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Is Britain becoming like Sweden in relation to expressing views on mass immigration? watch

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    (Original post by Marco1)
    So your response is too make a list of discrediting generalisations. They are discussing a social phenomenon that is happening. You direct your efforts, it seems, to make out they are merely paranoid bigots. Exactly the point raised in the video discussion. You have no inclination to actually address the points of the argument they are making. You only try and denounce the people with lazy, loaded generalisations.
    As I said, the video opened terribly "It's the ultimate example of liberalism run rampant, liberalism gone mad, and I made a video made a video 3 or 4 month ago called Absolute Proof Liberalism is a Mental Disorder talking about some politicians in Sweden are calling for ISIS militants welfare and jobs when they return to Sweden"

    So from the outset the speaker clearly has absolutely no clue what Liberalism is (as well as confusing Socialism of the Social Democrats with Liberalism).

    And then the video descended into crazy-ass victimhood delusions about how the Sweden Democrats are persecuted in a totalitarian state (note this is exactly how UKIP portrays itself by its activists at grassroots level, since it cannot get legitimacy and support through talent, intellect or practicality of its politicans, and instead has to get sympathy as the underdog......which is exactly what Islamists in the West do as well)

    Sorry mate, it's a total fail of a video
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    I would put my life on the line for the vote being to stay

    You must understand the British public are cowards. Come the campaign, all we will hear is Labour, Tories, SNP, Lib dems and on and on say "if we leave you will lose you job, your pension, wages will slump, trade will decrease and inflation will increase". They will say this without any evidence and their business friends (who all wanted to join the Euro 10 years ago) will say the same thing because cheap Labour and driving down of wages is great for them.
    If Labour, Conservative and SNP really did want to UK to join the Euro, why didn't the country join the euro (after all, the vast majority of the electorate voted for these parties)?

    You're totally delusional, or a liar. But that's far right politics for you......
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    Clearly you were not around say 6 years ago where something like immigration was rarely touched upon because of political correctness and a smear campaign against anyone who mentioned it.
    You clearly weren't around 6 years ago if you believe that claptrap.

    Since it's creation in 2001, Migration Watch has been publishing reports and releasing press releases that were picked up and reported by almost all mainstream media outlets.

    As I said, you've been living in a cave, or maybe just lying
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    Sweden is a lost cause. They bow down to islam no matter what
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    (Original post by Rat_Bag)
    If Labour, Conservative and SNP really did want to UK to join the Euro, why didn't the country join the euro (after all, the vast majority of the electorate voted for these parties)?

    You're totally delusional, or a liar. But that's far right politics for you......
    You mis-read what I said, I was referring to the business friends like Branson ect. In the early 2000s Blair and brown campaigned for us to adopt the Euro with bundles of businesses behind them. They were over ruled and rightly so, look at the Eurozone now.

    (Original post by Rat_Bag)
    You clearly weren't around 6 years ago if you believe that claptrap.

    Since it's creation in 2001, Migration Watch has been publishing reports and releasing press releases that were picked up and reported by almost all mainstream media outlets.

    As I said, you've been living in a cave, or maybe just lying
    It is not a lie to say the topic of immigration has been debated on the political mainstream because UKIP have allowed it so. Pressure from UKIP has won us an EU referendum and made immigration a topic for actual debate. Anyone who raised it before was deemed racist immediately.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    It is not a lie to say the topic of immigration has been debated on the political mainstream because UKIP have allowed it so. Pressure from UKIP has won us an EU referendum and made immigration a topic for actual debate. Anyone who raised it before was deemed racist immediately.
    It's been debated for a lot longer than UKIP's entrance to mainstream politics (which really took off with the collapse of the BNP, with the absorption of its voters into UKIP, and the end of the far-right being split), so there's no point in claiming credit to UKIP for something that is was not responsible for. This sort of desperation just shows how little UKIP has going for it
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    (Original post by Rat_Bag)
    It's been debated for a lot longer than UKIP's entrance to mainstream politics (which really took off with the collapse of the BNP, with the absorption of its voters into UKIP, and the end of the far-right being split), so there's no point in claiming credit to UKIP for something that is was not responsible for. This sort of desperation just shows how little UKIP has going for it
    The BNP wanted to chuck anyone who wasn't white or English out of this country = racist

