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British women could face Cologne-style sex attacks if we stay in the EU, says Farage. Watch

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    (Original post by Themini)
    Granted. However http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2...-france-saying
    “If Britain leaves Europe, right away the border will leave Calais and go to Dover,” Bertrand said last month. “We will not continue to guard the border for Britain if Britain is no longer in the European Union.”

    Crystal clear. Read the entire article, it goes into detail.
    France might choose to punish the UK for leaving the EU by repudiating that agreement. It equally well might do that for some other unrelated reason, or it might be blustering now and have no intention of repudiating the agreement whatever happens. The claim that the EU gives us an enforceable right to this agreement whereas leaving would remove this right is not true.

    I note that a UK border in Dover does not mean that everything else about the Eurotunnel system will continue to run as before. If you want to go to the US you must prove that you have a right to enter the country. The US will deny admission to planes that do not submit this information. The same could happen to Eurotunnel trains. This would be inconvenient for the French, but it would have been their choice to make it come to that.
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    You are postulating that there are a lot of people in Germany who are going to stay in Germany for five years and not learn German, but who do speak good English. Why would someone do this?

    I have no doubt that some people currently in Germany are fluent in English, and may still choose to come to the UK for that or whatever other reason. I do doubt that this will be more than order 10% of the total, and I suspect they will be drawn disproportionately from the higher class and better educated fraction.

    It's certainly not obvious to me that someone would prefer to live in the UK than Germany on purely economic grounds.
    What has language got to do with anything?

    Thank to moronic leftists, people are actually born in this country these days and cannot speak English, and can go their entire lives without needing to speak English thanks to tax payer funded benefits.
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    (Original post by The_Opinion)
    What has language got to do with anything?

    Thank to moronic leftists, people are actually born in this country these days and cannot speak English, and can go their entire lives without needing to speak English thanks to tax payer funded benefits.
    The post to which I was responding identified the English language as a key pull factor for the UK.

    While it is possible to live in a country and not speak the language I am not sure this is unique to the UK.
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    *grabs popcorn*
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    You are postulating that there are a lot of people in Germany who are going to stay in Germany for five years and not learn German, but who do speak good English. Why would someone do this?

    I have no doubt that some people currently in Germany are fluent in English, and may still choose to come to the UK for that or whatever other reason. I do doubt that this will be more than order 10% of the total, and I suspect they will be drawn disproportionately from the higher class and better educated fraction.

    It's certainly not obvious to me that someone would prefer to live in the UK than Germany on purely economic grounds.
    Because English is far more widely spoken than German and so they are more likely to speak English already. Because English is easier to learn than German. Because they prefer living in the UK for whatever other reason. Because they think they are less likely to face discrimination in hiring in the UK (as happens to former refugees with Swedish citizenship).
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    They already have, just look at what happened in Rotherham and Rochdale.
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    (Original post by plstudent)
    Because English is far more widely spoken than German and so they are more likely to speak English already.
    That is true for immigrants in general but it is not likely to be true for immigrants who have lived in Germany for at least 5 years and passed a moderated exam to demonstrate their competence in the German language.

    Because they prefer living in the UK for whatever other reason. Because they think they are less likely to face discrimination in hiring in the UK (as happens to former refugees with Swedish citizenship).
    Sure but what proportion are going to be like that? 10%? 5%? That's not going to threaten civil order.
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    (Original post by The Roast)
    So you're denying this is a possibility?
    he fails to say they could also happen if we leave the EU.

    We could be struck by an asreroid thats a possibiliyu as well.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    he fails to say they could also happen if we leave the EU.

    We could be struck by an asreroid thats a possibiliyu as well.

    Funny that rape on this scale happened following the arrival of the immigrants...
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    (Original post by Observatory)
    That is true for immigrants in general but it is not likely to be true for immigrants who have lived in Germany for at least 5 years and passed a moderated exam to demonstrate their competence in the German language.
    You don't need to speak very good German to pass the citizenship exam so it would be perfectly easy to have a better command of English than that. Some other countries targeted by asylum seekers, like Sweden, have no language requirement for citizenship.

    (Original post by Observatory)
    Sure but what proportion are going to be like that? 10%? 5%? That's not going to threaten civil order.
    I don't know who said anything about civil order. We are talking about sex attacks by former refugees and if a single one of them is set to occur then it will be worth leaving the EU.
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    (Original post by dtin)
    They already have, just look at what happened in Rotherham and Rochdale
    Keighley (2005 and 2013),
    Blackpool (2006),
    Oldham (2007 and 2008),
    Blackburn (2007, 2008 and 2009),
    Sheffield (2008),
    Manchester (2008 and 2013)
    Skipton (2009),
    Rochdale (two cases in 2010, one in 2012 and another in 2013),
    Nelson (2010),
    Preston (2010)
    Rotherham (2010)
    Derby (2010), Telford (2012),
    Bradford (2012),
    Ipswich (2013),
    Birmingham (2013),
    Oxford (2013),
    Barking (2013) and
    Peterborough (2013).
    .
    Sorry dtin, fixed that for you.
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    (Original post by The Roast)
    Funny that rape on this scale happened following the arrival of the immigrants...
    Except we arent Germany. they created a unqie situation.
    They took a million
    We intend to take 4,000 a year.
    We already control our borders.

