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    (Original post by iainvg)
    Ahaha. No.

    The stocks are meaningless towards the salary total. Bonus is performance dependent, and signing bonus is taken on means. The actual standard grad offer for Mountain view is a hell of a lot less than that.
    Nah, I'm fairly certain they don't just give stock for the 'banter'. Google's staffing/benefits team have a specific target total comp for each level of engineer, including the stock + bonus.

    I don't know how stock grants (not options) can be meaningless when they're essentially free money once you sell them off.

    The 'actual' grad offer is exactly what I've laid out as given to pretty much everyone starting in MV as a grad as written on the contract.

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    (Original post by Princepieman)
    Nah, I'm fairly certain they don't just give stock for the 'banter'. Google's staffing/benefits team have a specific target total comp for each level of engineer, including the stock + bonus.
    Bonus is appropriated on equivalent performance, something you don't seem to understand, not hugely surprising seeing as you've clearly never worked in the industry.

    (Original post by Princepieman)
    I don't know how stock grants (not options) can be meaningless when they're essentially free money once you sell them off.
    The whole point of stock is to retain it, it also stands as bad form immediately selling them off, so yes, they are completely meaningless in short term relevance to given salary.

    (Original post by Princepieman)
    The 'actual' grad offer is exactly what I've laid out as given to pretty much everyone starting in MV as a grad as written on the contract.
    What you fail to mention though is that 1 in 25,000 IT grads that apply to google will ever have even a hope of seeing a grad position at MV, not to mention that they are 10x more likely to take a grad they don't have to get a green card for. In the UK, specifically London, the most a recent graduate will ever see from a company like Google is £40k. End of.

    I've actually turned down a higher offer from a subsidiary in London recently because i'd have actually been worse off than on the lower salary I was earning outside of London. So, please take your fantasies elsewhere, your mythical salary expectations are up in the clouds of cuckoo land, and do NOT happen.

    Not to mention, that if your friend had really shown you that offer letter, he would be in breach of the confidentiality agreement placed on them.
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    (Original post by iainvg)
    Bonus is appropriated on equivalent performance, something you don't seem to understand, not hugely surprising seeing as you've clearly never worked in the industry.



    The whole point of stock is to retain it, it also stands as bad form immediately selling them off, so yes, they are completely meaningless in short term relevance to given salary.



    What you fail to mention though is that 1 in 25,000 IT grads that apply to google will ever have even a hope of seeing a grad position at MV, not to mention that they are 10x more likely to take a grad they don't have to get a green card for. In the UK, specifically London, the most a recent graduate will ever see from a company like Google is £40k. End of.

    I've actually turned down a higher offer from a subsidiary in London recently because i'd have actually been worse off than on the lower salary I was earning outside of London. So, please take your fantasies elsewhere, your mythical salary expectations are up in the clouds of cuckoo land, and do NOT happen.

    Not to mention, that if your friend had really shown you that offer letter, he would be in breach of the confidentiality agreement placed on them.
    I know what a bonus is...

    I never said it was easy to get a job at a Google tier company, I just said it was possible to get that level of pay - which, is literally the whole point of my reply to you.

    It seems you aren't recognising what the term 'all-in compensation' means. When comparing figures and bargaining with companies like Google, they will match the all-in compensation of whichever similar level of competitor you hold an offer for. To completely disregard bonus and stock just to form your argument isn't really the best way to go out about things. By that logic, bankers only make their base salary and don't have a bonus because it's 'performance based'.

    As for it being 'poor form', explain why Google have an auto-sell scheme for when your stock grant is vested for the year? They don't seem to look at it as bad form.

    Well they do happen, as I've seen the contract. But apparently the contract doesn't exist and I'm talking out of my ass. You can believe that if you so wish.
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    (Original post by Princepieman)
    Google aren't a startup though, they're worth more than half a trillion dollars.

    I imagine the unicorn startups would match Google's comp.

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    I was interested in this part of your quote:

    (Original post by Princepieman)
    Or they work for a top tech company like Google/FB or an up and coming startup, making that much in their first year all-in (base, bonus, stock grants, signing)
    Such startups will likely only exist in 'the valley', in overfunded, overmarketed companies with lots of backing. The unfortunate reality with such firms is that they will also too often have rubbish business ideas. Its much easier to get funding over there than in the UK.
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    (Original post by Reue)
    I did a business degree but got my first job in IT. It was a 9 month graduate role for £15.5k. TBh I was just happy to get any job as it is very hard to get a job in IT without any real world experience. Within a year I was up to 27k, then £33k and now £40k after 5 years.