    UKIP want controlled migration and not an open door policy. This means regardless of race, religion, skin colour, culture, sex, ect. If you present the skills, the fluency in English, the flawless criminal record, the credentials we need (e.g. Surgical doctors) and a job waiting for you, you are welcome = not racist

    Big difference but I understand with your 'complication' why that might be hard to grasp
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    The BNP wanted to chuck anyone who wasn't white or English out of this country = racist

    UKIP want controlled migration and not an open door policy. This means regardless of race, religion, skin colour, culture, sex, ect. If you present the skills, the fluency in English, the flawless criminal record, the credentials we need (e.g. Surgical doctors) and a job waiting for you, you are welcome = not racist

    Big difference but I understand with your 'complication' why that might be hard to grasp
    I never said the BNP and UKIP were the same. I said that BNP supporters were absorbed into UKIP, which was natural since they are both far right parties.

    And don't be too sure about UKIP's lack of want to deport non-Anglo Saxons from the country (something you decry as racist). UKIP HQ is in a constant game of cat and mouse damage control, as the veil of respectability keeps on slipping and racist policies come out of the mouths of its elected politicans; most memorable one, when Mark Reckless, the former UKIP MP for Rochdale (one of only two MPs in their history) said that Eastern Europeans would be asked to leave the UK if UKIP were in government. Oops! Cue HQ damage control to kick in and tidy up the mess, since Farage just can't face another week of pleading that the party isn't racist. And why did Mark Reckless say it? Because it's what the UKIP activists and core vote want to hear. Because they are racist.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    You mis-read what I said, I was referring to the business friends like Branson ect. In the early 2000s Blair and brown campaigned for us to adopt the Euro with bundles of businesses behind them. They were over ruled and rightly so, look at the Eurozone now..
    No, Brown quite clearly stated that he was against joining the Euro because it didn't fufill the criteria that were set out.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    You mis-read what I said, I was referring to the business friends like Branson ect. In the early 2000s Blair and brown campaigned for us to adopt the Euro with bundles of businesses behind them. They were over ruled and rightly so, look at the Eurozone now.
    This is factually incorrect. Brown did not want to join the Euro and it was one of the main dividing lines between the two heavyweights. With half of Labour and all of the Tories against it there was never a serious prospect of our joining the Euro. Note as well that Brown was left of Blair in the Labour Party.

    Back in 1997 people like you were crowing on about the Referendum Party forcing Blair into offering a referendum on any adoption of the single currency. It was irrelevant then and is irrelevant now. The Atlantic Bridge has been a Thatcherite wet dream since she was in power, and they are happy to offer a referendum for that reason; it has little to do with UKIP, other than that most of their leadership and donors are former extremist Thatcher-Reaganite Tories.

    Make no mistake, in 2017 if you vote to leave you will be voting for vassalage to America and all the human and workers' rights abuses that go with it.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    The BNP wanted to chuck anyone who wasn't white or English out of this country = racist

    UKIP want controlled migration and not an open door policy. This means regardless of race, religion, skin colour, culture, sex, ect. If you present the skills, the fluency in English, the flawless criminal record, the credentials we need (e.g. Surgical doctors) and a job waiting for you, you are welcome = not racist

    Big difference but I understand with your 'complication' why that might be hard to grasp
    Then why have UKIP also been pandering to BNP economics, a trend particularly evident since 2013? Because the Thatcherite leadership know it plays well with their new core vote, as well as Old Labour.
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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    Then why have UKIP also been pandering to BNP economics, a trend particularly evident since 2013? Because the Thatcherite leadership know it plays well with their new core vote, as well as Old Labour.
    That is just false beyond reason. And don't worry I won't demand evidence on your part. I have seen the BNP policy and UKIP policy, better yet the BNP themselves criticising how different they are to UKIP.

