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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    By any chance is this is the "it's not £350m because we get a rebate and then money spent on us"
    Listen to it and see. It is totally impartial. They are debunking arguments from the Stay side too. And the programmes are not about what might happen. Just what is happening now.
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    So?? That just means taxes are low.
    Having done some slightly more detailed research looking at the ONS data we see that the average household pays 39.9% of their income as tax (most people will actually just quote their income tax, a few include national insurance and council tax, very very few could guess what it is including indirect taxation without knowing it's about 40% to begin with), but the payments we receive, if we just stick with the cash benefits are 18% of income, giving a net tax rate of 22% by Bremain logic, or if we throw in the in kind (which even some bremainers try to do) we get a further 20.1% returned, or a final net of 1.9% tax rate.

    But let's take this all the way down to the bottom quintile, Original income of £6,146 and a final income of £16,474, or in other words for the bottom 20% they are paying -168% tax by bremainer logic, or if we take out the benefits in kind we're looking at about -50%.

    As an aside, if we look at the top 20% we get a 25.5% tax rate including benefits in kind, or about 32% looking only at hard cash, bear this in mind next time you complain about the alleged tax cuts for the under-taxed rich.
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Listen to it and see. It is totally impartial. They are debunking arguments from the Stay side too. And the programmes are not about what might happen. Just what is happening now.
    A simple yes or no will suffice for now, I shall listen to all 5 later.
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    Having done some slightly more detailed research looking at the ONS data we see that the average household pays 39.9% of their income as tax (most people will actually just quote their income tax, a few include national insurance and council tax, very very few could guess what it is including indirect taxation without knowing it's about 40% to begin with), but the payments we receive, if we just stick with the cash benefits are 18% of income, giving a net tax rate of 22% by Bremain logic, or if we throw in the in kind (which even some bremainers try to do) we get a further 20.1% returned, or a final net of 1.9% tax rate.

    But let's take this all the way down to the bottom quintile, Original income of £6,146 and a final income of £16,474, or in other words for the bottom 20% they are paying -168% tax by bremainer logic, or if we take out the benefits in kind we're looking at about -50%.

    As an aside, if we look at the top 20% we get a 25.5% tax rate including benefits in kind, or about 32% looking only at hard cash, bear this in mind next time you complain about the alleged tax cuts for the under-taxed rich.
    How is this relevent to what I said, don't play that change subject politics like David Cameron. Why is there a big lie on the Leave bus? " We send £350million to Brussels, enough for a new hospital every week ", come on your a right-wing political ambassador do your job and answer to " knowledge me " to be a brexiter.
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    How is this relevent to what I said, don't play that change subject politics like David Cameron. Why is there a big lie on the Leave bus? " We send £350million to Brussels, enough for a new hospital every week ", come on your a right-wing political ambassador do your job and answer to " knowledge me " to be a brexiter.
    It is entirely relevant because it is the exact same line of reasoning used to say £350m is a lie. The gross figure is always used, except in this situation where it harms the pro EU cause. If you want to say the EU only costs £160m a week then you also say that taxes are only 20%, not 40%, and more than -50% for the poorest.

    Or are you complaining about the hospital bit?

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    I don't put trust in the BBC.
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    (Original post by 2016_GCSE)
    I don't put trust in the BBC.
    4 remainers and 2 leavers on QT tonight, although i think Geldof will be like Izzard and ultimately count as about 10 leavers by being rude and abrasive.

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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    4 remainers and 2 leavers on QT tonight, although i think Geldof will be like Izzard and ultimately count as about 10 leavers by being rude and abrasive.

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    They others sure will be scared and rekt tonight.
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    We WILL leave.

    Europe relies more on British trade then Britain relying on European trade so we're in the stronger position, trade-wise.

    The £19 Billion a year fee is too much and people are realizing this.

    I mean those are literally just 2 reasons why more people will vote out.


