community from East Germany etc.

    It has also helped 250 000 Ukrainians. So don't you dare call Poland "unwelcoming". For a monocultural society these are HUGE numbers.

    Many Muslim doctors or people of other useful jobs married to Polish wo/men are very accepted in the society. IT'S not a case of "they're Muslims so we hate them!" but hatred of EU policies shoved down Polish throats, much like in the UK. The immigration policy is based on people being able to integrate into society EASILY. For average white, Catholic Poles to accept Black, Ethiopian Muslims would require a very large, external force and a huge amount of social engineering. The foreigners know this and this is why they settle in UK, Germany and Sweden etc. it's just easier.

    Do you have a particular hatred of Polish people? It's funny you make fun of Poland not being particularly "welcoming" where most of Europe at the minute shares the same sentiment. Trust me when I say that foreigners in Poland can really feel more at home than in the UK.

    Most refugees have no right to asylum anyway. I believe that most of them are semi-rich men (you have to pay for transport to Europe, you know?) who are just looking for an easy life in Europe. Not all, but many of them are. It is fair of Polish people to not automatically accept them with open arms just as it is fair of the French, English, Swedish, German etc. to do the same.

    Thank you for taking your time to reply to my post and read this one.

    Cheers
 
 
 
Poll
How are you feeling in the run-up to Results Day 2018?
Useful resources

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.