    You fail to understand even when the BNP were at their best UKIP still beat them in the 2010 election with 950k against 300k or so BNP voters. You reckon UKIP is reaching out to these 300k when they have a much larger representation from their 4 million or so.

    Comparing the economics of these two is just ludicrous

    Firstly UKIP welcome a free market based on capital, trade and investment while the BNP oppose this. They hate the fact that Chinese investors can gain 1/3 of an infrastructure project, UKIP doesn't.

    Secondly BNP support nationalisation on the scale of Corbyn if not worse. UKIP is the opposite.

    Thirdly the BNP oppose free movement of labour altogether while UKIP want a controlled system. UKIP welcomes labour across the world as long as they are fluent in English, have the skills we need, have the credentials, a job opportunity and a clean criminal record.

    Also BNP are very anti banks and support regulation beyond the level of Corbyn. UKIP are nothing like this

    Even on the topic of union rights they differ

    I could outline the differences all day. On one end you have communist economic policy and on the other you have capitalist economic policy but modified from the Tory interpretation.
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    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    This is factually incorrect. Brown did not want to join the Euro and it was one of the main dividing lines between the two heavyweights. With half of Labour and all of the Tories against it there was never a serious prospect of our joining the Euro. Note as well that Brown was left of Blair in the Labour Party.

    Back in 1997 people like you were crowing on about the Referendum Party forcing Blair into offering a referendum on any adoption of the single currency. It was irrelevant then and is irrelevant now. The Atlantic Bridge has been a Thatcherite wet dream since she was in power, and they are happy to offer a referendum for that reason; it has little to do with UKIP, other than that most of their leadership and donors are former extremist Thatcher-Reaganite Tories.

    Make no mistake, in 2017 if you vote to leave you will be voting for vassalage to America and all the human and workers' rights abuses that go with it.
    This is project fear at its best. You have zero evidence and party policy to support the facilitation with America if we leave the EU. That is laughable. I have not seen any evidence we would abandon worker's rights and adopt the dollar. You are desperate if this is your argument. If UKIP even considered that if in power there would be an uprising even from people like me. They would be toppled.

    You think Cameron and Osbourne offered the referendum for that reason? Lol, that is funny. You even think they are Thatcherites when they are the very Tory politicians who would have ousted her as happened before Major.
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    (Original post by Gears265)
    I would put my life on the line for the vote being to stay

    You must understand the British public are cowards. Come the campaign, all we will hear is Labour, Tories, SNP, Lib dems and on and on say "if we leave you will lose you job, your pension, wages will slump, trade will decrease and inflation will increase". They will say this without any evidence and their business friends (who all wanted to join the Euro 10 years ago) will say the same thing because cheap Labour and driving down of wages is great for them.

    Once people hear this, out of fear they will vote to stay. They are scared of stepping into the unknown. Fear controls politics now. We have the establishment and the EU funding a stay campaign. The leave campaign stands no chance. I predict an 85% 15%(these will be the UKIP voters) split.

    Tory voters lack spine to vote to leave. Labour voters will most likely vote to stay and I do not need to say anything about SNP, lib dem, Green voters.

    These non-UKIP voters will shout their discontent for the EU now but come the referendum they will have Cameron or Corbyn or Farron or Sturgeon in their ear dictating their vote.

    This is a battle we can not win
    Recent polling suggests otherwise. I personally think it will be close, who ever wins.
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    (Original post by i<3milkshake)
    Recent polling suggests otherwise. I personally think it will be close, who ever wins.
    Recent polling does not mean a thing. Had polls got their way Miliband would be in government. Last election surprisingly had UKIP take larger chunks out of Labour's 18-35 range when the opposite was expected. Tory voters cry about their discontent for the EU but when push comes to shove they always opt for the status quo because of fear politics. Cameron will make up a bunch of lies and watch all those eurosceptic Tory voters run back to Cameron's feet. I'm telling you the in campaign will wipe the floor with the out campaign
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    (Original post by Bupdeeboowah)
    English people are far too meek to go around with a sword executing immigrants.
    (Original post by Bill_Gates)
    I love immigration, i know many others who do too. Only people who don't are the ones who can't on in life - unemployed, not happy with their own situation and simply want to blame others are largely anti immigration lol. Especially those on benefits #Jeez! #BenefitWarfare They're taking our council houses LOL when Dave is selling them by the 1000s every month!
    Hi Bupdeeboowah. Hi Bill Cosby