    #VoteLeave
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    It is entirely relevant because it is the exact same line of reasoning used to say £350m is a lie. The gross figure is always used, except in this situation where it harms the pro EU cause. If you want to say the EU only costs £160m a week then you also say that taxes are only 20%, not 40%, and more than -50% for the poorest.

    Or are you complaining about the hospital bit?

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    Tax for poorest is -50%? Isn't that good as they get more than given to government?
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    instead of saying what is goof about staying it's been what's bad about leaving;
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    With then the subtext being the obvious: that not crashing the economy and generally doing a fair bit of damage to the country due to the lack of any coherent exit plan is good for the country. When there's plenty to be said about why it's bad to leave, it not happening is good about remaining.
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    (Original post by Results)
    We WILL leave.

    Europe relies more on British trade then Britain relying on European trade so we're in the stronger position, trade-wise.

    The £19 Billion a year fee is too much and people are realizing this.

    I mean those are literally just 2 reasons why more people will vote out.


    #VoteLeave
    British exports to the EU make up 13% of our exports, EU countries exports to Britain makes up 3% of their exports. How on earth does Europe rely more on Britain than Britain does on Europe when we've got a trade deficit?
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    (Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
    British exports to the EU make up 13% of our exports, EU countries exports to Britain makes up 3% of their exports. How on earth does Europe rely more on Britain than Britain does on Europe when we've got a trade deficit?
    A trade deficit would include world export/imports not only in Europe.

    I need to find the official article to cite it. It was article on investing.com which pulled out official numbers.
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    (Original post by Results)
    A trade deficit would include world export/imports not only in Europe.

    I need to find the official article to cite it. It was article on investing.com which pulled out official numbers.
    You're missing the point quite spectacularly. We export more to Europe than they do to us. They lose our business and it affects them less than us losing their business would do to us. We're more reliant on the EU for trade than they are on us

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    (Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
    You're missing the point quite spectacularly. We export more to Europe than they do to us. They lose our business and it affects them less than us losing their business would do to us. We're more reliant on the EU for trade than they are on us

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    Please dont be brainwashed. Vote Leave to take back control of our independence, control of our money and control of our laws regardless.
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    (Original post by Naveed-7)
    Please dont be brainwashed. Vote Leave to take back control of our independence, control of our money and control of our laws regardless.
    I won't - that's why I'm voting remain. Some vague notion of independence isn't worth the harm brexit will do.

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    (Original post by Stiff Little Fingers)
    I won't - that's why I'm voting remain. Some vague notion of independence isn't worth the harm brexit will do.

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    The EU and the biased media are scaring you. Its BS.
    Have you seen my thread on "Man from Denmark exposes EU tactics" ?
    They are scaring you just like they tried to scare Denmark before their referendums, but nothing happened afterwards. Denmark is now a very well financially secure country.
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    (Original post by Naveed-7)
    The EU and the biased media are scaring you. Its BS.
    Have you seen my thread on "Man from Denmark exposes EU tactics" ?
    They are scaring you just like they tried to scare Denmark before their referendums, but nothing happened afterwards. Denmark is now a very well financially secure country.
    So the bank of England is which - EU or biased media? Or could we perhaps entertain the other option: that leaving the EU would actually be a bad move and the experts are right when they warn of sterling collapsing (and they're not talking about the england winger).
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    (Original post by ckfeister)
    Tax for poorest is -50%? Isn't that good as they get more than given to government?
    I think you're missing the point. The argument you lot are using for why £350m per week is wrong is the exact same argument that leads to taxes being 2%, but when was the last time you ordinarily heard such a claim being made other than never?
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    (Original post by Jammy Duel)
    I think you're missing the point. The argument you lot are using for why £350m per week is wrong is the exact same argument that leads to taxes being 2%, but when was the last time you ordinarily heard such a claim being made other than never?
    Well I'm a soft vote in, I never heard of this.
 
 
 
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