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Brexit may have killed the TTIP (Transatlantic Trade and Investment Partnership) Watch

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    (Original post by SaucissonSecCy)
    This is tragic, confirming my theory about brainwashed remainers. Do you really think that the absence of a self-abasing, humiliating one-sided deal offering serfdom to the US is a bad thing? It is tragic how little national pride or will to oppose what is corrupt you people have. You would have sold us totally down the river, at least some of us try and look out for the national interest. The sheer level of ignorance, arrogance, indoctrination and cynicism in you young supporters of the global order, you remainers, is scary. And you genuinely thought you were supporting a progressive cause. As it stands, if we'd been further integrated, the French, being the only western nation with any balls worth their salt left, who look out for themselves, were the only ones to oppose this American backed serfdom. The rest of them were just pushing it all through meekly, Obama even sent some obedient Swedish shill to soften Paris up. Jesus 2% kept us from the road to hell. Please educate yourselves about future decisions.
    Lmao umm sorry if you didn't know that I'm going on random Brexit threads I see and say RIP Britain. I'm not in favour for TTIP in any way.

    (Original post by Zargabaath)
    This is a good thing lol

    Everything about the TTIP was shady. The way it was shrouded in secrecy by governments, the way it was reducing regulations of Health and Safety, Worker's Rights, removing restrictions on banks.
    I totally agree with that, I'm not in favour of TTIP at all. Let's not forget their aim to privatise the NHS. :emo:
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    (Original post by Manchester_123)
    Globalism is inevitable
    Wrong. It is based on series of decisions we take. And the shape of the world will be based on our future decisions. To see people mourning the loss of a total national humiliation for all of Europe like TTIP really saddens me, it shows they've given up, or are tragically ignorant and/or brainwashed.
    Globalism is one thing, an arrangement which gives America corporate monopoly over your country and public services, and the right to sue all our governments, whilst you get nothing in return is another. It's not even globalism or corporatism, it's American hegemony over the world. Why do people so spinelessly accept what America wants, calling anything else, bizarrely 'rudeness', or 'counter to our interests'. It is shameful treachery and cowardice. What era in history have countries, including our own, been beaten into such total submission with the support of their governance, and stretching indefinitely into the future. This marks the point when Britain and Europe said no. I'm sick of pandering, gutless transatlantacists who try and claim we are great by subservience, it's only the French who seem to get this at all, or have any backbone, and surprisingly enough, we, the arselickers to the school bully, say we hate them. They think we can have a serf nation, but so long as we have a monarchy or past or an accent, it's OK, it means we are a genuine player, as the US's lapdog. It isn't OK, and why do we pathetically go on about hating the French or the evil Putin and Russia. When the **** has Putin intervened in our affairs? It's the US that is the threat, our media coverage is conducive to this narrative that they are our friends and we are powerful, and to use one of the Americans terms, we need to stop being so utterly beta and *******less.
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    (Original post by ByEeek)
    Wasn't there rumour of a clause that would allow American companies to sue governments if their laws caused loss of earnings. So if the UK tightened smoking legislation for example, the tobacco companies would be able to sue the government for loss of earnings.

    Doesn't seem very progressive to me.
    Correct, but then since when have we had a progressive government?

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    (Original post by That Bearded Man)
    Correct, but then since when have we had a progressive government?

    Posted from TSR Mobile
    Not since the early Blair years. School class sizes were reduced to 30 or less, NHS waiting times cut from months to weeks, and disability rights were all highlights. And then the fool devised to play soldiers with GW Bush. That said some of the Lib Dem policies in the lady government were pretty good. Like free school meals for reception to year 2 and the raising of the tax threshold for low earnings and tax free savings allowance.
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    TTIP is also in trouble because of the departures of Cameron (the biggest TTIP champion within the EU) and Obama.
    I'm not sure Hilary and certainly not Trump, are as keen for it.

    Now it raises the question, will the UK end up getting roped in to accepting a trade deal with the US that includes one of these ISDS clauses that puts the British taxpayer on the line if US companies want to sue us for any regulation that can harm their profits. This is a risk as the US will know that the UK is desperate for trade deals and can drive a hard bargain. But one thing that will be better now is that any future UK-US trade deal will have to get scrutinised by a British Parliament and it will be harder to sneak through a toxic deal for us than it would have been to get it through the EU.

    Nevertheless, awareness of ISDS clauses needs to be raised so people don't unwittingly get this imposed on them. Brexit was about getting sovereignty back from the EU to a UK Parliament and ISDS clauses take that sovereignty away and give it to multinational corporations. For instance, people lobby Parliament about air quality in cities, Parliament passes an environmental regulation requiring tougher pollution standards on vehicles, factories etc. US multinational then sues UK taxpayer for loss of profits, Parliament relents and repeals the legislation.

    Free trade with other countries yes....surrendering sovereignty to unelected outside forces no.
    Does this sound familiar...
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    (Original post by Manchester_123)
    It's sad to see it die as a result of Brexit. It would have created millions of jobs and brought billions of GDP to all economies.
    It would also have given big businesses the right to sue democratically elected governments for passing laws they don't like. There is some mechanism in the deal for resolving disputes, and companies could potentially sue if they can argue that a particular law or regulation has cost them profits. e.g. If a company wants to mine in a national park or other sensitive area but is refused, they could then sue saying that they have lost profits because of those regulations. Big business has too much influence as it is.