    I think its silly of England to continue welcoming foreigners into their country who don't speak English, who do not have respect for the common law, who do not embrace British values, who want to abuse the various benefits system which was meant for English citizens in the first place and I could go on all day.

    If you look across all the universities in England, many of the professors and teaching staff are foreigners from EU. They are the ones who are shouting from the rooftops against UK pulling out of the EU. You know why? Because if UK does pull out of the EU, this means that they may lose their jobs after their teaching contract comes to an end. You know why? Because if UK does pull out of EU, in future anyone who wants to apply for work in the UK must go through a proper work permit system. This also means that people from EU will then have to compete with people from the rest of the world including the Commonwealth when it comes to applying for jobs in the UK.

    Many of you are probably clueless because you have either never stepped out of England, your teachers did not teach you this in your classrooms or you have very little general knowledge on this matter. The current EU rules discriminates anyone from the Commonwealth countries and favors people from EU including those from Bulgaria and Romania and the like.

    The Commonwealth is made up of 53 countries and 2.2 billion people. They were former colonies of England and fought many wars on England's behalf. These countries speak English as their first language, respect and use the Common law, believe in and exercise democracy and so on. But the present situation is that people from the Commonwealth can't get jobs in the UK. These jobs go to people from the EU. Oh the irony.

    UK must pull out of EU before it is too late. You can't rely on your ministers because most of them have never had a proper day's work in their lives, are wondering how to claim more expenses fraudulently, do not understand what it's like to be a normal average citizen struggling in these harsh economic times and so on.

    If you had a present government which was headed by someone like Margaret Thatcher then
    1. UK would never have gone to war with Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan
    2. There would not have been extreme radicalism in UK
    3. The number and wages of police officers and teachers would not have suffered massive cuts
    4. The legal aid would not have been cut
    5. The NHS would not be overcrowded, schools won't have shortage of places
    6. There wouldn't be a need to build a council house every 7 mins to house a person from EU
    Look at the u-turn Angela Merkel made recently. First she welcomed the refugees with open arms but then later she realized that many of them were economic migrants and quite possibly terrorists and so now she wants to put in place border controls. But according to EU rules, once you set foot on EU soil and you are a refugee or asylum seeker, your application will be fast-tracked and you will receive your travel papers and you are free to move in and about the other countries that form EU. and where do you think these people will want to go to?

    The UK of course because these people know that
    1. the English currency is strong compared to the failed Euro
    2. the English government is weak and will give out various benefits to them
    3. the English government will give these people big houses
    4. and the fact that England keeps harping on Human Rights means that these refugees/economic migrants can bring their entire village over to the UK with ease
    Then why does UK need the border agency or immigration staff at her airports? On one hand you are preventing highly educated people from the Commonwealth who genuinely want to work in the UK but on the other hand you happily welcome these refugees/economic migrants who will be relying on government handout for the rest of their lives. Oh the irony.
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    (Original post by Rat_Bag)
    It's been debated for a lot longer than UKIP's entrance to mainstream politics (which really took off with the collapse of the BNP, with the absorption of its voters into UKIP, and the end of the far-right being split), so there's no point in claiming credit to UKIP for something that is was not responsible for. This sort of desperation just shows how little UKIP has going for it
    No UKIP voter here, but you're being disingenuous here. Former BNP members are banned from UKIP so what you say can't possibly be true.

    Also consider that BNP's support has always been relatively minuscule.

    UKIP originally started out as Tories who were too Tory even for the Tories. These days they have this immigration rhetoric to appeal to people who don't care about the EU and it's effect on business.