    The only area we can have more control on borders is to either:

    1. Stop EU citizens, in which case we will have to wave goodbye to access to the single market and the trade benefits that brings.
    2. We stop taking claims from asylum seekers, in which case we withdraw from the 1951 Geneva Convention on refugees.
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    (Original post by caravaggio2)
    Sorry dtin, fixed that for you.
    **** me senseless.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Except we arent Germany. they created a unqie situation.
    They took a million
    We intend to take 4,000 a year.
    We already control our borders.

    The only area we can have more control on borders is to either:

    1. Stop EU citizens, in which case we will have to wave goodbye to access to the single market and the trade benefits that brings.
    2. We stop taking claims from asylum seekers, in which case we withdraw from the 1951 Geneva Convention on refugees.
    Why would stopping EU citizens help the MIGRANT-caused rape epidemic??

    Only a fraction of the immigrants arriving in Europe and the UK are genuine refugees. The people raping the women aren't the refugees fleeing Syria and Iraq, they're economic migrants from North Africa.
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    (Original post by The Roast)
    Why would stopping EU citizens help the MIGRANT-caused rape epidemic??

    Only a fraction of the immigrants arriving in Europe and the UK are genuine refugees. The people raping the women aren't the refugees fleeing Syria and Iraq, they're economic migrants from North Africa.
    Ok if your problem isnt with EU citizens, even when some of them will be awarded EU citizenship eventually, then its the other.

    You are still under a duty whilst you remain signatories to the 1951 Convention to consider peoples asylum claims. You will probably get more of those claims once you leave the EU because France wont really care, so can wave them through.

    So do you have some credble analysis that the rapists are from North Africa and not from Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan?

    About 1/3 of the people applying are considered to be refugees.
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    He's probably right.
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    (Original post by 999tigger)
    Ok if your problem isnt with EU citizens, even when some of them will be awarded EU citizenship eventually, then its the other.

    You are still under a duty whilst you remain signatories to the 1951 Convention to consider peoples asylum claims. You will probably get more of those claims once you leave the EU becayse France wont really care, so cna wave them through.

    So do you have some credble analysis that the rapists are from North Africa and not from Syria, Iraq and Afghanistan?

    About 1/3 of the people applying are considered to be refugees.
    I'm not going to read the whole thing, but the convention doesn't state "migrants", it only refers to refugees.
    http://www.unhcr.org/uk/1951-refugee-convention.html


    http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...-a6874201.html

    "Majority of suspects are of Algerian, Tunisian or Moroccan descent and none had recently arrived in Germany, police have reportedly said"


    (Original post by 999tigger)
    About 1/3 of the people applying are considered to be refugees.
    Where's the evidence for that?
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    (Original post by The Roast)
    Why would stopping EU citizens help the MIGRANT-caused rape epidemic??

    Only a fraction of the immigrants arriving in Europe and the UK are genuine refugees. The people raping the women aren't the refugees fleeing Syria and Iraq, they're economic migrants from North Africa.
    Because many of those migrants will get EU citizenship whether they are true refugees or not.
    Sweden takes over 100k refugees a year and grants citizenship after 4 years with no language requirement. The country has also had sex attacks like Cologne and has the highest rape rate in Europe.
    The UK economy and the English language will be a huge pull factor for these migrants.
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    (Original post by plstudent)
    You don't need to speak very good German to pass the citizenship exam so it would be perfectly easy to have a better command of English than that. Some other countries targeted by asylum seekers, like Sweden, have no language requirement for citizenship.
    Generally you need a pass at B2 level which is equivalent to a full A level in the language. It's not fluency but that plus 5 years' immersion will give anyone interested in participating in the regular economy a very functional level of German. How many people from Syria are going to be natively fluent in English?

    And yes there are other countries involved but the vast majority of these people are living in Germany.

    I don't know who said anything about civil order. We are talking about sex attacks by former refugees and if a single one of them is set to occur then it will be worth leaving the EU.
    Cologne was not shocking because it involved sex attacks. It was shocking because for one night the Federal Republic of Germany could not enforce its laws in the centre of a major city. Cologne was a secessionist insurrection that Germany briefly lost.
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    Although this is blatant propaganda, it holds some kind of credibility.
 
 
 
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