    And before someone comes along to bash this as nutty conspiracy thinking, this has happened in other countries under similar deals. TTIP could also potentially weaken environmental and other regulations, as US regulations on all sorts of things tend to be a lot weaker.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...u-9779688.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/business...tnership-guide
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    (Original post by Manchester_123)
    I was a remain supporter and supported TTIP very much. It's sad to see it die as a result of Brexit. It would have created millions of jobs and brought billions of GDP to all economies. If only Corbyn and his left wing filth didn't sabotage the remain campaign, we could have won. Bring back Blair!
    You must be trolling now. You can't seriously be blaming Corbyn when you voted leave as a protest. Why do people in this country find it so hard to take responsibility? Have I missed sarcasm??

    TTIP was opposed by other countries that were trying to negotiate amendments to protect public services. The UK was one of the biggest supporters of it. Love how people are celebrating as if it's gone. It'll return, UK exclusive, with nobody to negotiate in our interests (because that's what the ****ing EU were doing, our government couldn't care less) as one of those "trade deals" we're now allowed to make with everyone (even though we already could but Brexiters know best!!!)

    And then people will have nobody to blame but themselves, but they'll try their hardest to pin it all on someone.
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    (Original post by JordanL_)
    You must be trolling now. You can't seriously be blaming Corbyn when you voted leave as a protest. Why do people in this country find it so hard to take responsibility? Have I missed sarcasm??

    TTIP was opposed by other countries that were trying to negotiate amendments to protect public services. The UK was one of the biggest supporters of it. Love how people are celebrating as if it's gone. It'll return, UK exclusive, with nobody to negotiate in our interests (because that's what the ****ing EU were doing, our government couldn't care less) as one of those "trade deals" we're now allowed to make with everyone (even though we already could but Brexiters know best!!!)

    And then people will have nobody to blame but themselves, but they'll try their hardest to pin it all on someone.
    You misunderstand, I support TTIP very much. It boosts trade and creates millions of jobs.

    For the record, Corbyn was a closet brexitere, it is reported even his close aides apparently voted Brexit, he was sabotaging the remain campaign the whole time
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    (Original post by RF_PineMarten)
    It would also have given big businesses the right to sue democratically elected governments for passing laws they don't like. There is some mechanism in the deal for resolving disputes, and companies could potentially sue if they can argue that a particular law or regulation has cost them profits. e.g. If a company wants to mine in a national park or other sensitive area but is refused, they could then sue saying that they have lost profits because of those regulations. Big business has too much influence as it is.

    And before someone comes along to bash this as nutty conspiracy thinking, this has happened in other countries under similar deals. TTIP could also potentially weaken environmental and other regulations, as US regulations on all sorts of things tend to be a lot weaker.

    http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/...u-9779688.html

    https://www.theguardian.com/business...tnership-guide
    You say it like its a bad thing? TTIP will be an incentive for big business so it will create millions of jobs and bring wealth to the country. What we need is a proper leader to make sure it functions properly. Tony Blair is the best choice, he supports TTIP but will make sure the needs of the people are met. Cameron would not care and Corbyn will just be so anti-business that no jobs are created. Bring back Blair!
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    (Original post by Manchester_123)
    You say it like its a bad thing? TTIP will be an incentive for big business so it will create millions of jobs and bring wealth to the country. What we need is a proper leader to make sure it functions properly. Tony Blair is the best choice, he supports TTIP but will make sure the needs of the people are met. Cameron would not care and Corbyn will just be so anti-business that no jobs are created. Bring back Blair!
    Giving big business the power to sue democratically elected governments for compensation when the government passes and enforces laws they don't like is very clearly a terrible idea that will undermine democratic governments and give big business even more influence on governments than they already have. If you can't already see why this is a terrible idea then there's not much point in discussing this further.
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    (Original post by RF_PineMarten)
    Giving big business the power to sue democratically elected governments for compensation when the government passes and enforces laws they don't like is very clearly a terrible idea that will undermine democratic governments and give big business even more influence on governments than they already have. If you can't already see why this is a terrible idea then there's not much point in discussing this further.
    An idea is only terrible if it's implemented by the wrong people. If implemented by Cameron or Corbyn then maybe. But if Blair implemented it, I have faith he would do the best deal for the people
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    (Original post by Manchester_123)
    An idea is only terrible if it's implemented by the wrong people. If implemented by Cameron or Corbyn then maybe. But if Blair implemented it, I have faith he would do the best deal for the people
    The idea of giving businesses the power to sue governments for compensation when that government passes or enforces a law they don't like is inherently a terrible idea. There are loads of terrible ideas out there that are terrible ideas no matter who is implementing them.

    And Blair would probably do the best deal for himself.
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    (Original post by RF_PineMarten)
    The idea of giving businesses the power to sue governments for compensation when that government passes or enforces a law they don't like is inherently a terrible idea. There are loads of terrible ideas out there that are terrible ideas no matter who is implementing them.

    And Blair would probably do the best deal for himself.
    At least explain why Blair would serve himself only? From his record I would say otherwise
 
 
 
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