Hey there! Sign in to join this conversationNew here? Join for free
x Turn on thread page Beta

More Disability Cuts Maybe? watch

    Offline

    20
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Rent is taxed.

    When you talk of land tax, you do realise that farmers would get crucified as would the national trust.

    Would a land tax mean that my pension and other investments would be tax free?
    Ye but they would be taxed less when they sell the products they produce.

    Plus farmers get subsidized all the time anyway...
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by ChaoticButterfly)
    Ye but they would be taxed less when they sell the products they produce.

    Plus farmers get subsidized all the time anyway...
    Of course you're right.

    The best way of dealing with this is to put food prices up and put food producers out of business.

    Tell me. Would MoD training land be taxed? What about hospitals, police stations, schools, fire stations etc?

    What's the geographical footprint of an multi billion £ investment house compared to an elderly care home?

    Who's footing the bill for the national trust land?
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Rent is taxed.

    When you talk of land tax, you do realise that farmers would get crucified as would the national trust.

    Would a land tax mean that my pension and other investments would be tax free?
    Not highly; and not higher than earned income.

    Farmers, having a clearly productive use of their land for provision of a basic essential good, would be exempt. In the freest conception, any productive use of the land would be permitted; in the next most free, a tax code would provide inducements for certain desirable activities, and so on through to central planning. Choose your poison, we'll see what works best.

    ChaoticButterfly makes a good point. Philosophically speaking, the land-holder (let's not call him a "farmer" for now) should surely be taxed on his unfarmed land rather than on bringing the produce he grows using that land to the market. This would be even more free market a system than the freest land tax code described above; although it would encourage only those land uses delivering the highest return. The additional advantage of a tax code is it makes provision for need as well as profit.

    Depends how much could be got out of the land tax. Your other investment income may be unearned, but, unlike undeveloped land, it at least makes capital available to productive businesses in which you have invested. Therefore the philosophy of the thing says that it would attract a lower rate of tax than land and a higher rate of tax than income.
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Notice the way that the OP has used the word 'maybe'

    Out of interest where do you think cuts should be made.
    Well pretty much anywhere but there.

    4 billion is pissing in the wind it's not even 5% of the deficit so if the deficit is cleared in 2019 then why not be whenever it is plus 2 months......

    Even if you don't accept that and you're on an ideology trip you can go straight to foreign aid.... Why look after the worlds vulnerable if you're not going to look after your own.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Tell me. Would MoD training land be taxed? What about hospitals, police stations, schools, fire stations etc?
    If built by private land-owners the land these buildings are on would not be taxed as they deliver a service clearly aligned with the goals of the people.

    What's the geographical footprint of an multi billion £ investment house compared to an elderly care home?
    Are you suggesting that an "investment house" would be bigger than a care home and thus command a greater tax exemption? This is the reason why there should be a tax code to induce the building of things that are needed but which may give a lower return.

    Who's footing the bill for the national trust land?
    The National Trust is to make certain land unavailable for development or for private ownership which may result in development. We do this because it is felt that an environment which surrounds us with some greenery, which preserves our cultural heritage, and to which people have freedom of access, is something which society benefits from.

    Since the whole of society are equal beneficiaries I suppose they would be the ones on whom the tax was levied, subject as ever to a democratic mandate, to maintain such land. But of course the "National Trust" land-holding structure and designation may become obsolescent under the new system as we would have to reconceptualise what it means for land to be publicly owned.
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by paul514)
    Well pretty much anywhere but there.

    4 billion is pissing in the wind it's not even 5% of the deficit so if the deficit is cleared in 2019 then why not be whenever it is plus 2 months......

    Even if you don't accept that and you're on an ideology trip you can go straight to foreign aid.... Why look after the worlds vulnerable if you're not going to look after your own.


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Nope, I'm afraid it's far more important to take money off the disabled.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    Nope, I'm afraid it's far more important to take money off the disabled.
    As you well know Tories need to remember that if they start hitting the middle earners with austerity they will find themselves without a majority.

    We both know Cameron was obsessed with copying everything Tony Blair did.

    What you might not be familiar with is he actually was planning to protect Tax Credits because he knew that the bribe to workers across all classes is what kept Labour in over 3 elections.

    The cuts where going to be in the following areas:

    Carers Allowance cut by 40%
    Contribution based ESA Abolished.
    Personal Independence Payment & Attendance Allowance Taxed.
    Industrial Injuries scheme privatized.
    Council Tax Support cut.
    Etc.

    But what stopped this? A group called DPAC stopped it. My friends in DPAC literally got the United Nations involved in the abuses of Disabled Peoples human rights. So what was the result? The Tories having to cut Tax Credits of course & introducing a higher min-wage to compensate workers.

    Now Osborne is in a real mess. He knows if he cuts disability benefits he will give the UN the evidence they need to judge the UK as breaking human right laws. But then if he continues with the Tax Credit Cuts or Universal Credit Work Allowance/Taper Rate cut the majority of workers across the land are going to cry havoc.

    The choice is upset the workers and loose lots of votes or upset the disabled and break international law.