    As others have said already; most places value experience far beyond your degree to the point that its almost not worth even bothering with university for a job in IT.
    Wow thats really good progression.

    Can I ask what was your first role in IT? What was the title and role?

    What is your current role?

    Thanks
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    (Original post by helpmekid)
    Wow thats really good progression.

    Can I ask what was your first role in IT? What was the title and role?

    What is your current role?

    Thanks
    1st job was a Support Engineer. 2nd line support and project rollout type stuff.

    Now I'm an IT Consultant.
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    (Original post by Reue)
    1st job was a Support Engineer. 2nd line support and project rollout type stuff.

    Now I'm an IT Consultant.
    Wow,

    And if you don't mind, can I ask the method/website you used to get that Job


    Im doing a Accounting and Finance degree and would if a chance came to move to IT.

    But my main fear is - I hate Coding/Programming, Don't know anything about Java/C++ etc.

    Do you deal with Codings and stuff like that? How did you learn that since you did a business degree?


    Thanks
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    (Original post by helpmekid)
    Wow,

    And if you don't mind, can I ask the method/website you used to get that Job


    Im doing a Accounting and Finance degree and would if a chance came to move to IT.

    But my main fear is - I hate Coding/Programming, Don't know anything about Java/C++ etc.

    Do you deal with Codings and stuff like that? How did you learn that since you did a business degree?


    Thanks
    Just a normal jobs website. Saw it advertised and applied.

    I don't really do any coding. Perhaps just a couple of basic command line scripts every now and then.
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    (Original post by Reue)
    I did a business degree but got my first job in IT. It was a 9 month graduate role for £15.5k. TBh I was just happy to get any job as it is very hard to get a job in IT without any real world experience. Within a year I was up to 27k, then £33k and now £40k after 5 years.

    As others have said already; most places value experience far beyond your degree to the point that its almost not worth even bothering with university for a job in IT.
    Area?
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    (Original post by jacktrex)
    Area?
    South East
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    (Original post by iainvg)
    The whole point of stock is to retain it, it also stands as bad form immediately selling them off, so yes, they are completely meaningless in short term relevance to given salary.
    Once you have the stock it is yours, and you can do with it whatever you like. Selling it is not in bad form, and even if it were it is absolutely your prerogative to sell it. Google grants stock and is publicly listed converting the grant to cash is trivial (unlike getting options in a private company as is typical for startup employees).

    (Original post by iainvg)
    In the UK, specifically London, the most a recent graduate will ever see from a company like Google is £40k. End of.
    Simply false. My Facebook ("a company like Google") offer was for 76k base salary, plus stock + bonus. The company I ended up going with offered slightly less base, but still much closer to 75k than 40k.

    $105k base in Mountain View is consistent with the Google new grads I know, and is at the low end of salaries in the bay area. I would expect people who have previously interned there / who negotiate with other offers to be able to get more.
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    (Original post by CS Greg)
    Once you have the stock it is yours, and you can do with it whatever you like. Selling it is not in bad form, and even if it were it is absolutely your prerogative to sell it. Google grants stock and is publicly listed converting the grant to cash is trivial (unlike getting options in a private company as is typical for startup employees).


    Simply false. My Facebook ("a company like Google") offer was for 76k base salary, plus stock + bonus. The company I ended up going with offered slightly less base, but still much closer to 75k than 40k.

    $105k base in Mountain View is consistent with the Google new grads I know, and is at the low end of salaries in the bay area. I would expect people who have previously interned there / who negotiate with other offers to be able to get more.
    Someone who knows what they're on about ^

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    (Original post by Reue)
    I did a business degree but got my first job in IT. It was a 9 month graduate role for £15.5k. TBh I was just happy to get any job as it is very hard to get a job in IT without any real world experience. Within a year I was up to 27k, then £33k and now £40k after 5 years.

    As others have said already; most places value experience far beyond your degree to the point that its almost not worth even bothering with university for a job in IT.
    Wow for real?

    Asked by someone whos coming towards the end of their first year of Uni doing a bus and it degree, thinking If its really worth it If you're potentially considering an IT related career.

    Kind of think maybe an apprenticeship in IT would give be better footing.
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    (Original post by Reue)
    South East
    Just got made redundant and found a new job £6k pay rise after 8 months experience not bad. Was on £24k Northamptonshire, now £30k Nottingham which is an even cheaper area.
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    (Original post by jacktrex)
    Just got made redundant and found a new job £6k pay rise after 8 months experience not bad.
    Congrats
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    Here's my career progression so far.

    First job : £24k Northampton 8 months later being made redundant so found a new job.
    Second job - £30k Nottingham.
 
 
 
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