    The truth is that UKIP's policies aren't even anti-immigration to any real degree. It's pretty much the same as Auatralia's and hardly anyone calls them racist for it. It's to treat all people equally no matter where they're from based on what they could contribute, while current policy is to give Europeans (who are mostly white) privilege for literally no reason other than they're European. If any policy is racist, ironically it's that.

    I myself support the principal of an EU which is why I am against UKIP but to straight up lie about them and misrepresent them as many do does nobody any favours I'm afraid
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    (Original post by ~Seraphina~)
    Hi Bupdeeboowah. Hi Bill Cosby

    I think its silly of England to continue welcoming foreigners into their country who don't speak English, who do not have respect for the common law, who do not embrace British values, who want to abuse the various benefits system which was meant for English citizens in the first place and I could go on all day.

    If you look across all the universities in England, many of the professors and teaching staff are foreigners from EU. They are the ones who are shouting from the rooftops against UK pulling out of the EU. You know why? Because if UK does pull out of the EU, this means that they may lose their jobs after their teaching contract comes to an end. You know why? Because if UK does pull out of EU, in future anyone who wants to apply for work in the UK must go through a proper work permit system. This also means that people from EU will then have to compete with people from the rest of the world including the Commonwealth when it comes to applying for jobs in the UK.

    Many of you are probably clueless because you have either never stepped out of England, your teachers did not teach you this in your classrooms or you have very little general knowledge on this matter. The current EU rules discriminates anyone from the Commonwealth countries and favors people from EU including those from Bulgaria and Romania and the like.

    The Commonwealth is made up of 53 countries and 2.2 billion people. They were former colonies of England and fought many wars on England's behalf. These countries speak English as their first language, respect and use the Common law, believe in and exercise democracy and so on. But the present situation is that people from the Commonwealth can't get jobs in the UK. These jobs go to people from the EU. Oh the irony.

    UK must pull out of EU before it is too late. You can't rely on your ministers because most of them have never had a proper day's work in their lives, are wondering how to claim more expenses fraudulently, do not understand what it's like to be a normal average citizen struggling in these harsh economic times and so on.

    If you had a present government which was headed by someone like Margaret Thatcher then
    1. UK would never have gone to war with Iraq, Libya and Afghanistan
    2. There would not have been extreme radicalism in UK
    3. The number and wages of police officers and teachers would not have suffered massive cuts
    4. The legal aid would not have been cut
    5. The NHS would not be overcrowded, schools won't have shortage of places
    6. There wouldn't be a need to build a council house every 7 mins to house a person from EU
    Look at the u-turn Angela Merkel made recently. First she welcomed the refugees with open arms but then later she realized that many of them were economic migrants and quite possibly terrorists and so now she wants to put in place border controls. But according to EU rules, once you set foot on EU soil and you are a refugee or asylum seeker, your application will be fast-tracked and you will receive your travel papers and you are free to move in and about the other countries that form EU. and where do you think these people will want to go to?

    The UK of course because these people know that
    1. the English currency is strong compared to the failed Euro
    2. the English government is weak and will give out various benefits to them
    3. the English government will give these people big houses
    4. and the fact that England keeps harping on Human Rights means that these refugees/economic migrants can bring their entire village over to the UK with ease
    Then why does UK need the border agency or immigration staff at her airports? On one hand you are preventing highly educated people from the Commonwealth who genuinely want to work in the UK but on the other hand you happily welcome these refugees/economic migrants who will be relying on government handout for the rest of their lives. Oh the irony.
    Well said! Especially agree with the part of former colonies being sold out for EU deprived states.
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    Why are immigration threads full of rednecks passing prejudice and anecdote as somehow indisputable fact? aren't there any people who're actually interested in the facts of immigration?
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    (Original post by sdotd)
    Sweden is a lost cause. They bow down to islam no matter what
    Sweden is proving itself to be a nation of cuckolds. No wonder the Vikings died out.
 
 
 
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