    But there is a 3rd choice. It depends if the Tories get forced to do it. I think they will. The Tories are going to have to turn round to their masters and say sorry we can't give you that Tax cut else we won't be power next time round.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by emiloujess)
    What concerns me personally are the cuts to mental health services like CAMHS. I have Aspergers and Anxiety so I went through CAMHS myself. They even told my mum that they had to pass me onto a different dept. because of cuts. That was 5 years ago so I dread to think of the position it's in now. I was speaking to a Welsh AM Candidate and apparently it's even worse in Wales!

    I'm not going to say that the Conservatives are evil, or demonise people like Cameron & Osborne. The simple fact is that none of the people making the decisions have ever been in poverty and with the education they had it's unlikely they've ever associated with working class people either. So they don't understand what it's like to struggle for money. Unfortunately it's unlikely that they ever will.
    I agree, before they started bringing in these cuts i had to wait three years to even get referred to CAMHS and what with all the beds being taken out of mental health hospitals there will be more vulnerable people relying on 'community support' that doesn't exist because there is no funding for it.
    • Thread Starter
    Offline

    18
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by Xenobee)
    I agree, before they started bringing in these cuts i had to wait three years to even get referred to CAMHS and what with all the beds being taken out of mental health hospitals there will be more vulnerable people relying on 'community support' that doesn't exist because there is no funding for it.
    But But But !!1 We need to make the poor poorer so the Tories can give lower corporate tax rates to their mates.

    Use to be 50% at one time. Its now going to be 18% in 2020 and by 2025 its probably going to be just 8-10%
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by illegaltobepoor)
    But But But !!1 We need to make the poor poorer so the Tories can give lower corporate tax rates to their mates.

    Use to be 50% at one time. Its now going to be 18% in 2020 and by 2025 its probably going to be just 8-10%
    That's more to do with international rates of business tax rather than anything to do with mates.

    They are simply trying to keep us competitive.

    If you think it's a big issue as I do the real solution is a global minimum rate of business tax


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by illegaltobepoor)
    But But But !!1 We need to make the poor poorer so the Tories can give lower corporate tax rates to their mates.

    Use to be 50% at one time. Its now going to be 18% in 2020 and by 2025 its probably going to be just 8-10%
    Amazingly it was political parties like the SNP who wanted to cut corporation tax farther.....in order to create jobs.

    How many people in the uk are employed by big corporations?
    Offline

    21
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by MatureStudent36)
    Amazingly it was political parties like the SNP who wanted to cut corporation tax farther.....in order to create jobs.

    How many people in the uk are employed by big corporations?
    A lot same as any developed country but we have far more employed by sme


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Offline

    16
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by paul514)
    That's more to do with international rates of business tax rather than anything to do with mates.

    They are simply trying to keep us competitive.

    If you think it's a big issue as I do the real solution is a global minimum rate of business tax


    Posted from TSR Mobile
    One has to question why they lowered it from 20% already the joint lowest in the G20 to 18%. It seems like the corporation tax rate is not being set in such a way as to compete with rival countries but rather as an ideological imperative.

    When it comes to almost anything else there is no money for the government to help out. We regularly make reference to some of the most backward countries in the world when characterising our social provision as "too generous", but it seems there are some issues where the Tories are prepared to sacrifice some money and take a risk to be #1 in the world...!

    Only large supranational organisations and federal states can come to meaningful corporate tax agreements. There has been progress on tax in the EU and between the US, Russia and China.

    While Osborne hasn't been too awful on tax he continues obstinately to stymie attempts to impose a financial transactions tax in Europe which surprise surprise everyone but us agrees on.
    Offline

    3
    ReputationRep:
    (Original post by scrotgrot)
    One has to question why they lowered it from 20% already the joint lowest in the G20 to 18%. It seems like the corporation tax rate is not being set in such a way as to compete with rival countries but rather as an ideological imperative.

    When it comes to almost anything else there is no money for the government to help out. We regularly make reference to some of the most backward countries in the world when characterising our social provision as "too generous", but it seems there are some issues where the Tories are prepared to sacrifice some money and take a risk to be #1 in the world...!

    Only large supranational organisations and federal states can come to meaningful corporate tax agreements. There has been progress on tax in the EU and between the US, Russia and China.

    While Osborne hasn't been too awful on tax he continues obstinately to stymie attempts to impose a financial transactions tax in Europe which surprise surprise everyone but us agrees on.
    It was lowered to promote business growth, of which the uk has.

    Corporation tax is only one factor for promoting growth. Others are productivity,educational standards of the workforce, trade barriers, infrastructure etc. It all feeds into a PESTEL analysis.

    Ireland lowered its corporation tax to 12.5% and poached a load of business. So it's far from ideological. It's a balancing act.
 
 
 
Poll
Are you going to a festival?
Useful resources

Groups associated with this forum:

View associated groups

The Student Room, Get Revising and Marked by Teachers are trading names of The Student Room Group Ltd.

Register Number: 04666380 (England and Wales), VAT No. 806 8067 22 Registered Office: International House, Queens Road, Brighton, BN1 3XE

Write a reply...
Reply
Hide
Reputation gems: You get these gems as you gain rep from other members for making good contributions and giving helpful advice.